Stacking Mana as a defense vs life and energy shield.

... How would a full life build facetank something that a high mana MoM build can't facetank, when the MoM build will generally have a higher ehp?

Just because you haven't seen it, doesn't mean its not there.

You can get 50% MoM pretty easily on most builds if you use Cloak, which means that your life is effectively doubled, as long as you have enough mana/mana sustain.

If you combine Agnostic + 50% MoM + 2-3k mana regen + ~4-4.5k life, you have a VERY tanky build. That ends up being a 9k ehp build with life "regen" in the 1000's, without even starting on life regen, or leech.

Again, mana is not supposed to take all the damage for you, it is there to take some of it (when you try to), and it is currently doing that well.

"

Nubman wrote:

... How would a full life build facetank something that a high mana MoM build can't facetank, when the MoM build will generally have a higher ehp?

Just because you haven't seen it, doesn't mean its not there.

You can get 50% MoM pretty easily on most builds if you use Cloak, which means that your life is effectively doubled, as long as you have enough mana/mana sustain.

If you combine Agnostic + 50% MoM + 2-3k mana regen + ~4-4.5k life, you have a VERY tanky build. That ends up being a 9k ehp build with life "regen" in the 1000's, without even starting on life regen, or leech.

Again, mana is not supposed to take all the damage for you, it is there to take some of it (when you try to), and it is currently doing that well.

LMAO you're really delusional to even think MOM build have a higher ehp compared to life/es builds. When we're talking about EHP, damage MITIGATION will comes into place through auras or resource leech/gain and other forms.


Mana builds cannot stack multiple auras like life or es builds or they die easily. And while spending huge loads of mana, you cannot INSTANT get back the mana while casting using archmage, leaving little defense when something hits you while casting.
And mana leech is shitty.
And only way mana users can get their maximum mana regenerated is through cloak of defiance which is a shitty 1%.
SO many drawbacks.

Why MOM builds can't facetank sirus a8 die beam? because limited auras for damage mitigation, insufficient leech/gain available to it, and spending huge archmage mana while casting and tanking with no instant mana recovery at that point in time. Simple stuff.

Source just 1 proof pure mana builds face-tanking sirus a8 beam since you insinuated there is?

"

Ozxell wrote:

from those 3 resources, only mana can increase your damage and it increases by a lot.

Wrong, not anymore with anoints.

why are you even bringing this up? Its like thinking all the herald skills are going to be destroyed because of herald stackers it isn't even related to the problem.

Its interaction with brand recall is the only area its a problem, if anything the rest needs a buff its only suitable for ignite.

Basically you fall into 1 of 2 camps, either you are attempting to protect extremely busted +4000 flat damage stormbrand, in which case your fucked or your trying to protect archmage for literally everything else in which case your fine.

"

YoursTruly86 wrote:

"

Nubman wrote:

... How would a full life build facetank something that a high mana MoM build can't facetank, when the MoM build will generally have a higher ehp?

Just because you haven't seen it, doesn't mean its not there.

You can get 50% MoM pretty easily on most builds if you use Cloak, which means that your life is effectively doubled, as long as you have enough mana/mana sustain.

If you combine Agnostic + 50% MoM + 2-3k mana regen + ~4-4.5k life, you have a VERY tanky build. That ends up being a 9k ehp build with life "regen" in the 1000's, without even starting on life regen, or leech.

Again, mana is not supposed to take all the damage for you, it is there to take some of it (when you try to), and it is currently doing that well.

LMAO you're really delusional to even think MOM build have a higher ehp compared to life/es builds. When we're talking about EHP, damage MITIGATION will comes into place through auras or resource leech/gain and other forms.


Mana builds cannot stack multiple auras like life or es builds or they die easily. And while spending huge loads of mana, you cannot INSTANT get back the mana while casting using archmage, leaving little defense when something hits you while casting.
And mana leech is shitty.
And only way mana users can get their maximum mana regenerated is through cloak of defiance which is a shitty 1%.
SO many drawbacks.

Why MOM builds can't facetank sirus a8 die beam? because limited auras for damage mitigation, insufficient leech/gain available to it, and spending huge archmage mana while casting and tanking with no instant mana recovery at that point in time. Simple stuff.

Source just 1 proof pure mana builds face-tanking sirus a8 beam since you insinuated there is?

YOu know if you decide to go archamge you get this situation. If you decide to go Indigon you will not have it.

You are taking a build with advantage and disadvantage and crying injustice.
Switch to indigon if you don t like spending half your pool in 1 take. You are responsible for building around archmage in a way that become problematic for your defenses. Not all mana builds are archamge.

What you are asking is eliminate a disadvantage to suit your build.

Yes indigon mana mom can facetank sirus beam , Your archmage one can t. Decide your path and stop complaining about decisions you ve made. It is not a problem on mana build it is a problem about building around archmage.

"

Draegnarrr wrote:

why are you even bringing this up? Its like thinking all the herald skills are going to be destroyed because of herald stackers it isn't even related to the problem.

Its interaction with brand recall is the only area its a problem, if anything the rest needs a buff its only suitable for ignite.

Basically you fall into 1 of 2 camps, either you are attempting to protect extremely busted +4000 flat damage stormbrand, in which case your fucked or your trying to protect archmage for literally everything else in which case your fine.

do you need some help trying to understand what the main topic is? its about mana vs life/es as a defense... because it seemed that you fall into 2 camps too. 1 do not understand what the main topic but creates nothing but trash input or 2, you understand what the main topic is but creates trash input anyway.

"

lolozori wrote:

"

YoursTruly86 wrote:

"

Nubman wrote:

... How would a full life build facetank something that a high mana MoM build can't facetank, when the MoM build will generally have a higher ehp?

Just because you haven't seen it, doesn't mean its not there.

You can get 50% MoM pretty easily on most builds if you use Cloak, which means that your life is effectively doubled, as long as you have enough mana/mana sustain.

If you combine Agnostic + 50% MoM + 2-3k mana regen + ~4-4.5k life, you have a VERY tanky build. That ends up being a 9k ehp build with life "regen" in the 1000's, without even starting on life regen, or leech.

Again, mana is not supposed to take all the damage for you, it is there to take some of it (when you try to), and it is currently doing that well.

LMAO you're really delusional to even think MOM build have a higher ehp compared to life/es builds. When we're talking about EHP, damage MITIGATION will comes into place through auras or resource leech/gain and other forms.


Mana builds cannot stack multiple auras like life or es builds or they die easily. And while spending huge loads of mana, you cannot INSTANT get back the mana while casting using archmage, leaving little defense when something hits you while casting.
And mana leech is shitty.
And only way mana users can get their maximum mana regenerated is through cloak of defiance which is a shitty 1%.
SO many drawbacks.

Why MOM builds can't facetank sirus a8 die beam? because limited auras for damage mitigation, insufficient leech/gain available to it, and spending huge archmage mana while casting and tanking with no instant mana recovery at that point in time. Simple stuff.

Source just 1 proof pure mana builds face-tanking sirus a8 beam since you insinuated there is?

YOu know if you decide to go archamge you get this situation. If you decide to go Indigon you will not have it.

You are taking a build with advantage and disadvantage and crying injustice.
Switch to indigon if you don t like spending half your pool in 1 take. You are responsible for building around archmage in a way that become problematic for your defenses. Not all mana builds are archamge.

What you are asking is eliminate a disadvantage to suit your build.

Yes indigon mana mom can facetank sirus beam , Your archmage one can t. Decide your path and stop complaining about decisions you ve made. It is not a problem on mana build it is a problem about building around archmage.

Why are you people focusing on archmage/stormbrand instead of the main topic of discussion, which is about mana vs life/es as a defense?

Can't wait to see archmage/stormbrand being nerfed that badly? And i am NOT the one that is crying but you are.

What are you are doing is to eliminate a skill that you do not like by asked for a nerf to suit your preference even if it does not benefit you at all just like those people crying about the herald stacking guardian. I personally, play standard and skipped delirium so I do not have access to herald stacking guardian cluster jewels but have seen youtube videos of them tanking every a8 sirus attacks while sitting on the giant pool of red degen circles doing nothing. It's OP i agree but does it bothers or affects my playing style or the build that I am trying to make? absolutely fking no. It's like when you see people having fun through their hardwork to make a build OP/work, you became jealous or envious and having malicious intentions to ask for a nerf to that build. Now that's real crying. If other people can have fun in this league and i couldn't then i asked the devs to nerf the shit out of that build so that i can have my "fun". That's the root problem with this community and that's why the devs nerf builds after builds to suit the taste of this envious cry babies. That's real crying. People seemed to have forgotten how much time was used in testing/theory crafting and playing with POB around till you perfect-ed the build with hard work by testing it in game with real in game currency... But when crybabies saw the fruits of labor of an "OP" build, they immediately ask/demand for that build to be nerf. The thing that the Devs did right and impressed me was NOT NERF-ing that build in the middle of the league to ruin the hardwork of the originator of that build. If you want OP build then do your own homework and outsmart the system to abuse the system otherwise stop crying to ask for nerf. Ask for buff instead.

what i am merely doing is replying to people who deviates from the main topic and instead talking about stormbrand and crying how OP it is or archmage or say MOM is more tanky than life or es. What a joke

Edit: when i mean facetank, I MEAN the character sitting on his ass on one spot without moving and hitting sirus while he cast his sirus a8 DIE beam ,not just any trash attacks by him. And I don't see indigon MOM builds face tanking sirus a8 die beam unless you're trolling lmao.

having to sacrifice auras is troublesome but understandable as a drawback for using mana as a life bar, my only real issue with stacking mana for defence is that one is pigeonholed into very specific uniques and ascendancy that have poor sinergy for many builds

something that could help is replacing divine guidance keystone with something else and then adding a 5-7 nodes skill wheel in the witch area with small nodes giving "4% increased mana + 5% of Damage is taken from Mana before Life" and the keystone giving transfiguration of mind.

"

YoursTruly86 wrote:

Edit: when i mean facetank, I MEAN the character sitting on his ass on one spot without moving and hitting sirus while he cast his sirus a8 DIE beam ,not just any trash attacks by him. And I don't see indigon MOM builds face tanking sirus a8 die beam unless you're trolling lmao.

rolf, not knowing interaction between indigon and enduring mana flask with flask effect and recovery.

"

lolozori wrote:

"

YoursTruly86 wrote:

Edit: when i mean facetank, I MEAN the character sitting on his ass on one spot without moving and hitting sirus while he cast his sirus a8 DIE beam ,not just any trash attacks by him. And I don't see indigon MOM builds face tanking sirus a8 die beam unless you're trolling lmao.

rolf, not knowing interaction between indigon and enduring mana flask with flask effect and recovery.

I know the interaction between enduring mana flask with indigon but Recovery flasks queue up if multiple flasks are active. The effect with the highest regeneration rate is always applied first.

https://pathofexile.gamepedia.com/Flask#Mana_Flasks

So if you have multiple enduring mana flask activated, only the highest one will be activated only, in any case, if its tied, I am not sure about that but I am assuming only 1 flask will be activated.

And judging by the weak recovery provided but "enduring" flask over "caustic" flask, I would assume it to be a weak recovery over time as compared to other flask.

So how did you managed to get nearly 18k mana regen over 3 seconds and how did you even managed to stack 18k mana in the first place? Not to insult you, but that image seems photoshopped as screen shots of characters stats are bold-ed in orange/gold color in game. If it's taken from POB, there isn't even a stat calculator for flask stats. If i am wrong please enlighten me thank you.