Players have x% less recovery...

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Goldarm5 wrote:

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Natharias wrote:

That means that you need to make a build that either:

1. Doesn't do all one thing.

or

2. Find a way to go around that counter.

You even say it yourself, you have to build around it. And Im perfectly fine with counters, but for example the Bloodmagic map mod with CI. If you cant somehow reduce your manacost to 0 you just cant do it. You can have a fine CI build that doesnt just specialize in one and only one thing, but if you cant get manacost to 0 you still cant do it.

Another example a build that needs elemental status ailments can be made completly useless by just one map mod. Its fine that some optional bosses cant be done with this, but whole maps?

So like the CI example just let us have other map mods that would be like:"You can do this map if you dont have Elemental Overload Keystone not allocated." I mean, you could just spec out of it. Sounds nice, right?


What Id like to see would be like: "1 mob per pack has a permanent proximity shield"
It wouldnt require you to change your build, but to kill that monster or probably even that pack you would have togo into melee range instead of offscreening it.

So it's fine that one mod makes a build unable to do an amazingly one whole map, yet it's perfectly fine for players to have access to the same thing?

Does CI not render one of five types of damage a non-issue? Chaos damage can easily kill other characters and some builds are highly susceptible to it.

The proximity shield does the same thing as an immunity. It forces a ranged build, who will almost always have fewer defenses than a melee, to get up close and personal or force them to find a method to bypass that shield.

What you're typing tells me you're okay with half of any possible hard-counters but not okay with the other half. I suggest you read what you're posting.

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adghar wrote:

I just personally prefer the alternatives to be readily available and/or active. With Life Regeneration, there are ways to build a character on regen and make it really strong. When you run into a No Life Regeneration mod, you lose a significant part of your power (or you skip the mod), with no real substitute option. Like your D2 example, you could get around an elemental immunity by changing to a different ability, as easy as one button press. With Life Regeneration builds, you can't press a button to switch to a comparable mechanic. I guess you could spec for leech as well, but you still miss out on a lot of power.

It's not just "press one button and now can beat content haha".

I never said that.

I said that you had to choose what skills you used and had to consciously switch between them. The side effect, which also helps, is that it makes players think about blending skills and their effects together. An enemy in D2 that was vulnerable to lightning and cold damage meant a sorceress could spam Static Field to bring them down, then use a large AOE cold spell, like Frozen Orb, to kill the entire screen. Much, much more than one button press. Fewer if you pumped Static Field with points so the range actually covered the screen.

How do you get the idea proximity shield is a hard-counter? I would think of a normal counter of it, because you can just play around. A hard-counter means for me something that is just straight impossible for you to do without changing your build so much that its becoming another build.

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Goldarm5 wrote:

How do you get the idea proximity shield is a hard-counter? I would think of a normal counter of it, because you can just play around. A hard-counter means for me something that is just straight impossible for you to do without changing your build so much that its becoming another build.

So a build that relies on killing enemies at range isn't even slightly at risk to a proximity shield?

Well, there goes the discussion people.

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So a build that relies on killing enemies at range isn't even slightly at risk to a proximity shield?

Well, there goes the discussion people.

I never said that such a build isnt at risk. But you said it right, this build will be at a risk and you have to adjust your gameplay (but not your build) towards that. Like I already said enough times I would prefer map mods that you have to play around instead of build around. And that's exactly the point of such map mods. If you dont do a map because it has certain mods it should be because you dont think you have enough skill to do and not because your build cant mechanically do it.

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Goldarm5 wrote:

"

So a build that relies on killing enemies at range isn't even slightly at risk to a proximity shield?

Well, there goes the discussion people.

I never said that such a build isnt at risk. But you said it right, this build will be at a risk and you have to adjust your gameplay (but not your build) towards that. Like I already said enough times I would prefer map mods that you have to play around instead of build around. And that's exactly the point of such map mods. If you dont do a map because it has certain mods it should be because you dont think you have enough skill to do and not because your build cant mechanically do it.

...and how does a ranged build not change their build and engage an enemy that can only be engaged in melee?

They don't.

Or you can tell me how they do, but I'll tell you now that you cannot do such a thing in PoE.

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Vipermagi wrote:

All you have to do is move closer. Not quite the same as 'changing your build'.

Yeah, into Molten Strike, Earthquake, Ground Slam, Ice Crash, Static Strike, Sunder (omg a ranged melee skill), and a few other skill's ranges.