Is 3.13 realy delayed only because Cyberpunk ?

Meanwhile both Wolcen and Last Epoch quietly drop huge, expansion-level updates for free within a week of Cyberpunk 2077's release. What do they have to fear? They're both buy-to-play and know that an unrelated game, regardless of its popularity, affects their trajectories as niche ARPGs very little. And as a fan of niche ARPGs, I find this very comforting.

But PoE is at the big table now, relying on streamer content and massive amounts of free to play cash to stay profitable. Sure, it's one of the smallest chairs, but still. I do think that it has a lot to lose releasing at the same time as Cyberpunk 2077, and I think the gambit to outright admit it won them some easy journo brownie points, but journos aren't as keyed in to the situation as Exiles. They just see 'honesty!11!11(and an eff bomb!)' as refreshing and praiseworthy. Those of us who've been around this block a dozen times or more know that carefully-calibrated 'transparency' can sometimes just be another form of obfuscation. OTOH they could have 'lied' and said it was about polishing upcoming content and pulling away from the largely condemned league deployment schedule -- who'd have been the wiser? Until said content drops and it's still problematic, at which point 'LOL DELAY WAS A WASTE' would be the salty flavour of the day.

I think at this point, if we look past the mere money factor, TencentGGG can't win now. They have a rabid, devoted fanbase with very demanding expectations and standards. PoE's a high stakes game now, has been for a while. You can't just do your own thing when you're part of the bigger game, whether you're a competitive PoE racer or a relatively small development studio with precisely one egg and one basket, at least as far as products are concerned.

So fuck it, why not just admit that another game affects your release schedule? Is this going to impact support pack sales? Probably not. Is it going to affect whether or not entrenched Exiles play the next league? Probably not. Does it tarnish the company's image? Definitely not -- see above re: honesty. So while I don't think TencentGGG can win as regards pleasing its fanbase to a point where staff aren't regularly targeted for blame-placing, I do think they're at least in a position where they can deprioritise that fanbase's immediate satisfaction and approval. The mewling of the addict mean so little to the dealer with the best shit in town. Only an idiot can't see who has the power in that relationship.

I, for one, was pleased that Chris posted what and how he did.
This time of year always takes away from my playing time (kids, job, etc.) so this is a good thing, in my opinion.

"

Fundamentally, most consumers are self-centred ignorant sheep so they are not well placed to make an appropriate business decision on behalf of a company.

Love this, Aldora, well said.

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DoubleU wrote:

"

Fundamentally, most consumers are self-centred ignorant sheep so they are not well placed to make an appropriate business decision on behalf of a company.

Love this, Aldora, well said.

I take umbrage at the choice of words. It's more that most of us have other things on our mind, prioritised by what we feel is an order of importance to personal needs and desires. That doesn't make a person a sheep. That makes a person human. No person is a sheep, even though on occasion we can seem like it because, again, our priorities aren't aligned with those of others.

When a person is a consumer, they should be able to trust the product to a point where they don't have to know that product as intimately as those who make or sell it. That's the implicit pact of good trade -- enforced, naturally, by all sorts of agencies, consumer watchdogs, review aggregates, and the like.

And the opposite of what Aldora posited isn't the opposite of a self-centred, ignorant sheep. Whatever that might be.

The only part that was true was the last bit, but it's sort of...obvious really. We can make commentary from our perspectives, are indeed well within our rights to do so, but we don't run these companies. We don't make these decisions. And if we did, I'm sure we'd make just as any mistakes and missteps worthy of commentary and derision.

No, it was just a disagreeably unpleasant thing to say that oversimplifies things to an untenable degree. Leave the word 'sheep' to the manchildren who still think The Matrix is somehow deep and profound but don't realise they're being laughably shallow in their teen-angst level othering.

Let us say then, from the perspective of someone who has dealt with the purchasing public for well over 30 years, that "most consumers are are not well placed to make an appropriate business decision on behalf of a company".
That and they can be bloody ignorant as well.
The sheep part is a bit over done to be sure.

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DoubleU wrote:

Let us say then, from the perspective of someone who has dealt with the purchasing public for well over 30 years, that "most consumers are are not well placed to make an appropriate business decision on behalf of a company".
That and they can be bloody ignorant as well.
The sheep part is a bit over done to be sure.

Absolutely. My thankfully brief stint in customer service at a computer shop (back when such existed!) made me very quickly despise people in general. But afterwards, I'd sit myself down and think, it's not their job to know these things inside out. It's mine. Who the fuck knows what their job is? That's their concern, not mine. :)

But to pull this back on-topic, this is partly on GGG for being traditionally transparent and engaging with the playerbase from the start. They invited this relationship; they encouraged our opinion. We all know that's changed now, but it can be hard to realise just how much sometimes.

And having seen behind the curtain a little, I'll tell you now: I'd choose ignorance and impotent rage/mockery/scorn at their seeming incompetence than limited knowledge and trying to reconcile that with their seeming incompetence any day of the week. But that's the same blissful haven chosen by those who throw the word 'sheep' around too glibly, really. Hard to remain gleefully spiteful and judgmental when you know the other person's story, especially when that story makes a lot of sense in context (as I think the Cyberpunk 2077 delay does -- it's just a complicated, messy context). This is, of course, just a variation on an ancient theme, as old as handshakes and the question, 'who are you?'

Lmfao wolcen is dogshit so is last epoch

The delayed it because all the devS want to play it

Simple as that

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RitualMurder wrote:

Lmfao wolcen is dogshit so is last epoch

The delayed it because all the devS want to play it

Simple as that

First sentence: irrelevant and subjective
Second sentence: vapid speculation
Third sentence: Excellent example of that 'ignorance is bliss' thing I was talking about

Thanks for playing.

I stand by my statement but will qualify it somewhat by stating that it wasn't intended maliciously.

I'm thinking in a very generic sense, not POE focussed at all. You have people paying $100 for a simple t-shirt because it has a company logo on it (let me get this right, you want to charge me a ridiculous amount for a t-shirt and then be your walking brand billboard? That's some quality marketing right there!), or they buy the $10 kettle from K-Mart, not considering that you can't ethically sell such an item for that price, that somewhere in the chain a human being is being exploited.

People pay $1k for a new phone each year just so they have the latest model. We drive diesel vehicles due a tax loophole that makes the fuel cheaper, but overall it's worse for the environment and human health. We produce cheap throw-away clothing and don't consider the full impact of microplastics on the environment because we need to stay fashionable.

No I don't expect consumers to know the detailed specification of an item, but screaming at the customer service person because the store doesn't have any item X in stock is futile and unacceptable.

We buy fat free but full of sugar, sugar free but loaded with fat, sports drinks for those that barely break a sweat, people even pay for water (this is a close second behind billboard t-shirts - convincing people to pay for something they can get for free and Coke are raking in the profit).

If people weren't easily lead we wouldn't have the marketing saturation that does exist.

Brawndo, it's got what plants crave.

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Aldora_the_Summoner wrote:

I stand by my statement but will qualify it somewhat by stating that it wasn't intended maliciously.

I'm thinking in a very generic sense, not POE focussed at all. You have people paying $100 for a simple t-shirt because it has a company logo on it (let me get this right, you want to charge me a ridiculous amount for a t-shirt and then be your walking brand billboard? That's some quality marketing right there!), or they buy the $10 kettle from K-Mart, not considering that you can't ethically sell such an item for that price, that somewhere in the chain a human being is being exploited.

People pay $1k for a new phone each year just so they have the latest model. We drive diesel vehicles due a tax loophole that makes the fuel cheaper, but overall it's worse for the environment and human health. We produce cheap throw-away clothing and don't consider the full impact of microplastics on the environment because we need to stay fashionable.

No I don't expect consumers to know the detailed specification of an item, but screaming at the customer service person because the store doesn't have any item X in stock is futile and unacceptable.

We buy fat free but full of sugar, sugar free but loaded with fat, sports drinks for those that barely break a sweat, people even pay for water (this is a close second behind billboard t-shirts - convincing people to pay for something they can get for free and Coke are raking in the profit).

If people weren't easily lead we wouldn't have the marketing saturation that does exist.

Brawndo, it's got what plants crave.

Nah you were right, no need to qualify it. There's a reason we're headed towards idiocracy/brave new world/1984, and it ain't because people are wolves.

yeah and streamers.