Improve Acrobatics

I saw it. That's why i asked you. You seem to know math since you answered my question.

Anyway, with what Poe is atm, sid is right. Get some defenses, max damage and watch tv while playing. Don't be silly and max defense lol.

But if we objectively look at the fully invested defensive capabilities of evading and blocking, blocking is far supperior because you can block dodge better than you can dodge block because of the dodge penalty. If that makes sense to anyone...

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ACGIFT wrote:

On top of that, consider the weapon layout; the outright reduced block (even if meant as a BALANCING mechanic) means a shield is a bad idea. Dual-wield, likewise, is out, leaving two-handed weapons, of which rangers only specialize in one kind: bows.

In short, Acrobatics is kinda just an RNG reward for playing an archer.

well, first thing is that its a keystone. Necromatic Aegis is just a reward for being a summoner, no one seems to have a problem with that. Block is a defense mechanic spread over the majority of the tree, and is implicit to all dual wield, shield and staff builds. Acrobatics is a keystone, I dont think its supposed to be as universal as block. Its most probably designed to give archers a small piece of the block/spell block action without letting them get the full pie, and thats primarily what it does, sure.

Acro isnt a bad idea for shields though, even less so for dual wield. So you are evasion melee with a shield, you got 26% base block chance. Where can you spend 5 nodes to boost that to 40% block + 30% spell block? If you take testudo, probably the best block cluster, its 4 nodes and you end up with 35% block, no spell block. Take Acro, you get 40% dodge, which is already better, then also get 30% spell dodge AND you get to keep 18% of your original 26% block.

As a small investment in a fairly significant layer of defense its insanely good. How else are you going to reduce 30% of incoming spell damage on your tree? For a Raider it becomes 46% dodge and 40% spell dodge. You dont have to max it, you can happily just leave it there, not use vaal grace, not use atziri boots, have no other source of dodge. For a simple 5 point investment its serious value.



As an evasion melee you can stick on a coil, use a taste of hate and a basalt, quick 5 nodes into acro, you are wearing evasion gear anyway and you get all the evasion % you need from life nodes. Its done, chest armour, 2 flasks, 5 passives. Now you have 3 layers of phys damage reduction coil+toh / basalt / endurance charges and you have 3 layers of attack avoidance evasion / dodge / block then you also have 30% spell avoidance. For that investment? Seriously? Thats heavy duty, for a strength based class to get defenses that rival that using an armour + block marauder is going to take untold more investment, so many more passives dedicated into block, into armour, into spell block items that have no life rolls. Meanwhile the evasion melee inherently has more than double the damage of the str melee from spending only 5 passives on defenses other than life while sitting on a mountain of critical strike passives.

Trust me, the community might be clueless on melee and its popular to presume evasion melee is shit because thats what everyone else says, surely it must be right? 1h evasion melee pisses on 1h str melee, if you sit half and half with a duelist you can match the evasion melee with mixtures of armour, coil, evasion, block, dodge etc, as long as you also go crit. Ev melee needs no sympathy, its in a good place in the overall picture.

Is 1h str melee in a good place? Im not so sure it is tbh.

Can you just stop wasting your time with long paragraphs and answer my question please? Why are you trying to block/dodge/evade anything in this game while you can one shot everything? That makes no sense.

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Jideament wrote:

Can you just stop wasting your time with long paragraphs and answer my question please? Why are you trying to block/dodge/evade anything in this game while you can one shot everything? That makes no sense.

Because some people enjoy playing close combat characters that you know need to mitigate damage so they can deal damage themselves.

Im sorry, some of the shit said in this thread is pretty ridiculous

1. that acro is expensive ? wait what ? cheapest *conventional* (get that instant leech bullshit the fuck outta here already) defense in the game compared to block, armour, evasion, etc.

2. that acro can only be used by a small subset ? wait WHAT ? life builds on right side of the tree are a HUGE subset of games builds. just because ES is busted currently doesnt make it any less true.

3. comparing an ascendancy that SPECIALIZES in block/spell block (gladiator) with anything else. give me some other ascenandcies that get that 78/75 block without huge sacrifices ? gladiator and maaaybe necro. thats it.

not only does it pigeonhole block builds into effectively going gladiator, but it shows pretty much crystal clear how block is not cheap. again, go ahead and make a 78/75 block with a shadow or ranger.

hell, I had a near max block scion bow toon who had to travel all the way left for the lioneyes jewel to work on the staff block nodes, and I had to use both reckless defense AND rearguard. had to use gladiator sub-ascendancy and STILL I wouldnt quite cap spell block even with a perfect rumi's.


show me a non-gladiator/necro who has a 75/75 block. if you can even build one... then look at how much you invest into that (and how much downside, because even one reckless defense is quite dangerous especially since you dont have evasion/acro) and compare it with investment in acro

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sidtherat wrote:

how is that possible that 'melee' and 'ranged' have the same defences? who made up this 'or/or' situation? who stops melee player from picking Block AND Dodge? who? who stops him from using Block/Dodge AND AR?

Do you understand much in PoE, or do you just like arguing with me for the sake of arguing?

Do you not understand that you can play range WITH a shield?

Let me explain slowly:

If I have a shield, I can use Block.

If I have a shield, I can play range.

What this means is that - I can play range with block.

Here you are whining - "Who made this up!" "What stops the melee player from picking Block AND Dodge?"

Please tell me - what stops a ranged player with a shield using Block AND Dodge?

Any defensive profile the melee player wants to use - ranged can use as well.

Are you getting the picture now?

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sidtherat wrote:

the only thing that changed was the ability to ignore attack damage 99% of the time to 75% of the time.

No one needed that much because they were not dying to attacks they were dying to spells. And furthermore - you can still get to that level today for attacks. So your 75% notion is wrong.

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sidtherat wrote:

it never protected from one-shots (even without penalty) and doesnt protect right now. if current situation is not viable (who says that? what are the proofs of this claim?) then the previous one wasnt as well - because in previous and current situation you WILL get hit at some point. in current one it just happens more frequently

if you say 'it is not viable because noone plays it' ill just say - millions of flies cannot be wrong..

You used to play my build, so I'm surprised you still don't understand what made it so strong.

"It never protected one shots". Lol. It is not even about attacks, it is spells. That is what kills EV melee players. Thanks to the Acro nerf - EV melee had a much harder time coping with spell damage and that is why they became obsolete without ranged damage.

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sidtherat wrote:

key to players problems is trying to make 'one dimensional' builds in a game that screams 'mix stuff together'. so EV-only character is doomed from the start BY DESIGN. same with AR-only. and - hopefully in 3.0 - ES-only (unlikely, ES will remain the king of absorbing huge spikes)

This game is not about 1 thing that works. Fact is many different things can work.

Writing statements like "EV-only is doomed BY DESIGN" really shows your lack of knowledge.

Do you mean EV + pure damage avoidance is doomed by design? You are wrong then, becuase pure damage avoidance is still doing end game, even on melee.

Or perhaps you mean just evasion by itself is doomed? Not true either. Bow players have dropped Acro before to run on pure EV - so even evasion by itself works if you have range. So again, you are wrong.

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Jideament wrote:

Can you just stop wasting your time with long paragraphs and answer my question please? Why are you trying to block/dodge/evade anything in this game while you can one shot everything? That makes no sense.

youre right, no one has ever died to a monster in this game because they 1 shot everything so monsters never get to attack them.

Im not sure why Im still bothering with life or es nodes tbh, force of habit from other games I guess? Must be.

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Pyrokar wrote:

Fruz you know math man? I am one of those napkin people. If a number looks good then i just max it.

Can you calculate for me 78 allblock with vaal grace on and maybe that flask that gives 10% dodge and spelldodge?

And if it doesn't look good please don't shoot me ok? Stupid people that like to max stuff deserve an opinion as well...

can you calculate how much investment a 78/78 block non-gladiator build has into block ?

this is a problem, and its a terrible side effect of ascendancies imo...when you choose to go block you almost have to go to ONE out of 19 subclasses because otherwise your investment into block is not worth it.

acro doesnt have that problem. you can spec into acro as spellcaster, bow user, melee user, evasion user etc

MoM pool user, even armour user, even semi-hybrid user, leveling toon, endgame toon.

and if anything, it shows how strong acro is.

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Ceryneian wrote:

No one needed that much because they were not dying to attacks they were dying to spells. And furthermore - you can still get to that level today for attacks. So your 75% notion is wrong.

"It never protected one shots". Lol. It is not even about attacks, it is spells. That is what kills EV melee players. Thanks to the Acro nerf - EV melee had a much harder time coping with spell damage and that is why they became obsolete without ranged damage.

that is fairly incorrect

the state of evasion of acro throughout iterations:

1. open beta->1.0: IR is very good, most spiky damage come from phys attacks. evasion and acro are good but dont protect from one shots. kill speed and player power is low so evasion/acro eventually gets hit. so one-shots are the biggest problem. spells are non-issue for most of the content as long as they dont shotgun, hence a lot of people using IR and not worrying about anything else

1.0->2.0: phys spell mobs get introduced and acro is nerfed. RT exiles and evangelists become the achilles heel of evasion, as long with shit like chaska (both invasion boss and trio)

evasion/acro users counter this with CWDT+IC combo and lighting coil which gets introduced
elemental spells are also getting stronger as well, but mostly on invasion bosses/some map bosses and endgame (atziri)

2.0: act 4 introduced with a lot of nasty mobs that deal phys damage. emphasis on phys mitigation is as strong as ever. shotgunning from spells is removed so most spells are not an issue. CWDT+IC cheese is removed, and a lot of evasion/acro users are crying on forums about not being able to mitigate phys damage and wanting their defenses to be a perfect answer to everything in the game.


2.0->3.0: basalt flask and ToH are introduced making free phys mitigation possible. ascendancies classes are introduced, placing more emphasis on 'offense > defense' mantra. atlas of the worlds brings tons of dangeorus elemental damage spells. after atlas, is the first real time map bosses spells pose a big threat to evasion/acro users. shit like evangelists or vaal constructs are non-issue even though they used to be, and phys spells in general arent an issue.