Actual crafting not being added to the game immediately. Massive dissapointment.

Crafting needs a complete redesign like really bad but I wonder if they are dropping the flag for that until poe2 endgame.

Regardless it's so bad right now if people is praising harvest as amazing because the normal crafting in this game is just broken..

It's going to be a really rough awakening for some of you the next league to play the game and going back to the same system..

"

Hasunic wrote:

I've played 6 days and 15 hours this league. I was level 100 after 5 days dude.

I tried the game in 2013, but I didnt realy start playing untill harbinger league.

I have a full time job, a wife and a son aswell :)

That means you've really optimized your playstyle. Again, that's great for you. I don't know how much I'd have to play my way to ever get to 100. Certainly more than I'm willing to, because I take it slowly, fully clear areas, pick up and ID rares, etc...
Guess I play in a way which no longer suits the clear speed style of modern PoE. So for me, harvest crafting was a god send.
I believe that this makes me more of an average player, while you are in the absolute top bracket of players.

As sucha player:
Did you enjoy or hate the crafting in harvest? Do you find it to easy? Would it still be too easy if players weren't allowed to trade for seeds? (You obviously didn't, but I'm sure you can judge nonetheless). Your gear isn't mirror worthy, it's just gretty damn good. Do you feel it was too easy to get?

I'm still not clear on what point you're making regarding the thread topic...

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Hasunic wrote:

I've played 6 days and 15 hours this league. I was level 100 after 5 days dude.

Not gonna lie, that's pretty fuckin impressive! Especially for SSF.
Damn.

"

SisterBlister wrote:

As sucha player:
Did you enjoy or hate the crafting in harvest? Do you find it to easy? Would it still be too easy if players weren't allowed to trade for seeds? (You obviously didn't, but I'm sure you can judge nonetheless). Your gear isn't mirror worthy, it's just gretty damn good. Do you feel it was too easy to get?

I'm still not clear on what point you're making regarding the thread topic...

Considering the amount of power each item could gain, and you don't need that amount of power in the game, yes.

I did enjoy perfecting all my items, but it's going to brick the game in the long run.

You don't need to trade for seeds, if you use your blossoms correctly.

The gear isn't mirror worthy in this league, but any other league it would be up there, because it's full T1 on all slots of useable stats.


I am saying, that we already have a pretty decent way of crafting using fossils and metacrafts, while retaining some of the rng that's good for the genre.

If seedcrafting stays in the game, all the excitement of picking up a rare and ID'ing will be removed, same goes for lucky crafts and you will end up having a cookie-clicker.

Edit: But I will add, that I am sad that GGG removed many mods craftable by fossils and put them on influenced gear / removed them.

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Gulch wrote:

Not gonna lie, that's pretty fuckin impressive! Especially for SSF.
Damn.

Thanks! But it's not that hard. Just open a new map everytime you close one.

Personally I always read all the challenges the day they are revealed, so I know which bosses I need to do a challenge on the first time I face them, lol. but that's just me

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SisterBlister wrote:

"

Hasunic wrote:

Crafting with Fossils / Essences / awakener orb / alt regal + multimod are still very viable.

But only if you trade for the materials.
I haven't found a single essence monster I could corrupt to one of the desirable essences, for example. And multimodding? I have found 2 exalts this whole league. If it weren't for the garden, I wouldn't have crafted anything this league, as usual.
Gamble-crafting is just waaaaay too expensive for people who don't enjoy trading or play PoE as a job. And if you don't mind trading, then you don't need to be able to craft gear and we're back to "gather currency so you can buy the gear you'll never find yourself". Jeezus, that sucks in a loot-lust game!

Wow, trading in an online aRPG??

The horror!!

"

girng wrote:

"

SisterBlister wrote:

"

Hasunic wrote:

Crafting with Fossils / Essences / awakener orb / alt regal + multimod are still very viable.

But only if you trade for the materials.
I haven't found a single essence monster I could corrupt to one of the desirable essences, for example. And multimodding? I have found 2 exalts this whole league. If it weren't for the garden, I wouldn't have crafted anything this league, as usual.
Gamble-crafting is just waaaaay too expensive for people who don't enjoy trading or play PoE as a job. And if you don't mind trading, then you don't need to be able to craft gear and we're back to "gather currency so you can buy the gear you'll never find yourself". Jeezus, that sucks in a loot-lust game!

Wow, trading in an online aRPG??

The horror!!

Don't be snide. Trade is important, but should not be as powerful as it is right now. It is sooooo much more powerful than monster drops or even crafting that the whole loot-lust aspect of this RPG is lost.
Dunno how to fix that, maybe making the special crafting mats like essences and seeds untradeable? No easy solutions there...

You should not see every issue as black vs white, it's in the grey areas that life shines most brightly.

"

SisterBlister wrote:

Don't be snide. Trade is important, but should not be as powerful as it is right now. It is sooooo much more powerful than monster drops or even crafting that the whole loot-lust aspect of this RPG is lost.
Dunno how to fix that, maybe making the special crafting mats like essences and seeds untradeable? No easy solutions there...

You should not see every issue as black vs white, it's in the grey areas that life shines most brightly.

The developers have no power on how "powerful trade" can be, players are. Also, IIRC Chris is not in support of bounded items or other untradeable crap.

"

Hasunic wrote:

I am saying, that we already have a pretty decent way of crafting using fossils and metacrafts, while retaining some of the rng that's good for the genre.

If seedcrafting stays in the game, all the excitement of picking up a rare and ID'ing will be removed, same goes for lucky crafts and you will end up having a cookie-clicker.

To be fair I think that playing SSF doesn't give you as clear a picture on how poor crafting is in a trade league. If your currency is worthless other than crafting purposes and crafting is your only means of acquiring the rares you need then I am sure it is fine but you do not have to contend with the opportunity cost that goes with core poe crafting in trade leagues.

As a silly example : If you want a rare item and you have a 1 in 100 chance of crafting it with a certain method and each attempt costs you approx. 1 chaos orb but you can simply buy the intended result for 5 chaos orbs then there really is little reason to attempt it. This is what core poe crafting to me is in a nutshell.

Crafting is linked to a free market. Basic rule here is that given perfect information and easy access to the crafting all profit will be reduced to zero. Take my previous example : if that same crafted rare would cost say 1000 chaos orbs to buy but have a 1 in 100 chance for 1 chaos per pop to craft it then innevitably more and more people will craft said item until the price drops below the average cost of crafting it at which point it becomes more interesting to simply buy it.

This is why crafting in trade leagues simply doesn't work and hardly gets used. The only crafting that exists is crafting that is gated from the free market by rare bases or cost of entry (ie not everyone can burn 100 exalts attempting to craft a mirror tier item )or crafting early on that is cheap for levelling.

Harvest actually made crafting worth doing in trade league. It also encouraged me to interact with other crafting methods such as essences, delves, guardian exalted orbs etc etc because I knew that I could use my garden to polish the mediocre results where these would previously be absolutely worthless. I am picking up more rares than before because I can take a mediocre rare and turn it into multiple ex. items in the garden. I am picking up certain white bases etc..

If the design goal of poe is not to trade but to craft and create your own gear then this type of crafting needs to exist in trade leagues. If it doesn't then the crafting juice simply isn't worth the squeeze due to free market mechanics. This is an economic reality that will exist as long as the resources used to craft have an opportunity cost that outweighs the expected return.

That being said I do think it important that it doesn't disrupt SSF in such a way that it removes the challenge and fun from it. Clearly Harvest is a bit much so we need a less potent version but womehow poe needs to implement something similar long term.

"

Impiousbe wrote:

This is why crafting in trade leagues simply doesn't work and hardly gets used. The only crafting that exists is crafting that is gated from the free market by rare bases or cost of entry (ie not everyone can burn 100 exalts attempting to craft a mirror tier item )or crafting early on that is cheap for levelling.

Due to ppl believing this, I made over 10 mirrors in delirium league with a mix of running maps and crafting. I didnt flip a single item.

It's definetly going to suck going back to what we had. I hope it doesn't take them years to bring this back in some version. There where parts of harvest crafting that didn't break the game but allowed players to work towards decent upgrades.

I think being able to target craft special mods from shaper/elder/conq should probably be disabled. You should have to engage with the exalts for that.

There should be some special mods that only appear on items similar to incursion. So that you have scour it you lose the mod and can't get it back. Whether this be pre identified items or items gaining a bonus when identified is up in the air.

If you do something like this, crafting would be fine. I believe that is the direction they will be going just hopefully like I said, not years from now.