instead of 3.9 bow rework we should get a 3.9 melee rework 2.0

I've been playing a lot of melee lately. It's been working quite alright for me.

Cyclone in legion:


Lacerate in blight:

I would rather not have them screw up melee more.

oh man.. some people is putting 4.0 as if it's going to fix every or most of the issues the game currently has..

lower your expectations a bit..

as for the melee 2.0 not gonna happen that already happened in 3.7 how it ended up? cyclone nerfed and most of the skills tied to melee gameplay might never see enough play in this game..

Imagine, there are more Bow Skills than Tornado Shot.
For me a Bow rework would mean reducing the power of Tornado Shot while reworking/buffing other bow spells in order to offer the players that are interested in bow builds more than one viable option for the endgame.

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Ringcycle wrote:

You want to clear screens with melee? Buff up your heralds. Isn't that what the ranged classes do anyhow?

Also, lightning wildstrike or frost blades.

The problem with melee is that there are some skills that really aren't true melee. First we must separate the "real" melee skills from the "Quasi-melee" skills you just mentioned. Any skill that is labeled as melee but has a secondary large AoE component to it (such as Tectonic Slam) are in the quasi-melee category and as such I don't count them as real melee. TS with an OG sword is fun-to-play but not what I would call melee (those fissures cover half the screen). So we take out these quasi-melee skills and the remaining ones are indeed needing more loving by GGG.

But the overall problem with playing melee stems from GGG's decisions a few years back to allow power and speed of play to grow so much. I can envision Chris and devs sitting around the discussion table a few years back tossing out ideas for ways to increase their player base and some one saying "the shooter games are immensely popular with 10s of millions of players. How can we tap into this revenue stream?". We all know that a large part of the fun of a shooter is the "run-n-gun" play style. Speed of play is a critical element of a great shooter game (like Fortnite). So GGG allowed speed and power creep to grow in a big way so that today the goal of playing PoE seems to be the ladder reset every 3 months and the new race to 100 again (or at least 90). Then it's over until the next challenge... err... expansion league and rinse and repeat. This GGG recipe for "getting your game played forever" doesn't work with melee when the reason many (most?) play just for the race to 100.

So real melee and real arpg playing with strategy of build designs has given way to speed and power play (GGG chasing the shooter crowds for more total players) which means playing with as much AoE as we can get which is the opposite of real melee. The hope that we can get melee to a much better place (make melee great again), well that ship has (sadly) sailed long ago.

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Ringcycle wrote:

Buff up your heralds. Isn't that what the ranged classes do anyhow?

no not really, a minority of them perhaps.

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Ringcycle wrote:

frost blades.

utter shit compared to what it used to be

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Arrowneous wrote:

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Ringcycle wrote:

You want to clear screens with melee? Buff up your heralds. Isn't that what the ranged classes do anyhow?

Also, lightning wildstrike or frost blades.

The problem with melee is that there are some skills that really aren't true melee. First we must separate the "real" melee skills from the "Quasi-melee" skills you just mentioned

see this is probably where its all gone wrong.

instead of people just accepting melee skills that have aoe are way more fun/effective and playing them theyve been whining about "oh, make frenzy with no splash or explosions RT with a 1h weapon good" and they tried to... and its still shit, but now all the multistriked aoe melee skills are garbage compared to what they used to be as a result and weve ended up with animation cancelling which is a cancer in every endgame build in the game. They harmed almost everything fun and worth playing in endgame to some extent in order to please the 20 people who want to play 0 aoe dual strike and have it be good, and its still not good.

they should have just ignored those people and left everything how it was.

even my spell builds are cancelling their skills non stop every time i play because they tried to make "real melee" work. diabolical.

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trezorzetto wrote:

"i feel like melee was kind of fine until the melee rework. i cant think of a single thing with the melee tag that is better now than it has been at some point in the past"
true... but melee is fine, people just need learn how make strong builds, i have champion/ from delve league (along time ago) and i can use any melee skill, on fact, my first caracter (Berserker still good) ....so no, stop crying and go make a better build...

its not fine, it was acceptable before they fucked it up, now its fucked up.

you can use any melee skill?



oh, i wonder if i can make a melee build that can clear maps...

come on. its not about power, its about relative power, its not about can you clear content with it, its about the devs deciding they needed to do something to make melee better and then basically making it worse, significantly worse.

that needs acknowledged. when people cried that melee needed a buff before these changes they just needed to learn how to make good builds. now melee actually does need a buff, not in terms of giving X skill 5% more damage etc, they needed to make significant mechanical changes to the game to allow people to turn off animation cancelling and to fix things like multistrike.

yeah yeah the games a total joke now and people are killing uber elder within 20 minutes of a league start in ssf hardcore, we know the whole thing has lost the plot and you can clear t16 maps with a budget u can earn from playing five t1 maps, everythings overpowered beyond all sense. But all these melee skills are still existing in a game where they compete with spells, summons and bows to be worth playing, and so many of the options that were worth playing at the point when they decided to 'fix' melee are now not worth playing, both in terms of relative performance and because they now feel clunky and unfun.

making a skill 'work' in terms of having a functioning build that can do all the things is something anyone whos even semi competent at making builds has taken for granted everything they try will achieve for years now.


mathils running around with groundslam now? i saw a vid on my youtubes, like a 1 shot big aoe groundslam playing it like earthquake. it works, its actually decent looking. could u do that before these changes? yeah, absolutely. who was doing that? no one because the other options melee had were preferable.

I've played groundslam quite a few leagues its pretty fun and didn't get gutted by the melee changes (infact the pure phys buffs really helped its later dps) but really its #1 problem is its worse earthquake.

A little bit like lightning strike is just worse frostblades etc.

As to mathil builds I mean 6k life with a kaoms on, abyssus and a 7l staff if you can't make a skill work with that it literally needs deleting lol because you can't cheese anymore dps into it.

Not that there is anything wrong with that just saying its not a good measuring stick.

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lolozori wrote:

Melee still sucks and it need rework wayyyyy more than opi op 1500 life 4 screens 1 shot clear 500 ms bows.

So why don t we have another melee rework?

Last work on it was less than perfect and melee is such a clusterfuck it would need at least 2 leagues focused on melee rework.

We POE players do not have Alzheimer yet, we are not forgetting how half-assed the melee changes were...so why is GGG not working on another melee league to "perfect" it?

Will we wait 1 full year to get another melee change?

Majority of Melee skills are just horrible and the ones that are semi decent are range...another melee rework would simply be Cyclone buff 2.0 with more MTX's.

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Snorkle_uk wrote:

i feel like melee was kind of fine until the melee rework. i cant think of a single thing with the melee tag that is better now than it has been at some point in the past. the only skill that seemed to get better after the rework was cyclone

Uhm, flicker strike?

Why dont they just rework everything else down to the level of melee?