Can we have flashback events in the permanent SC/HC?

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kcstar wrote:

Any thoughts, Anu?

My thoughts are, we can spitball ideas that would work but who are we kidding?

GGG are not going to move from their bribe-deprive design.

You can offer people money to stand in the rain.

People will.

You can fool yourself that people like standing in the rain. (they like free money).

"

TheAnuhart wrote:

"

kcstar wrote:

Any thoughts, Anu?

My thoughts are, we can spitball ideas that would work but who are we kidding?

GGG are not going to move from their bribe-deprive design.

You can offer people money to stand in the rain.

People will.

You can fool yourself that people like standing in the rain. (they like free money).

Wow! That was... depressing.

But I know what you are saying... since the last (two) Q&As it was like the scales fell from my eyes.
"Custom leagues" are a thing... if we pay for them. Only if people pay money, in advance, it's a sign for ggg this is something people would like to have. Maybe these type of events are something like 'teasers' what you can get if you pay more $$$ to GGG. That's not p2w... it's pay2havefun.

"

kcstar wrote:

"

TheAnuhart wrote:

"

kcstar wrote:

Any thoughts, Anu?

My thoughts are, we can spitball ideas that would work but who are we kidding?

GGG are not going to move from their bribe-deprive design.

You can offer people money to stand in the rain.

People will.

You can fool yourself that people like standing in the rain. (they like free money).

Wow! That was... depressing.

But I know what you are saying... since the last (two) Q&As it was like the scales fell from my eyes.
"Custom leagues" are a thing... if we pay for them. Only if people pay money, in advance, it's a sign for ggg this is something people would like to have. Maybe these type of events are something like 'teasers' what you can get if you pay more $$$ to GGG. That's not p2w... it's pay2havefun.

I just really, REALLLY dislike it when devs try to funnel players to play a certain way.

I'm all for temp leagues, I know how people love ladder rests and fresh economies. I just think if that's what people want then great, but there is no reason to then have other things exclusive to those leagues. Or more to the point, having those other things NOT in other leagues running parallel for no other reason than bribery to get people who wouldn't normally play a temp league for ladder or economy reset, to do so.

Fuck, I hate that design, lol.

"

TheAnuhart wrote:

I just really, REALLLY dislike it when devs try to funnel players to play a certain way.

I'm all for temp leagues, I know how people love ladder rests and fresh economies. I just think if that's what people want then great, but there is no reason to then have other things exclusive to those leagues. Or more to the point, having those other things NOT in other leagues running parallel for no other reason than bribery to get people who wouldn't normally play a temp league for ladder or economy reset, to do so.

Fuck, I hate that design, lol.

Sad part is I feed the troll that is GGG. :C

I dislike a fresh start because of the leveling (and trading o.O)
I dislike the new mods most of the time, untested, unbalanced, sometimes really annoying.

... but still... they got me with 'maybe talisman will not transit into perma'. We are not talking about mtx stuff... things that are nice to have, or 2-3 league specific items you can get later or a league mod you can later use with zana. This announcement really pissed me, no matter if they now put it into the game or not. I feel lesser forced to play 'their way' if it's just mtx.


I have played a lot of temps and a lot of these 'reward' leagues... league after league I get the feeling these league die out faster and faster. The 'rewards' seem to be just a hopeless case to stop this progress. I can only speak for hc... but speaking with my f-list in mind the same thing seems to happen in sc too.

These leagues need to evolve over time while they last or it's just a case of 'ok, I've seen everything new, now move on to maps, aaaaa, bought all rewards, maps still the same, kk cu next league'.

... and while they cater only to this mentality (and a few goetz'es) they leave people in perma league playing this game without extra rewards for years while hopeing they were once noticed by GGG.

@theanuhart

Just because people mainly play or the only things that HAVE to be done in a new temp league is the things you mentioned, ladder reset, fresh economy, ect doesn't mean you should take away the things from the temp leagues that make it special, its the combination of EVERYTHING that makes it desirable to be played and its the whole package that keeps people coming back league after league.

Its not just bribery, I explained it had to do with testing, we've seen various league idea that basically get pushed to the side or nerfed down to irrelevance when added to the main game. Imagine trying to progress as a long term character (well thats not already 100) and GGG adds invasion bosses to every zone that are overtunned or that every zone had beyond when leveling. Its quite clear that many of these league ideas are better suited to be implemented into specific things, rather then the core of the game. The temp leagues allows those players that choice. In terms of what I said above about having choice I was addressing your point that the league idea could just be applied to standard at the same time and NOT gated behind a free zana mod, that cannot and will not happen because the nature of the mods implemented and the fact that no one would be able to escape the mods if it were global during that duration. So sorry, you are simply wrong to say that there is NO reason to not run the mods in standard at the same time, there are reasons, perhaps your level 100 character might not give 2 shits about, but many people would.

You also hate many aspects of the game because it doesn't cater to your 'stupid' playstyle. That has been clear via your posting in every thread you do. I frankly don't think any changes should ever be made exclusively to cater to your specific playstyle, you want something niche to appeal, you pay. Dev time isn't worth it for a game that was designed to have player interaction and ladder resets, neither of which you participate in.

"

... but still... they got me with 'maybe talisman will not transit into perma'. We are not talking about mtx stuff... things that are nice to have, or 2-3 league specific items you can get later or a league mod you can later use with zana. This announcement really pissed me, no matter if they now put it into the game or not. I feel lesser forced to play 'their way' if it's just mtx.

Well TBH it doesn't matter if talisman makes it into the main game because its current implementation is shit. I know I won't bother doing anything special in future leagues unless they vastly change the way the system works. As for the MTX you really shouldn't give 2 shits, you already have the best armor set in the game.

"

I have played a lot of temps and a lot of these 'reward' leagues... league after league I get the feeling these league die out faster and faster.

They are dieing out faster and faster, some of it is because of rarity changes the other part of it is just terrible temp league idea. Its even worst now considering I can't go to SC temp league and actually play some other new and interesting idea I'm stuck with the same idea regardless of where I go. Playing in standard for me at this point is just boring because I don't wish to play the specific playstyles that are enjoyable there and looting items which compared to their non nerfed counterparts (that i already have in my stash) seems rather pointless.

"

These leagues need to evolve over time while they last or it's just a case of 'ok, I've seen everything new, now move on to maps, aaaaa, bought all rewards, maps still the same, kk cu next league'.

They absolutely don't need to evolve over time or something like that. All of the league content should be added and not changed by the end of the first month. Much like running events having the league change over time just promotes participation the wrong way.

One idea that DID work out and wasn't an "evolve" type thing was warbands and tempest, after all the content was added there was incentive to play almost all aspects of the game, which changed every hour. That sort of thing is fine because experiencing the league 2 weeks in with the corrupting tempest is the same as experiencing it 6 weeks in. I'm assuming this isn't what you had in mind when you made your comment, if this is then :/

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and while they cater only to this mentality (and a few goetz'es) they leave people in perma league playing this game without extra rewards for years while hopeing they were once noticed by GGG.

And playing in perm league allows for people to avoid many of the challenges that temp league players face. No doing talisman isn't really difficult when leveling (after they fixed bonspire or whatever) but that sort of stuff is much easier when you are already equipped with legacy items\mods\ect. Implementing the full league idea to standard wouldn't be a "savior" or help spark anymore interest in standard then usual because the challenge league stuff is only typically a challenge because you aren't fully geared. In terms of extra rewards its because players refresh with a new economy, no legacy items, no prior wealth that they are rewarded with league specific items in temp leagues, that incentive must remain exclusive or it removes one of the key factors of temp leagues. Like I said there is a very good reason why the zana mod for the current league is expensive, even if its probably "too expensive".

The incentive to play perm league should be and has always been long term character progression. If you can't find the incentive to play there over anywhere else then perhaps it means you don't wish to play in a stale league with overpowered items.

Nope, you are supposed to be punished for playing in standard, you just can't have it all! :D










... right?

But on the real though, it would have to be optional, as you can't force it on players.

I like the OP's idea, but this is the quote from Q&A

"

Will there be more incentive to play permanent leagues? As of now playing permanent leagues seems quite pointless.

We don't feel we need to add additional incentives. More than 100,000 of our players play in permanent leagues as their main leagues and don't play the challenge leagues. They like the permanent leagues because their progress is not interrupted, there is potentially easier access to certain items, and they may have interesting legacy stuff from the past they can enjoy. We try to roll content back into the main game and make sure that actual expansion content (like The Awakening and Ascendancy) is available in all leagues, of course.

I don't think GGG will do anything special for permanent leagues more than regular updates and expansions.

"

goetzjam wrote:

take away

Dude, nothing was being taken away.

NOTHING.


As for 'testing' no.

They are not tested, the version that goes into the core game is so different, it isn't the result of testing.

And even if it was, this 'testing' that is all fine and good to be done in the temp league can be done in the optional, parallel.


I mean, it's not like they even need to do any work. They fucking done it already and do every time. It's there, now




but with a ridiculous 3 ex cost. Like wtf?
Just make the current league mod free while the league is running and then add to the pay for crafts after. It's even costing the base +8% quantity.

Reading the rest of your post, you just went even more into the realm of Ihaventreadanything and none of it makes any sense.

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TheAnuhart wrote:

"

goetzjam wrote:

take away

Dude, nothing was being taken away.

NOTHING.


As for 'testing' no.

They are not tested, the version that goes into the core game is so different, it isn't the result of testing.

And even if it was, this 'testing' that is all fine and good to be done in the temp league can be done in the optional, parallel.


I mean, it's not like they even need to do any work. They fucking done it already and do every time. It's there, now




but with a ridiculous 3 ex cost. Like wtf?
Just make the current league mod free while the league is running and then add to the pay for crafts after. It's even costing the base +8% quantity.

Reading the rest of your post, you just went even more into the realm of Ihaventreadanything and none of it makes any sense.

The exclusivity of the temp leagues being the only way to experience the league is technically taking away from the temp league experience.

The result is because of "testing" somethings make it into the game in its complete entirety even if its toned down a bit, strongboxes best example there.


None of it makes an sense because you never play temp leagues. Not that whole response was just to you, the person it was to will understand the counter argument there.


Ultimately it doesn't matter because they won't do it, your missing the complete package thing for temp leagues, take away part of the package and you remove the draw to play in the temp leagues and if you think temp league activity is low now when people spend about a month to experience the league, imagine how much less it would be if you had a fully geared character you could experience the content in.

Many people play this game because of the COMBINATION of everything in temp leagues, if you don't get its the COMBINATION of all the things that are necessary to keep the temp league and more importantly the game active and have draw to you then I don't think you ever will get it. No everyone is cutout for your play standard 24\7 solo self-found experience, nor is that the game design. If you want to experience the new temp league idea in its entirety you play the temp leagues, no further explanation needed.

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Ashen_Shugar_IV wrote:

What kind of reaction from the general playerbase would you expect if the next Challenge Leagues were voided?

All temp leagues should be Void Leagues imho , if people are "up for the challenge" like they claim they won't complain at all.

Thing is 90% of the people playing these leagues are there for 1 purpose only , to flip items and currency .

This is why Temp leagues should be void , this will fix tons of issues for the permanent leagues .