How to nerf Vaal Pact builds without nerfing Vaal Pact ?

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MortalKombat3 wrote:

It will work MUCH better than VP you want to suggest.
Also do note, that there are passive that increase maximum leech rate. If you'll let them stay, VP will be useless, if limited to 20% per second... And if you want mechanics VS "less recovery" mod, why dont rename VP into "immune to less life recovery effects"? It's much more informative them.

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Life is leeched instantly instead of over time
Life regeneration is halved
+10% to life leech cap

Life leech ignores leech rate but doesn't apply if you already leeched the amount allowed by your leech cap during the past second.

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sidtherat wrote:

reflect can be combated with.. lowering damage AND increasing defences.

only one-dimensional clown builds are afraid of reflect. when you deal 80000 damage per hit while having no defences whatsoever it is unhealthy for the game as a whole

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raics wrote:

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MortalKombat3 wrote:

It will work MUCH better than VP you want to suggest.
Also do note, that there are passive that increase maximum leech rate. If you'll let them stay, VP will be useless, if limited to 20% per second... And if you want mechanics VS "less recovery" mod, why dont rename VP into "immune to less life recovery effects"? It's much more informative them.

I mentioned some of the perks on page 1, not everyone is a slayer.

I think getting some of the lost life back at almost the same moment you lose it is pretty big, rightsiders are vulnerable to burst damage so waiting a second to get, say, 30% life back can be a lot.

Also, if instant leech isn't all powerful we can play a bit with the keystone, like this:

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Life is leeched instantly instead of over time
Life regeneration is halved
+10% to life leech cap

Life leech ignores leech rate but doesn't apply if you already leeched the amount allowed by your leech cap during the past second.

So, your leech passives aren't fully wasted, if you got, dunno, another 10% leech cap that's 40%. Let's say you're running an evader or blocker, you get hit for 3k out of your 5k pool and your next attack instantly gives you 2k back so you're in the safe zone again. I think that's pretty useful but still can't allow you to just stand in Shaper's beam and leech four or five your life pools over one second. We can play a bit with numbers until it works well, it can be 20% or 30% .

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MortalKombat3 wrote:

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adghar wrote:

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MortalKombat3 wrote:

Then it makes no difference between VP and normal leech. Maybe, normal leech would be even better.

Nah, capped VP would bypass stacking mechanic so you don't have to hit 10 times per second to get fast leech against single target, plus you skip incremental ramp up like instead of 10% per 500 ms or 5% per 250 ms you get the full 20% in less than 100 ms

EDIT: Would also bypass less recovery rate Map modifier

Endless Hunger does that (Slayer's ascendancy). It allows builds with slow hit/sec and high damage dont bother stacking leech again and again - leech stacks persist even on full life, and will heal you immediately as long as you take damage. It will work MUCH better than VP you want to suggest.
Also do note, that there are passive that increase maximum leech rate. If you'll let them stay, VP will be useless, if limited to 20% per second... And if you want mechanics VS "less recovery" mod, why dont rename VP into "immune to less life recovery effects"? It's much more informative them.

You dont need to "invent" some mechanics to make LL balanced. GGG already DID that - default LL mechanics. It limits amount of HP one can leech per second to percentage of one's like (20% default). So, to leech more (past certain point), you need more life. Also, you cant restore FULL life in split-second, so taking heavy burst damage will kill you. It's good and balanced mechanics, already present in game. But ATM, it's bypassed by most players, in favour of much more powerful and imbalanced instant leech mechanics....

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Zaanus wrote:

this is incorrect, do you even poe?

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plodd wrote:

Sounds like you want to melee life builds to be capped at white t10 maps.

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plodd wrote:

Sounds like you want you want melee life builds to be capped at white t10 maps.

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sofocle10000 wrote:

Well, that was why I said that Slayer got leech buffed to ABSURD levels if they address Vaal Pact, his leech will become OP, but due to it working only for life, it's not a huge balance problem.

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sofocle10000 wrote:

But he is perfectly correct. Have enough defence and rely on many smaller hits/s and reflect is a joke. Over rely on huge hits, that reflected damage makes even great defence investments null, and you will feel like a glass canon.