Weapon and Shields on Sale! The Sin and Innocence Mystery Box Returns!

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Completed 15 Challengesshua_dy wrote:
Spoiler
Since you're so bad at keeping your word, might as well bring back the old supporter packs for a "limited time" only so I can purchase the packs that had the pets i wanted for a long time now.

"
Completed 36 ChallengesMidkraft wrote:
Spoiler
that is so greedy and disgusting!

Bringing back former mystery boxes is only to pray on weak willed people with minor or major gambling issues.

Is this what we can expect going forward?? that you wont give great discounts on really popular stuff that is already overpriced but instead throw it behind loot boxing to milk your audience?

One time for 1 loot box is already on the boarder of what i wanna see.
If you are gonna pull this stunt again i am closing the wallet on you and i would pray to that you get a EA like lootboxing hell.


"
Completed 10 Challenges鬼殺し wrote:
Spoiler
This is some weird fuckin' logic. It was one of the most popular mystery boxes because it had a lot of cool stuff in it, no doubt. Stuff we couldn't get any other way. Now we can be much more specific, I see no reason to do this other than as an experiment to wring more money out of people with no self control. And I'd like to believe we're not so far down the Gotta-Pay-Tencent-Their-Rent garden path as to require such blatant abuse of your players' weaknesses.

Unimpressed.

Re bringing old packs back: sure, go for it. The name 'GGG' hasn't had much integrity when it comes to word-keeping for a while now. Besides, could be fun to see if anyone ever buys a Ruler of Wraeclast pack ever again.

...But here's some less than weird fuckin' logic: the best value supporter packs of days now gone were horribly underpriced: Diamond and Eternal. Good luck seeing those come back for less than 2k USD...


I'm sensing a lot of first world entitlement and lack of attention here.
(Note: Not all of my points will be appropriate for every quote above)

As others have pointed out, nowhere did GGG claim that these boxes or their contents would be exclusive to some time period, nor is this the first mystery box they've brought back. Further, since the availability of these items in-store was well advertised from the get-go, any exclusivity argument raised by anyone who did not purchase these boxes for the sole purpose of stroking and admiring them in their microtransaction tab is complete and utter crock.

A good while ago, GGG made the admirable commitment to never again lock items exclusively behind RNG boxes. Beyond that, I see no reason GGG should not be allowed to price MTX however they wish (especially when they even post those prices in the mystery box post, way before they're available in store). If you think they're too expensive as listed, say as much, and don't buy them at that price. Welcome to capitalism. Being rude doesn't help, it just makes you rude.
In fact, I applaud GGG for not caving to every misbegotten, irresponsible, anonymized volley of vitriol that flies their way, as that only encourages more of the worst kind of spoilt behavior, of which there is already more than enough on the Internet.
GGG is even nice enough to provide sales on a good number of MTX daily, so with just a little bit of patience, it is possible to acquire almost any MTX (the exceptions being league hats and mystery boxes) at a significant discount.

Further, as a bulletin for the unaware: GGG does not modify the base price of MTX; however, besides certain meta-MTX such as stash tabs and character slots, all MTX sales are set on a sliding scale, discounting more and more deeply over time up to a certain percent (usually 50% for items above 30 points).

As for the mystery boxes themselves, I am completely fine with their return. I've enjoyed, on occasion, throwing a few coins at the RNG, and so am appreciative of the opportunity to do so again. As with any form of entertainment, these boxes are enjoyable enough, IN MODERATION (especially given the price effectiveness vs. duplicate mathematics).
I also fail to see how GGG can be held accountable for the mental shortcomings of its players, since:
  • It is simply not practical for a game developer to coddle every possible human quirk on the planet, so it is not unreasonable to assume some modicum of maturity and self-control in one's constituents.
  • Those with said quirks should be self-aware, and take measures to curb any undesirable effects. If this means not playing the game, so be it.
  • Mental problems are no more or less precious than physical ones. GGG should no more be held responsible for those with gambling or self-control issues than they should for those who are blind and cannot play.
  • As anyone who's gotten their hands on a Vaal Orb should know, this isn't exactly the best choice of game for those with gambling problems.
  • Hardly, is PoE anywhere near the biggest threat to those with control problems. Lotteries and drunk driving are far more effective at penalizing such traits.
Last edited by 三日前 on Oct 12, 2018, 6:09:07 AM
The reason they were popular was because people enjoyed the league. GL
Would have loved to have grabbed some more boxes.

Xsolla.

I'm getting mixed messages GGG, do you want my money or not?
Eh, fair enough, Three Days. *shrug* I've spent enough time in the trenches on both sides of this No Man's Land, biting my tongue the whole way (believe it or not).

A real cynic might point out the interesting timing between this and the very real threat that loot boxes themselves might be outlawed in Europe soon enough, and by that I mean someone else brought it up and I'm just echoing the possibility.

Either way, I feel like you're commending the current GGG for being the same as the old GGG, which may be something veterans such as myself either take for granted or are yet surprised by. They do loot boxes in a fashion that is far fairer than pretty much anything else out there. Yes.

But they do loot boxes.

And loot boxes definitely take solid aim at those with gambling tendencies. It's exploitative and they know it. Regardless of the fairness of the method, the action itself is very grey area compared to selling mtxes outright. Note that this is not me reacting to any personal experience: I usually buy quite a few of the boxes and am always very satisfied with the results. Especially if I don't check to see what's in them first. More fun that way. BUT this isn't about me. As you noted, first world entitlement. I'm the fucking Ruler of Wraeclast. This is about those who might have a fistful of bucks to throw at the devs and can choose: one or two mtxes they know they want, or a gamble to get 5+ they might want or 5+ they really don't. Takes a lot of willpower not to try for that gamble.

I have never gambled on loot boxes because it's excess for me. Bonus. Impossible to lose if you've already written the money off as gone one way or another. But I can imagine how shitty it must feel to do so and get duplicates and hideout crap.

No matter how fair loot boxes are, they will always tap that shitty feeling in the hope that the 'loser' buys more. One more roll. Just one more.

That's exploitative.

I'm like that one piece of ugly furniture too heavy to get rid of. Best you just learn how to live with it. If it comes down to you or me leaving, it's going to be you every time. I can do this all day if I want. Literally.
"
Completed 15 Challenges三日前 wrote:
"
Completed 15 Challengesshua_dy wrote:
Spoiler
Since you're so bad at keeping your word, might as well bring back the old supporter packs for a "limited time" only so I can purchase the packs that had the pets i wanted for a long time now.

"
Completed 36 ChallengesMidkraft wrote:
Spoiler
that is so greedy and disgusting!

Bringing back former mystery boxes is only to pray on weak willed people with minor or major gambling issues.

Is this what we can expect going forward?? that you wont give great discounts on really popular stuff that is already overpriced but instead throw it behind loot boxing to milk your audience?

One time for 1 loot box is already on the boarder of what i wanna see.
If you are gonna pull this stunt again i am closing the wallet on you and i would pray to that you get a EA like lootboxing hell.


"
Completed 10 Challenges鬼殺し wrote:
Spoiler
This is some weird fuckin' logic. It was one of the most popular mystery boxes because it had a lot of cool stuff in it, no doubt. Stuff we couldn't get any other way. Now we can be much more specific, I see no reason to do this other than as an experiment to wring more money out of people with no self control. And I'd like to believe we're not so far down the Gotta-Pay-Tencent-Their-Rent garden path as to require such blatant abuse of your players' weaknesses.

Unimpressed.

Re bringing old packs back: sure, go for it. The name 'GGG' hasn't had much integrity when it comes to word-keeping for a while now. Besides, could be fun to see if anyone ever buys a Ruler of Wraeclast pack ever again.

...But here's some less than weird fuckin' logic: the best value supporter packs of days now gone were horribly underpriced: Diamond and Eternal. Good luck seeing those come back for less than 2k USD...


I'm sensing a lot of first world entitlement and lack of attention here.
(Note: Not all of my points will be appropriate for every quote above)

As others have pointed out, nowhere did GGG claim that these boxes or their contents would be exclusive to some time period, nor is this the first mystery box they've brought back. Further, since the availability of these items in-store was well advertised from the get-go, any exclusivity argument raised by anyone who did not purchase these boxes for the sole purpose of stroking and admiring them in their microtransaction tab is complete and utter crock.

A good while ago, GGG made the admirable commitment to never again lock items exclusively behind RNG boxes. Beyond that, I see no reason GGG should not be allowed to price MTX however they wish (especially when they even post those prices in the mystery box post, way before they're available in store). If you think they're too expensive as listed, say as much, and don't buy them at that price. Welcome to capitalism. Being rude doesn't help, it just makes you rude.
In fact, I applaud GGG for not caving to every misbegotten, irresponsible, anonymized volley of vitriol that flies their way, as that only encourages more of the worst kind of spoilt behavior, of which there is already more than enough on the Internet.
GGG is even nice enough to provide sales on a good number of MTX daily, so with just a little bit of patience, it is possible to acquire almost any MTX (the exceptions being league hats and mystery boxes) at a significant discount.

Further, as a bulletin for the unaware: GGG does not modify the base price of MTX; however, besides certain meta-MTX such as stash tabs and character slots, all MTX sales are set on a sliding scale, discounting more and more deeply over time up to a certain percent (usually 50% for items above 30 points).

As for the mystery boxes themselves, I am completely fine with their return. I've enjoyed, on occasion, throwing a few coins at the RNG, and so am appreciative of the opportunity to do so again. As with any form of entertainment, these boxes are enjoyable enough, IN MODERATION (especially given the price effectiveness vs. duplicate mathematics).
I also fail to see how GGG can be held accountable for the mental shortcomings of its players, since:
  • It is simply not practical for a game developer to coddle every possible human quirk on the planet, so it is not unreasonable to assume some modicum of maturity and self-control in one's constituents.
  • Those with said quirks should be self-aware, and take measures to curb any undesirable effects. If this means not playing the game, so be it.
  • Mental problems are no more or less precious than physical ones. GGG should no more be held responsible for those with gambling or self-control issues than they should for those who are blind and cannot play.
  • As anyone who's gotten their hands on a Vaal Orb should know, this isn't exactly the best choice of game for those with gambling problems.
  • Hardly, is PoE anywhere near the biggest threat to those with control problems. Lotteries and drunk driving are far more effective at penalizing such traits.


As an indie game developer - although I work on really tiny projects and can't be compared in any way, shape or form to a company like GGG - I just want to say this:

Thank you.
Bring back the supporter packs too please, more choices!
"
Completed 10 Challenges鬼殺し wrote:
loot boxes definitely take solid aim at those with gambling tendencies[...]exploitative.
I see variations on this argument a lot, but I've always found it quite odd that it only appears with any frequency specifically for the vice of gambling.
If you think about it, regular sales similarly target soft spots of the human psyche, namely impatience and avarice. By setting a higher nominal price and only applying discounts periodically, one gulls the impatient into paying more than they otherwise would. Conversely, when you then drop the price during a sale, you draw in the purchases of those who would not otherwise have bought the item at all, but for the knowledge that they did so at a price superior to their peers.
Why, then, is it that so many seem to find such devices as loot boxes so much more heinous?
Last edited by 三日前 on Oct 12, 2018, 7:21:45 AM
"
Completed 15 Challenges三日前 wrote:
"
Completed 10 Challenges鬼殺し wrote:
loot boxes definitely take solid aim at those with gambling tendencies[...]exploitative.
I see variations on this argument a lot, but I've always found it quite odd that it only appears with any frequency specifically for the vice of gambling.
If you think about it, regular sales similarly target soft spots of the human psyche, namely impatience and avarice. By setting a higher nominal price and only applying discounts periodically, one gulls the impatient into paying more than they otherwise would. Conversely, when you then drop the price during a sale, you draw in the purchases of those who would not otherwise have bought the item at all, but for the knowledge that they did so at a price superior to their peers.
Why, then, is it that so many seem to find such devices as loot boxes so much more heinous?


There is soo much to be said about modern day marketing and how predatory it is. I always laugh when I watch adds for medicine / cleaning products / insurance or childrens toys, they set out to push very specific buttons.

I think gamers get their heckles up because it's something that has slowly entered the realm of gaming over the past ~10 years and now that it's got a foot hold has appeared almost everywhere, you can't play half the triple A titles available without finding "horse armor" DLC or loot boxes.

The divider seems to be where the responsibility lies, with the user or the provider. Should GGG limit accounts to X boxes purchased per day/week etc? Or does a "problem gambler" need to seek professional help? It's all pretty interesting stuff.
Achievements: 120/120 Ascendancy Classes Lv.90+: 18/19 Best FF: VII
Bring back past supporter packs for a limited time, Closed and Open beta's, I know wishful thinking.
IGN RighteousRom LvL-100 Juggernaut
Mirror Drop T-14 Shrine
As someone that enjoys gambling on crates and bought way too many of these specific crates the first time around because they didn't want to wait a couple months, why on Earth would anyone buy these now that everything is available in the store?

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