Introduce something like trade-ban

Leaving bots problem, there is another very big problem - people, who say they will sell an item, but they aren't gouing to sell it at all from the moment they listed it! So you need to message 10-20 people for anyone to reply.
Then you go and copy-pasting buy messages in a stream just tab-copy-tab-paste-enter.
At one moment real traders see it and you get 5 invites. Of course you ignore 4 of them and seller thinks - what the fuck just was?

What I suggest - introduce a trade-ban:
* in a trade-ban all your public tabs behaves like they are private, they are
not listed in trade or api.
* in a trade-ban you cannot trade with anyone, you have not trade button, anyone who tries to trade with you get "player is trade-banned" message

Conditions for trade-ban:
* when you ignore some trade messages in a row for example 10
* messages in dnd or afk mod does not count
* it stays for a week or so.

So people will not place that they are selling 1c item anymore, because they don't want to get a trade-ban and lose ability to sell their 20-30c items for a week.

Downside here is a bots promlem, as they can just overspam anyone.

"

RedTEXHIK wrote:

Leaving bots problem, there is another very big problem - people, who say they will sell an item, but they aren't gouing to sell it at all from the moment they listed it! So you need to message 10-20 people for anyone to reply.
Then you go and copy-pasting buy messages in a stream just tab-copy-tab-paste-enter.
At one moment real traders see it and you get 5 invites. Of course you ignore 4 of them and seller thinks - what the fuck just was?

What I suggest - introduce a trade-ban:
* in a trade-ban all your public tabs behaves like they are private, they are
not listed in trade or api.
* in a trade-ban you cannot trade with anyone, you have not trade button, anyone who tries to trade with you get "player is trade-banned" message

Conditions for trade-ban:
* when you ignore some trade messages in a row for example 10
* messages in dnd or afk mod does not count
* it stays for a week or so.

So people will not place that they are selling 1c item anymore, because they don't want to get a trade-ban and lose ability to sell their 20-30c items for a week.

Downside here is a bots promlem, as they can just overspam anyone.

As frustrating as the current system is, no one is going to even remotely entertain this idea.

False listings make up a tiny fraction of the actual unanswered trade messages.

The silent treatment you get is almost always the result of:

- The trader doing something that's far more important to them than the 1c item you are spamming them for.
- The inherent lag in the trading site / abuse by assholes flooding it with requests while they troll for cheap sales with custom tools that leads to listing persisting long after the item leaves the inventory.
- You lowballing the seller.
- You offering currency they aren't interested in accepting.
- Them being a human who's purpose isn't to facilitate your fun by delivering this item when YOU want it. AKA them being afk.

Until this game has a system where sales listings are enforced and allows for indirect trading these issues will always be there. So best advice is suck it up and move on.

"

Ageless_Emperion wrote:

- The trader doing something that's far more important to them than the 1c item you are spamming them for.

This means you never ever going to to this trade. THIS is the problem - you think that anything you are doing is more important, than
hundreds of people waiting for 20 "traders" to reply! You either reply that you in map/lab/anything and will trade after some time, so buyer will know that you will trade after 1/2/5/10 minutes or just remove the fucking item from sell tab and do not saying that you want to trade it while you realy don't.

"

Ageless_Emperion wrote:

- The inherent lag in the trading site / abuse by assholes flooding it with requests while they troll for cheap sales with custom tools that leads to listing persisting long after the item leaves the inventory.

Good point. Possible solution here - change official trade button behaviour from copying message to sending it. And only check trade messages from official trades, as they can be easily detected then.

"

Ageless_Emperion wrote:

- You lowballing the seller.

Not sure if I get your point here, but if you mean pricefixers here - it's very good if they will be trade-banned and leave the trade.

"

Ageless_Emperion wrote:

- You offering currency they aren't interested in accepting.

So if you want to sell - REPLY ABOUT IT! An we will offer what you want or reach an agreement in any other way. Or again just remove the fucking item if you not interested in selling it.

This league buyers tested my patience alot.

I ended up blocking and ignoring several of people that made me leave my maps or rush my heist to sell them only to find out that they didnt wait or even after they gave me their word that they are waiting they were lying.

As seller my patience got too far tested on this league not only from those kind of people but also scammers.

If you're suggesting to punish the sellers I will counter suggest to punish the buyers as well.

"

Xystre wrote:

This league buyers tested my patience alot.

I ended up blocking and ignoring several of people that made me leave my maps or rush my heist to sell them only to find out that they didnt wait or even after they gave me their word that they are waiting they were lying.

As seller my patience got too far tested on this league not only from those kind of people but also scammers.

If you're suggesting to punish the sellers I will counter suggest to punish the buyers as well.

There two problems here. First is bots... Can't say anything really good here, but I personally ask every suspicious trader if he is a human, and than report and ignore if no reply. But yes, they are countless.
About real peoples, that I asked to wait - haven't encounter your problem.

"

RedTEXHIK wrote:

"

Ageless_Emperion wrote:

- The trader doing something that's far more important to them than the 1c item you are spamming them for.

This means you never ever going to to this trade. THIS is the problem - you think that anything you are doing is more important, than
hundreds of people waiting for 20 "traders" to reply! You either reply that you in map/lab/anything and will trade after some time, so buyer will know that you will trade after 1/2/5/10 minutes or just remove the fucking item from sell tab and do not saying that you want to trade it while you realy don't.

i frequently ignore trade requests and YOU wont tell me what to do. sorry.

reasons are a plenty, im in a delve (if i start typing, i die - thus i wont bother), im in a nice beyond/delirium map (if i start typing, fog moves away), i just happen to not be in mood for trading, im trying to buy something myself and if i trade with you i might mess my own trade (more important to me).. the list goes on

if you want a merchant, vendor or seller that is ready to do EVERYTHING you want, WHENEVER you want - try Navali. altho i hear her prices are not that great

GGG made a trade system based around gross concept of 'tedium as currency'. significant part of playerbase interacts with it only when they HAVE to. and they dont HAVE to trade with you in that precise point of time.

and no, asking them to reply, explain or excuse to you, relist items etc - no, just no. i do not want to be bothered with that, ask GGG to finally bring us into 2020 with a proper, modern async trade system.

"

RedTEXHIK wrote:

This means you never ever going to do this trade.

1. Don't fucking assume for me how I do or don't something.
2. This is probably going to blow your mind, but I actually sell most things I list because I price them fairly and only sell things I tend to be bothered to interrupt myself for.

"

RedTEXHIK wrote:

THIS is the problem - you think that anything you are doing is more important, than hundreds of people waiting for 20 "traders" to reply!

Oh no no no no, I don't just think its more important, I KNOW IT IS, not only that, but it is actually an IMMUTABLE FACT that it is. Wanna know why? It cause' you and everyone of those hundreds of people are just background characters in my life and I am not obligated by ANYTHING to facilitate your fun, success or anything else you feel entitled to.

"

RedTEXHIK wrote:

You either reply that you in map/lab/anything and will trade after some time, so buyer will know that you will trade after 1/2/5/10 minutes or just remove the fucking item from sell tab and do not saying that you want to trade it while you realy don't.

As sidtherat has politely pointed out, replying in most situations = death / loss of progress. So people don't. If you think that people should die / lose progress to service you, then I got a mighty revelation for you man, you are an entitled prick.

Personally I try to respond to people, it is not always possible and when the 50th bot messages me for that fucking Pernadus Blazon I sold an hour ago it tends to rob me of my good will. Sometimes I am tired, sometimes I don't want to be bothered, but that doesn't somehow change the intent behind me wanting to sell something.

"

RedTEXHIK wrote:

Good point. Possible solution here - change official trade button behaviour from copying message to sending it. And only check trade messages from official trades, as they can be easily detected then.

Its a good point, not at all for the reason you are assuming. Furthermore for someone who has a lot of problems with trade you have next to no understanding of the system that is behind it. You need to educate yourself on that before you come up with more of your 'solutions'. Oh and before you ask, no, I won't explain it to you. I wouldn't dream of robbing you of an opportunity to better yourself by your own merit.

"

RedTEXHIK wrote:

Not sure if I get your point here, but if you mean pricefixers here - it's very good if they will be trade-banned and leave the trade.

Lowballing is a synonym for making a shit offer.
You offer people shit, they'll just ignore you.

"

RedTEXHIK wrote:

So if you want to sell - REPLY ABOUT IT! An we will offer what you want or reach an agreement in any other way. Or again just remove the fucking item if you not interested in selling it.

We've been through this, I'll reply when I can AND feel like it. Also you know what, I like the silent treatment I get from people. It sure beats the multiple cases of extreme harassment and outright death threats / harm against my family I've gotten over the years when I tried to engage people in bartering over an item.

"

RedTEXHIK wrote:

There two problems here. First is bots... Can't say anything really good here, but I personally ask every suspicious trader if he is a human, and than report and ignore if no reply. But yes, they are countless.
About real peoples, that I asked to wait - haven't encounter your problem.

1. Most people will think you are some sort of freak or troll if you ask them if they are human.
2. You are literally breaking TOS by doing what you are doing, you know there are penalties for the exact thing you are doing.
3. Cool that you haven't encountered the 'problem' that is a major contributor to the passive attitude people have towards trade.

In closing, we have all struggled with the trading system in this game and there are very concrete reasons for why it is the way it is. If you want change, campaign for an asynchronous trading system instead of this idiotic and very easily exploitable ban bullshit that petty, self-centered and spiteful people would immediately ruin.

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sidtherat wrote:

reasons are a plenty, im in a delve (if i start typing, i die - thus i wont bother), im in a nice beyond/delirium map (if i start typing, fog moves away), i just happen to not be in mood for trading, im trying to buy something myself and if i trade with you i might mess my own trade (more important to me).. the list goes on

You NEVER get in this situations by accident. You always know that you are gouing to delve ore opening any map. If you don't want to trade while doing it - there are FOUR symbols command:
/dnd

Your position about you not bother anout anyone else is similar to when you come into a supermarket just before rush hour and see there is only one man in queue - so you take bread, go to queue and after cashier started to summ up your bread, you sudenly run for all other thing you need. Why? because it's comfortable for you and you don't bother anyone else, it's faster cause you know that queue will become bigger after 20 minutes, and you don't want to be in queue.

Looks, like you never seen 40+ unanswered tries to buy something.

"

Ageless_Emperion wrote:

1. Most people will think you are some sort of freak or troll if you ask them if they are human.

At first - most players know about bots problem and likely to anderstand purpose of question. At second - no matter what they think, they will reply at least with "wtf is going on?", because of curiosity.

"

Ageless_Emperion wrote:

2. You are literally breaking TOS by doing what you are doing, you know there are penalties for the exact thing you are doing.

I'm not breaking ToS by reporting, that it seems like someone IS breaking it by using 3rd party software

Pointless reports like that will end up getting your report functionality removed in-game. Just sayin...

Edit: use the ignore function on the official trade site. Eventually it gets to the point where you get instant responses almost all the time. *shrugs*