what u think about passive skill tree balance left and right side?

I think the only problem is evasion.

On the left side you have life nodes and STR which give both HP.
And you can use armour and endurance charges for damage reduction much more easily than on the right side.

The right side has less life nodes and Acrobatics, which is very strong but weakens armour, energy shield and blocking.
Evasion doesn't prevent you from being hit or reduces any damage if that happens.
And dying costs increasingly XP - that makes DEX and evasion weaker than STR and armour.

There should be a kind of damage reduction tied to evasion.

Ok give immune to phys to blood magick

"

Jerexil wrote:

There should be a kind of damage reduction tied to evasion.

1) There are several damage reduction mechanics in the game tied to Evasion, Wind Dancer being one, Wind Ward on the Deadeye Ascendancy being another. You also have several other sources of benefits from not being hit lately.

2) What a lot of people seem to ignore (or do not know), is that a high evasion rating also lower the chance of you recieving a crit when hit. A high evasion rating can downgrade a critical hit to a regular hit.

The most dangerous things come late game, are burst of damage/hits and crits. Evasion/dodge helps you evade most of those hits, and downgrade a lot of those hits from crits to regular hits. When you on top of that have reduced damage when not being hit lately - and a few sources of physical damage taken as elemental damage, you become pretty strong.

3) Raider is the second most played class on HC Expedition, and the third most played class in the gauntlet, which should tell us that EV-based defenses aren't that bad.

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I don't think damage reduction should be built into evasion at all. I do miss another life cluster on the right side of the tree. But the right side of the tree already have easier access to ailment immunity and speed, which both are VERY good defensive mechanics.

I think people percieve avoidance different from mitigation because it scales differently.

We do, however, need a green-based guard skill.

"

MasterTBC wrote:

Ok give immune to phys to blood magick

I ABSOLUTELY agree that Blood Magic needs some work in form of substantial buffs. But immunity to physical damage would make it OP as hell :P

"

Phrazz wrote:

3) Raider is the second most played class on HC Expedition, and the third most played class in the gauntlet, which should tell us that EV-based defenses aren't that bad.

this is beyond disingenuous. the gauntlet has separate rewards for every class so obviously there is real incentive to play even shit classes. not to mention the part where almost half of the entire ladder is playing glad.

"

yamface wrote:

"

Phrazz wrote:

3) Raider is the second most played class on HC Expedition, and the third most played class in the gauntlet, which should tell us that EV-based defenses aren't that bad.

this is beyond disingenuous. the gauntlet has separate rewards for every class so obviously there is real incentive to play even shit classes. not to mention the part where almost half of the entire ladder is playing glad.

Raider? A 'shit' class? Ok.

What about the regular HC? Isn't it kinda "disingenuous" of you to not address that point at all?

"

Phrazz wrote:

Raider? A 'shit' class? Ok.

What about the regular HC? Isn't it kinda "disingenuous" of you to not address that point at all?

What about hc? The fact that glad is still twice as played as raider? Or if you start filtering up higher levels that there's 4x more glads than raiders? Or the fact that all the top raiders in gauntlet are coincidentally dead?

If you think raider is that good, YOU go and play hc or gauntlet with it. The fact that a drox banner can randomly kill you defines how bad that class is.

"

yamface wrote:

What about hc? The fact that glad is still twice as played as raider? Or if you start filtering up higher levels that there's 4x more glads than raiders? Or the fact that all the top raiders in gauntlet are coincidentally dead?

If you think raider is that good, YOU go and play hc or gauntlet with it. The fact that a drox banner can randomly kill you defines how bad that class is.

I never said Raider "is that good". I never said Raider was better than Gladiator. You keep comparing it to Gladiator why? Because Gladiator is better? Sure, I'll agree with that. If you could read, I called Raider "pretty strong" and "not that bad", while you're calling the right side "pure garbage" and Raider "shit". Based on Gladiator being better?

Come one, have some nuance.

It's hard to do a 1:1 comparison of the two sides of the tree. They have an identity that is distinct, and further enhanced by the available classes of each side.

So looking at things in a vacuum like STR vs. DEX bonuses limits the discussion dramatically. There are down sides to the left side of the tree that are hard to overcome (do not read this as impossible).

An example might be critical strike builds on the left are not nearly as easy as the right side of the tree; especially if you're a caster. Resolute Technique pales heavily in comparison. But it also has Elemental Overload in a somewhat convenient spot, which does make base crit somewhat attractive for elemental builds; or at least offers a consolation prize while being able to stack strength.

The other thing to keep in mind is that I personally think strength based gems are significantly limited when compared to int and dex gems. I know that's kind of adjacent to the discussion, but it's still relevant at least in my experience.

If there was a significant problem that wasn't balanced by something else, you would see a dramatic shift from Ranger/Assassin to Marauder/Templar. I don't believe that is currently the case; largely because the benefits of that side of the tree outweighs some of the things that are compared in a 1:1 fashion.

"

Phrazz wrote:

"

yamface wrote:

What about hc? The fact that glad is still twice as played as raider? Or if you start filtering up higher levels that there's 4x more glads than raiders? Or the fact that all the top raiders in gauntlet are coincidentally dead?

If you think raider is that good, YOU go and play hc or gauntlet with it. The fact that a drox banner can randomly kill you defines how bad that class is.

I never said Raider "is that good".

You just got done telling me raider is strong HELLO. That [Removed by Support] class isnt the best even if glad was deleted. I don't know about you, but one of us actually plays hc and knows what is and isn't [Removed by Support].

Classes that are straight up better than raider:
guardian
elemntalist
tricktser
glad
chieftain
champion

just about any other class on the tree has something better than that [Removed by Support]

"

yamface wrote:

I don't know about you, but one of us actually plays hc and knows what is and isn't [Removed by Support].

Haha, there we have it.

Have a nice one, dude.