They don't have the evidence to convict the players that did it offstream. If they had, they would have done it.
They do have the evidence, and they did ban players/group(s) that did not stream. GGG collects a lot of data, and they post statistics from time to time which demonstrates this.
The only players that got banned were those that abused the exploit.
The players didn't cheat since they didn't do anything outside the programming of the game. The exploit was a mistake on the parts of the devs either due to error or lack of foresight.
Is this the part where GGG starts telling us if we don't play the game how they want we will get banned? Didn't you at least test the league mechanics before publishing out?
I don't know the players however I'm not going to stand by while fans of the game get banned for injustice. I feel that as a player that enjoys this game I need to speak out against bad actions taken against the player base.
This isn't an easy topic, but I agree. These players didn't know about the bug ahead of time, so malicious intent doesn't apply. It's also hard to judge someone as "trying to hurt the game" and "just knowingly or unknowingly taking advantage of a mistake".
The optics of this ban are mostly good, since other players would feel really bad about continuing to play and/or recommending PoE to others.
I'm pretty sure there isn't a TOS stipulation that says you can't take advantage of obviously broken mechanics, since the malicious intent can't be proven. Edit: There is no such stipulation.
Yes you're right, but the optics outweigh the 20 banned accounts I think.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
What is the value of my own life when it is taken from others so easily?
Last edited by Noble_Seiken#0706 on Apr 21, 2021, 1:27:45 AM
Right or wrong according to you or me, it doesn't matter. It is between the players that got banned and GGG, nobody else. Speculation doesn't change a thing about the facts and the facts are that these people abused an exploit that wasn't like finding a really strong build, this was much worse on the level of infinite duplications.
GGG has to crack down on people willing to abuse the game like this for personal gain, because if they don't, it might be an incentive for more players to try it. It's a message, among other things.
Just don't cheat. If you find anything that seems really broken or bugged, especially in regards to xp or currency, then report it immediately and avoid the bug if you can, until a hotfix is released. And no, you're not going to get a reward for reporting a major exploit, you just do it because it's the right thing to do for the health of the game, its community and its economy.
Carry on my waypoint son, there'll be peace when maps are done.
Lay your portal gem to rest, don't you die no more.
'Cause it's a bitter sweet symphony this league.
Try to make maps meet, you're a slave to the meta, then you leave.
The players didn't cheat since they didn't do anything outside the programming of the game. The exploit was a mistake on the parts of the devs either due to error or lack of foresight.
Is this the part where GGG starts telling us if we don't play the game how they want we will get banned? Didn't you at least test the league mechanics before publishing out?
"
Hornybull wrote:
I don't know the players however I'm not going to stand by while fans of the game get banned for injustice. I feel that as a player that enjoys this game I need to speak out against bad actions taken against the player base.
This isn't an easy topic, but I agree. These players didn't know about the bug ahead of time, so malicious intent doesn't apply. It's also hard to judge someone as "trying to hurt the game" and "just knowingly or unknowingly taking advantage of a mistake".
The optics of this ban are mostly good, since other players would feel really bad about continuing to play and/or recommending PoE to others.
I'm pretty sure there isn't a TOS stipulation that says you can't take advantage of obviously broken mechanics, since the malicious intent can't be proven. Edit: There is no such stipulation.
Yes you're right, but the optics outweigh the 20 banned accounts I think.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
This is a really straightforward topic.
You do not get banned for finding an exploit. You get banned for abusing them. Players/group(s) that did this without streaming got banned as well. I'm sure there would have been more than 20 players that triggered the exploit, but only those that were abusing it were banned.
You might ask yourself whether something is an exploit or intended, and I accept that the lines can be blurred at times. That isn't the case here. The exploit here resulted in effectively infinite loot. Go take a look at the footage of this exploit and then tell us what you think.
The players didn't cheat since they didn't do anything outside the programming of the game. The exploit was a mistake on the parts of the devs either due to error or lack of foresight.
Is this the part where GGG starts telling us if we don't play the game how they want we will get banned? Didn't you at least test the league mechanics before publishing out?
"
Hornybull wrote:
I don't know the players however I'm not going to stand by while fans of the game get banned for injustice. I feel that as a player that enjoys this game I need to speak out against bad actions taken against the player base.
This isn't an easy topic, but I agree. These players didn't know about the bug ahead of time, so malicious intent doesn't apply. It's also hard to judge someone as "trying to hurt the game" and "just knowingly or unknowingly taking advantage of a mistake".
The optics of this ban are mostly good, since other players would feel really bad about continuing to play and/or recommending PoE to others.
I'm pretty sure there isn't a TOS stipulation that says you can't take advantage of obviously broken mechanics, since the malicious intent can't be proven. Edit: There is no such stipulation.
Yes you're right, but the optics outweigh the 20 banned accounts I think.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
This is a really straightforward topic.
You do not get banned for finding an exploit. You get banned for abusing them. Players/group(s) that did this without streaming got banned as well. I'm sure there would have been more than 20 players that triggered the exploit, but only those that were abusing it were banned.
You might ask yourself whether something is an exploit or intended, and I accept that the lines can be blurred at times. That isn't the case here. The exploit here resulted in effectively infinite loot. Go take a look at the footage of this exploit and then tell us what you think.
Yea, I get it. I'm not sure why you think I'm disagreeing with you.
What is the value of my own life when it is taken from others so easily?
The players didn't cheat since they didn't do anything outside the programming of the game. The exploit was a mistake on the parts of the devs either due to error or lack of foresight.
Is this the part where GGG starts telling us if we don't play the game how they want we will get banned? Didn't you at least test the league mechanics before publishing out?
"
Hornybull wrote:
I don't know the players however I'm not going to stand by while fans of the game get banned for injustice. I feel that as a player that enjoys this game I need to speak out against bad actions taken against the player base.
This isn't an easy topic, but I agree. These players didn't know about the bug ahead of time, so malicious intent doesn't apply. It's also hard to judge someone as "trying to hurt the game" and "just knowingly or unknowingly taking advantage of a mistake".
The optics of this ban are mostly good, since other players would feel really bad about continuing to play and/or recommending PoE to others.
I'm pretty sure there isn't a TOS stipulation that says you can't take advantage of obviously broken mechanics, since the malicious intent can't be proven. Edit: There is no such stipulation.
Yes you're right, but the optics outweigh the 20 banned accounts I think.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
This is a really straightforward topic.
You do not get banned for finding an exploit. You get banned for abusing them. Players/group(s) that did this without streaming got banned as well. I'm sure there would have been more than 20 players that triggered the exploit, but only those that were abusing it were banned.
You might ask yourself whether something is an exploit or intended, and I accept that the lines can be blurred at times. That isn't the case here. The exploit here resulted in effectively infinite loot. Go take a look at the footage of this exploit and then tell us what you think.
When I say one side outweighs the other, I mean HEAVILY outweighs the other. Knowingly abusing bugs is an unwritten rule and probably ZERO of those banned were innocently doing it.
Sorry for saying this "isn't easy". It's an obvious decision, but not "easy" to explain.
I made it seem closer to a 50-50 judgement when it's closer to a >99 - <1 one.
What is the value of my own life when it is taken from others so easily?
Last edited by Noble_Seiken#0706 on Apr 21, 2021, 2:10:19 AM
I still don't get it. The devs messed up and included something unwanted in the game and players found it. This isn't the player's fault and shouldn't get punish for something that's in the game.
How many of these players thought that maybe they found a more efficient way to grind?
Maybe they thought it was part of the game?
So the standard is to assume guilt and not innocence these days?
I still don't get it. The devs messed up and included something unwanted in the game and players found it. This isn't the player's fault and shouldn't get punish for something that's in the game.
How many of these players thought that maybe they found a more efficient way to grind?
Maybe they thought it was part of the game?
So the standard is to assume guilt and not innocence these days?
The innocence/guilt ratio here is probably really far from 50/50. Not abusing bugs is an "unwritten rule" and has to be enforced based on estimating this guilt/innocence ratio.
It's not perfect, but I think it had to be done for the reasons I listed above.
What is the value of my own life when it is taken from others so easily?
