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You can't use a WP until you've been their anyways, so you do "Explore" the map in order to find it... not sure I am following the issue here. "the premier Action RPG for hardcore gamers." -GGG Happy hunting/fishing	Posted by Wittgenstein on Feb 10, 2012, 6:51:57 PM Alpha Member Quote this Post
" Wittgenstein wrote: You can't use a WP until you've been their anyways, so you do "Explore" the map in order to find it... not sure I am following the issue here. We're not talking about waypoints. We're talking about the fact that the map shows the existence of all areas adjacent to the ones you've been to. I don't think it's appropriate that the map should show everything, especially the otherwise well hidden areas like the Cave in Old Fields. Last edited by Strill on Feb 11, 2012, 4:52:26 AM	Posted by Strill on Feb 11, 2012, 4:49:42 AM Quote this Post
Gameplay-wise, it adds no real information to what the old waypoint-list had given (you have seen all unexplored waypoints there), the only single point within this, is that you now get an idea in which direction they come (especially for act 2) - and that is what the change is made for. The other point, with the Cave in the old fields, takes one possible surprise out of your first run - I also found it just in a second way through. But, its only marginal different to the side areas in the Mud Flats and the Underground Passage - because of the taller design there is the chance to miss the entrance simply somewhat lower. And, its only an issue until you first find it, after this you know that its there. Maybe, they could implement a sequence with an NPC, which talks about something there, and before that talk, its not shown in the map, (even not as missing quest/area)? invited by timer @ 10.12.2011 -- deutsche Community: www.exiled.eu & ts.exiled.eu	Posted by Mr_Cee on Feb 11, 2012, 6:00:18 AM Quote this Post
" Mr_Cee wrote: Gameplay-wise, it adds no real information to what the old waypoint-list had given (you have seen all unexplored waypoints there), the only single point within this, is that you now get an idea in which direction they come (especially for act 2) - and that is what the change is made for. That's not true at all. The old system only showed you that waypoints exist. This system shows you where every map adjacent to one you've been to is, regardless of whether it's required for a quest. I don't want to be shown everything. I want to find it for myself. " The other point, with the Cave in the old fields, takes one possible surprise out of your first run - I also found it just in a second way through. But, its only marginal different to the side areas in the Mud Flats and the Underground Passage - because of the taller design there is the chance to miss the entrance simply somewhat lower. And, its only an issue until you first find it, after this you know that its there. I'm sorry you don't enjoy exploration. No need to ruin it for the rest of us. " Maybe, they could implement a sequence with an NPC, which talks about something there, and before that talk, its not shown in the map, (even not as missing quest/area)? What part of "Exploration is fun" do you not understand? Last edited by Strill on Feb 11, 2012, 4:52:04 PM	Posted by Strill on Feb 11, 2012, 4:51:13 PM Quote this Post
" Strill wrote: That's not true at all. The old system only showed you that waypoints exist. This system shows you where every map adjacent to one you've been to is, regardless of whether it's required for a quest. I don't want to be shown everything. I want to find it for myself. That more information was demanded by a lot of the people, not from me(!) - I also could live with the old system well, but I tried to explain why its no real loss: 1) if you made your first run through normal, you (could) know how the maps are bound. 2) if you use the new map, you see (before your first own exploration) nothing more than that there is one (maybe) quest-related place between forest camp and crosroads (for example). When you found the Cave on your own for the first time, it comes the same. (yes, there is a little bit of loss in surprise, but I call it marginal, and therefor my suggestion to make such things be hinged on some previous effort, like talking to NPC) 3) The directions of the bound areas in act 2 could been taken from the ingame help and the explanations you could get from the quest givers, its only somewhat clearer, more visible now. Thats one point I meaned with "not much information added". " Strill wrote: I'm sorry you don't enjoy exploration. No need to ruin it for the rest of us. You completely missunderstood my thoughts - I do enjoy very well too, I mostly clear everything for a 100% just to miss nothing! (and for not beeing surprised by an attack from the back) ^^ " Strill wrote: What part of "Exploration is fun" do you not understand? What part of "I try to prevent the map from talking to much" did you not understand? ^^ invited by timer @ 10.12.2011 -- deutsche Community: www.exiled.eu & ts.exiled.eu	Posted by Mr_Cee on Feb 12, 2012, 7:23:43 AM Quote this Post
" Mr_Cee wrote: " Strill wrote: That's not true at all. The old system only showed you that waypoints exist. This system shows you where every map adjacent to one you've been to is, regardless of whether it's required for a quest. I don't want to be shown everything. I want to find it for myself. That more information was demanded by a lot of the people, not from me(!) - I also could live with the old system well, but I tried to explain why its no real loss: 1) if you made your first run through normal, you (could) know how the maps are bound. 2) if you use the new map, you see (before your first own exploration) nothing more than that there is one (maybe) quest-related place between forest camp and crosroads (for example). When you found the Cave on your own for the first time, it comes the same. (yes, there is a little bit of loss in surprise, but I call it marginal, and therefor my suggestion to make such things be hinged on some previous effort, like talking to NPC) 3) The directions of the bound areas in act 2 could been taken from the ingame help and the explanations you could get from the quest givers, its only somewhat clearer, more visible now. Thats one point I meaned with "not much information added". " Strill wrote: I'm sorry you don't enjoy exploration. No need to ruin it for the rest of us. You completely missunderstood my thoughts - I do enjoy very well too, I mostly clear everything for a 100% just to miss nothing! (and for not beeing surprised by an attack from the back) ^^ " Strill wrote: What part of "Exploration is fun" do you not understand? What part of "I try to prevent the map from talking to much" did you not understand? ^^ That information wasn't demanded by anyone! What people demanded was to see where the quest locations are. How many times do I have to repeat myself?	Posted by Strill on Feb 12, 2012, 8:53:45 AM Quote this Post
As I've seen on a run yesterday: you see not, how many areas are between your last waypoint and the next in a desired direction (for example: the waypoint in the Chambers of Bones moved from level 1 to 2, not visible in the ui map) Even the broken connection at the blocking tree (explained in the UI) is invisible as long as you not meet the tree yourself. With this new explored facts, combined with the moved waypoints, its even more my impression: All information "added" with the new UI are some directions - what the people wanted!? invited by timer @ 10.12.2011 -- deutsche Community: www.exiled.eu & ts.exiled.eu	Posted by Mr_Cee on Feb 13, 2012, 12:38:41 PM Quote this Post