Tooltips suck, should be easy fix, why are they so misleading?

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Kurgosh wrote:

Because DPS is impossible to quantify. It means different things to different people, depending on what content and what conditions they're trying to figure out.

What's the DPS of my arc trapper? The damage on a single target who's standing close to me and has no unusual defenses? Which damage to that target? The damage of one trap? One set of traps, assuming all four trigger? The maximum number of traps I can throw in a second? With or without rotating in a bear trap every 3 seconds? Or should the tooltip ignore my blinding "nearby enemy" auras, and just calculate without those? And if so, under which of the above conditions? Or are we talking about the aoe damage? For one trap? 4 traps? All the traps I can throw in a second? For how many targets? Are they all "nearby"? Should we count the trap arming delay, or just the sustained damage peak? Is my tooltip limited by my mana regen?

By your argument we may as well not use PoB since there are just too many different situations to consider?

The damage on tooltop needs not to be accurate 100%. There Devs could totally define a standard, reasonable circumstance to base the calculation on, like if you are a champion and take taunt nodes, it should be factored in, or if you are playing trap, a reasonable assumption could be that all traps triggers, with the Dps= Dps of each trap * min(number of traps throw /sec, max trap cap). Let's be real, everyone calculate of traps like that anyway. Remember that we don't need exact number, we just need a frame of reference to estimate roughly how much we need to improve/ compared to a certain thresold for damage.

I reckon not more than 20% of players even know about the existence of PoB. Imagine how many people are misled by the tooltip. This way at least it has some value, as it stands right now, the tooptip is just another dogshit tool that adds to Poe's plethora of unnessary noob traps.

It's absolutely non-excusable on GGG's part considering PoB exists. In fact, I've argued there should be a PoB tool implemented in-game since for making a good build and comparing different equipment setups requires it anyway.

The solution is to allow you to deploy a dummy in game. When you attack the dummy it logs your damage.

The dummy in indestructible and you can attack it as long as you like. You could even deploy it in a map to get those mods onto the dummy.

Seems simple.

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xMustard wrote:

or just add a dps dummy we can place in our hideout which calculates damage done etc. make it so we can adjust its resistance, hp, stats etc and allow us to set presets so we can mimic shaper, elder, uber atziri etc.

but hey we can just keep dreaming

This, Dummys in Titan Quest/Grim Dawn are a nice addition for testing. Would pay a MTX for that :>

I am not looking for a perfect tooltip dps, mostly just less confusing, innaccurate information, such as which types of damage increase which portions of a skill.

Can we all agree at the very least that is both easy and helpful?

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trixxar wrote:

I am not looking for a perfect tooltip dps, mostly just less confusing, innaccurate information, such as which types of damage increase which portions of a skill.

Can we all agree at the very least that is both easy and helpful?

Well they did atleast add a tiny window showing you witch support gem supports which skill. I dont know if thats just while buying gems or everytime you hover over a suppoert get.
Its a small step into that direction.

'easy'.

easy to spot people who havent programmed a lick in their lives and didnt try to handle thousands of edge cases.

training dummy. ok. do we forget that different bosses in the game have different resists, curse reductions, armour, evasion and so on ? if dummy is taken is a 'total damage dealt' then people will ask why shaper is taking far less damage than the dummy. ok. evasion rating. what do we about this ? what evasion rating should the dummy have ? this plays a HUGE a role in total damage output by any crit build that isnt a champion/lycosidae. what about baseline resists ?


the tooltip GGG uses is ALREADY standardized. it takes in account main attack/skill without secondary effects, stages and other stuff. so if you go by a 'conventional' skill like single target heavy strike without any dots, you will have correct tooltip, pre-curse and not counting pen.

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grepman wrote:

'easy'.

easy to spot people who havent programmed a lick in their lives and didnt try to handle thousands of edge cases.

Meh, dumb criticism because yes nothing is easy but then easy becomes a relative term. Figuring out average dps is impossible because it depends on player skill but fixing the tooltip is esay enough compared to that. Better?

Creating a game that requires this much indepth knowledge but (deliberately?) creating horrible tooltips that confuse and obscure the true dps and path to success is obnoxious in a uniquely POE way.

It truly is amazing how BAD ggg is at the tooltips. 10 seconds of an average forum poster is better than ggg. A random individual making path of building is a million times better.

Im almost just curiously frustrated by the question; why is ggg so mind numbingly bad at the tooltips. They arent just lack, they appear to be deliberately misleading.

"Ooooh, if I check all these boxes in PoB, my DPS numbers goes up. Wow, this is accurate. 2 mill DPS. This is so brilliant".

It's not that easy. As others have said, monsters have different armor, resistances, evasion, curse effect reduction (and much more). We also know that some of the mechanics in this game, like penetration, is way more effective the more resistances the enemy has.

The only reason you deem PoB more "accurate", is because you can check/uncheck everything - based an any kind of situation in the game. Can we really demand that PoE gives the same amount of detail? What other games out there does?

The tooltip DPS has never aimed at being accurate. It aims at being a guideline. Sure, there are shortcomings, but the situations where you actually need a "100% accurate tooltip" are very few.

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trixxar wrote:

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grepman wrote:

'easy'.

easy to spot people who havent programmed a lick in their lives and didnt try to handle thousands of edge cases.

Meh, dumb criticism because yes nothing is easy but then easy becomes a relative term. Figuring out average dps is impossible because it depends on player skill but fixing the tooltip is esay enough compared to that. Better?

Creating a game that requires this much indepth knowledge but (deliberately?) creating horrible tooltips that confuse and obscure the true dps and path to success is obnoxious in a uniquely POE way.

It truly is amazing how BAD ggg is at the tooltips. 10 seconds of an average forum poster is better than ggg. A random individual making path of building is a million times better.

Im almost just curiously frustrated by the question; why is ggg so mind numbingly bad at the tooltips. They arent just lack, they appear to be deliberately misleading.

It truly is amazing how BAD you are at the critical thinking and planning.

Answer a question which "should be easy to" :D

So here's the situation (random one, "in the vacuum"):
there is a level 77 Juggernaut with Molten Strike and 5 support gems (one of those is a Combustion support and Maim support is one among the other).
You need to display his DPS tooltip at this particular second when you're standing in the middle of T11 map which has 2 monsters left somewhere.
What should be factored and calculated in, smart guy?

Monster resistances (which monster exactly?),
"maimed" monster?,
is it a map boss or Guardian or whatever?
# of "Molten balls" hit?,
whether the enemy is ignited or not?
maybe there is a hidden Rogue Exile with Arctic Armour
etc
etc
etc

QUESTION
What should your DPS tooltip display right now??

Answer this, sweetie, it should be easy :D

(Not to mention stuff like Doomfletch bow"random-element-added-damage" and such...

God i love these people "it's easy and simple, DO IT!, WHY WON'T YOU DO IT?"