Developer Q&A - Answers Part 2

So much nonsense about simplifiying trading.

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The gap between traders and non-traders widens. This gap is apparent when you see feedback that the game is too hard for some people and too easy for others. Most of the time, that is proportionate to how much they have traded.

No, it widens now, when trading is too difficult for casual players. With accessible trading via Auction House everyone will become a trader and will benefit from it.

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Item pricing becomes more skewed towards only very-cheap and very-expensive. Items either become trivially cheap or unaffordable. If you have ever felt that it's going to take too many 1-alch sales to finally save up for that 80 exalt item you want, then this is the reason.

I don't get it. How is it different from what we have now?
And rather otherwise, with open market we will have free leveling items circulation on it. With current system it's almost impossible to buy and sell leveling gear.

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Progression is trivialised. While trading for an item to get a leg up on difficult content is of course fine, being able to trivially and cheaply quadruple your clear speed on a whim isn't something that should be expected on your first character in a league. In addition, the fewer item upgrades you make on a character before capping out your items, the lower chance you have of sticking around for a decent portion of the league. Upgrading items more times (in smaller steps) is more fun than jumping right to the perfect gear.

First, again, what's the difference with current system? Second, there are no 'perfect gear', there are always place for better affixes/rolls. Even mirrored-quality items have flaws, and it's almost impossible to get even one with such quality.

Last edited by fwd on Mar 25, 2017, 11:05:46 PM
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With all the talk of trade improvements over the years but very little concrete to show for it, it's clear that GGG wants to take steps, but is being held up by various concerns. What actual goals and restrictions are you guys working with in your efforts toward improving trade? Are there concerns that these goals are even attainable?

Being able to trade items is critical to the success of an Action RPG. This is why Path of Exile has no item binding and why SSF items can become regular items with the click of a button.

Given that we want trade, the next question is how easy the trade should be. It seems obvious to jump to the answer of "as easy as possible, of course!" but more care needs to be taken. The easier that trade is, the more trades that traders can perform, increasing the utility that items provide to them. This has a few consequences:

The gap between traders and non-traders widens. This gap is apparent when you see feedback that the game is too hard for some people and too easy for others. Most of the time, that is proportionate to how much they have traded.
Item pricing becomes more skewed towards only very-cheap and very-expensive. Items either become trivially cheap or unaffordable. If you have ever felt that it's going to take too many 1-alch sales to finally save up for that 80 exalt item you want, then this is the reason.
Progression is trivialised. While trading for an item to get a leg up on difficult content is of course fine, being able to trivially and cheaply quadruple your clear speed on a whim isn't something that should be expected on your first character in a league. In addition, the fewer item upgrades you make on a character before capping out your items, the lower chance you have of sticking around for a decent portion of the league. Upgrading items more times (in smaller steps) is more fun than jumping right to the perfect gear.


The existing community tools (combined with our public stash tab API) already put us pretty far down this spectrum, compared to the old days of trade chat. We already view this as a crisis. That is why we are hesitant to add more convenience features.

I know this explanation doesn't mention any solutions, but the things we're experimenting with aren't ready yet. Thanks for your patience.


Its very sad to see we are having no trading improvements on 3.0

Come on guys, just a "Pop window" ( yes, like old MSN messenger ) with a msg:
"Chris want buy your voltaxic rift listed for 10c
Do you want sell?
"yes" button , "no" button

it's done. I can sell my shits with 1 click instead of leave map... inv party.. trade... come back... zzzzzzzz for how long we have to deal with this awful trade system?

Not even talking about
This player is AFK.
This character is not online.

PS: Are you really going to release Path of Exile the top1 trade game of the World to xbox one without any trading improvements? So the spanish guy was right, people are going to play poe on xbox with a laptop open next to them and searching items on poe.trade website and manually whispering AFK and offline people using a controller?

Oh GOD. I can't believe you're doing this ^^ HAHAHAHAHAHAHAH XDD
Ruining Path of Exile balance since 2014
Last edited by imLuCaSsS on Mar 26, 2017, 7:41:25 AM
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The existing community tools (combined with our public stash tab API) already put us pretty far down this spectrum, compared to the old days of trade chat. We already view this as a crisis. That is why we are hesitant to add more convenience features.

You already opened the Pandora's box a long time ago. Your game would be unplayable without trading, except for a handful of die hards that like to waste their time in SSF with very niche builds. Stop pretending this isn't so and start doing something about it. Either completely remove trading and up the drops, or improve the current trading scheme. There are people like me who played PoE for years and never got a single exalt drop or top tier unique. I rely on trading for my builds. I despise the current trading, with AFKs, players in different leagues who are too lazy to switch, scammers and such.

Trading in Poe was something that developed naturally, and you want to place artificial barriers around it. Stop with this nonsense, pls.

Also, no answer to the total imbalance of Life and ES? No? Ok. Wake me up when people won't be able to have characters with literally dozens of ES and kill Shaper on EZMODE, while i struggle with my ant life build, with everything but the kitchen sink in terms of items and tree wizardry in order to have a chance at surviving endgame.
Last edited by D3adGh0st on Mar 26, 2017, 8:00:23 PM
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This is discussed occasionally but there are no plans to change it in 3.0.0. We're worried about the slippery slope of players wanting the rewards from a system without engaging in that system (although we do understand that Ascendancy classes have been so successful that they are no longer considered rewards but instead intrinsic parts of your character). I am sure we will continue to discuss this and related topics.


The purpose that many players challenge Lab (even though they are fed up with it) is to get the Ascendancy Skill Points.
I understand that the difficulty to complete a game contents is not equality at all builds.
But the difference in difficulty to complete the Lab is too big to each the build.
Especially Uber-Lab, to complete it is almost impossible except limited strong build.

In the current system, only the limited strong build gets last 2 Ascendancy Skill Points, and become more strong.
As a result, it becomes further a big to difference in game difficulty between strong build and other build.

The Ascendancy Skill Points is factor of character growth and not item, so should not be the reward of challenge for limited strong build.
No hope for in-game trading system,thats even not the biggest problem in game.
I got 20k armor .10 endurance charge,and 84 all resistance without flask,have Taste of hate and basalt active.
Still got one-shoted in even T12 map.WHY? I got the stupiest build of only 6000 hp.
Armor is shit in this game,and VP is rigged.Moreover,the useless life flask can only got not half of my health healed.
It's 'trivial' for me to come up with the solution:
1.just make health nodes equal to the ES;
2.change the heal value of life and mana flask into percentage of you maximum health/mana.
"
D3adGh0st wrote:
"
The existing community tools (combined with our public stash tab API) already put us pretty far down this spectrum, compared to the old days of trade chat. We already view this as a crisis. That is why we are hesitant to add more convenience features.

You already opened the Pandora's box a long time ago. Your game would be unplayable without trading, except for a handful of die hards that like to waste their time in SSF with very niche builds. Stop pretending this isn't so and start doing something about it. Either completely remove trading and up the drops, or improve the current trading scheme. There are people like me who played PoE for years and never got a single exalt drop or top tier unique. I rely on trading for my builds. I despise the current trading, with AFKs, players in different leagues who are to lazy to switch, scammers and such.

Trading in Poe was something that developed naturally, and you want to place artificial barriers around it. Stop with this nonsense, pls.

Also, no answer to the total imbalance of Life and ES? No? Ok. Wake me up when people won't be able to have characters with literally dozens of ES and kill Shaper on EZMODE, while i struggle with my ant life build, with everything but the kitchen sink in terms of items and tree wizardry in order to have a chance at surviving endgame.


The only way this could be said any better is if Moses would come down from the mountain with it written on tablets.

Anyone who disagrees is either clueless at the game, RMTer or a 20 year supporter who plays 8 hours a day.
IGN: SCHVAITZERIZER
On Labirinth.

I like it as it is. I like it a lot. It's beautiful thing, so cool and challenging. When I beat Izaro for the first time I felt satisfaction. When I first time beat Uber Izaro - S_A_T_I_S_F_A_C_T_I_O_N. Just think about it, Labirinth is like an adventure you can start at any moment with big challenges and big rewards. You don't need to collect sacrifice fragments first as for Atziri vizit, for example, just offering, and here we go.

And having Ascendancy behind Labirinth is very fair. You should prove that you deserve it first. Anyone could make FOTM build reading it on the forum and clear zones by right-clicking. By contrary, Labirinth is rare challenging content in the game you can't complete without using brain at all. If you say that your build is unable to do UberLab/UberIzaro, how are you going to kill The Guardians and The Shaper then?

It's only four times, and it's not story-locking, so if you're not able to do it at all you can always come into low level labs with 20-30 overlevels. And hire the carry for Uber Lab, it's very easy nowadays. And an ascension is not even mandatory at all, to be honest.
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fwd wrote:
On Labirinth.

I like it as it is. I like it a lot. It's beautiful thing, so cool and challenging. When I beat Izaro for the first time I felt satisfaction. When I first time beat Uber Izaro - S_A_T_I_S_F_A_C_T_I_O_N. Just think about it, Labirinth is like an adventure you can start at any moment with big challenges and big rewards. You don't need to collect sacrifice fragments first as for Atziri vizit, for example, just offering, and here we go.

And having Ascendancy behind Labirinth is very fair. You should prove that you deserve it first. Anyone could make FOTM build reading it on the forum and clear zones by right-clicking. By contrary, Labirinth is rare challenging content in the game you can't complete without using brain at all. If you say that your build is unable to do UberLab/UberIzaro, how are you going to kill The Guardians and The Shaper then?

It's only four times, and it's not story-locking, so if you're not able to do it at all you can always come into low level labs with 20-30 overlevels. And hire the carry for Uber Lab, it's very easy nowadays. And an ascension is not even mandatory at all, to be honest.

I agree. +++++

I was going to point something around lab too ( instead of only trade ) but you did.

Lab is perfectly fine the way it is now. It's a huge part of the economy as well, not only ascendancys. Lab is and for what I see will forever be a fun and good way to make currency. No doubt of that.

Lots of work to make lab work the way it is now, no reason to change anything. ++++
Ruining Path of Exile balance since 2014
Last edited by imLuCaSsS on Mar 26, 2017, 11:42:24 PM
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Chris wrote:

"Are Kitava and the Beast the same entity? The Karui appear to be pretty sure that they're the same, but some things, like the Pantheon image, seem to imply otherwise."

They are not the same entity.



All this doom and gloom about the Labyrinth and trade improvements and this has not stood out to anyone? This is some juicy info regarding the upcoming lore. I eagerly await more.
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This is some juicy info regarding the upcoming lore. I eagerly await more.
More gods to punch in the face? eh... okay, I guess. Juicy, if you say so.
And worst change is putting almost all bosses in new version of maps into fucking small areas, where you can't kite well or dodge stuff. What a terrible idiot invented that I want say to him: dude flick you, seriously flick you very much.

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