Excited about subclasses, but Juggernaut is laughable

Undeniable and unbreakable allow you to skip the usual RT and UW opening up variety, unstoppable rules, end charges are grand, the only one that seems weak is the fortify bonus one. I have a lot more complaints about the slayer subclass than I ever will juggernaut.
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Dark_Chicken wrote:


Well, for life builds frozen/chill isn't that big of an issue than for ES especially for 2h cyc which I've played extensively. Definitely having freeze immune makes Juggy more attractive than at first look, but for 2h cyc, I would probably still lean toward having fortify or the rare/unique dmg boost and other Duelist keystones.
how many temp chains+chilled ground maps did you run with 2H cyclone ?
Last edited by grepman on Nov 21, 2015, 4:36:51 PM
Jugg is very good imo. freeze/temp chains immunity, +1000 accuracy so you can dump RT and build some crit if you want, double body armour value...

It's just that some others are just so ridiculous that it looks laughable in comparison. 100% block to spells? Crits ignore ele resists? Dafuq?
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Fauxite wrote:
Jugg is very good imo. freeze/temp chains immunity, +1000 accuracy so you can dump RT and build some crit if you want, double body armour value...

It's just that some others are just so ridiculous that it looks laughable in comparison. 100% block to spells? Crits ignore ele resists? Dafuq?

there are definitely some keystones that are opieop, but I think those two that you mentioned arent too bad. 100% block to spellblock is very nice, but you still need to invest in block to make that work

crits ignore ele resists might sound really, really good at first, but then most crit stuff is on the right side of the tree and you cant make the resists negative via cursing or EE. even worse, most mobs have either little (30 max) or no resists, with mostly a few bosses and specific mobs overcapped or even having more than 30% ele res. just some food for thought.
imagine youre running with a tri curser who uses ele weakness/flammability/assassins mark to curse shit and then you deal a crit...that actually will deal less base damage than a non-crit (of course your crit damage will overcompensate but still)
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grepman wrote:
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Fauxite wrote:
Jugg is very good imo. freeze/temp chains immunity, +1000 accuracy so you can dump RT and build some crit if you want, double body armour value...

It's just that some others are just so ridiculous that it looks laughable in comparison. 100% block to spells? Crits ignore ele resists? Dafuq?

there are definitely some keystones that are opieop, but I think those two that you mentioned arent too bad. 100% block to spellblock is very nice, but you still need to invest in block to make that work

crits ignore ele resists might sound really, really good at first, but then most crit stuff is on the right side of the tree and you cant make the resists negative via cursing or EE. even worse, most mobs have either little (30 max) or no resists, with mostly a few bosses and specific mobs overcapped or even having more than 30% ele res. just some food for thought.
imagine youre running with a tri curser who uses ele weakness/flammability/assassins mark to curse shit and then you deal a crit...that actually will deal less base damage than a non-crit (of course your crit damage will overcompensate but still)


Just out of curiosity, which keystones do you think are more opieop than these?
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Fauxite wrote:
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grepman wrote:
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Fauxite wrote:
Jugg is very good imo. freeze/temp chains immunity, +1000 accuracy so you can dump RT and build some crit if you want, double body armour value...

It's just that some others are just so ridiculous that it looks laughable in comparison. 100% block to spells? Crits ignore ele resists? Dafuq?

there are definitely some keystones that are opieop, but I think those two that you mentioned arent too bad. 100% block to spellblock is very nice, but you still need to invest in block to make that work

crits ignore ele resists might sound really, really good at first, but then most crit stuff is on the right side of the tree and you cant make the resists negative via cursing or EE. even worse, most mobs have either little (30 max) or no resists, with mostly a few bosses and specific mobs overcapped or even having more than 30% ele res. just some food for thought.
imagine youre running with a tri curser who uses ele weakness/flammability/assassins mark to curse shit and then you deal a crit...that actually will deal less base damage than a non-crit (of course your crit damage will overcompensate but still)


Just out of curiosity, which keystones do you think are more opieop than these?

I think I mightve written in this thread, but:

1. endless munitions (+1 arrow, +20% to AOE radius, 200 accuracy and far shot [up 30% MORE damage to far targt as #2 keystone in that path] on the way)

2. deadly fusion (70% crit multi, 3.5% BASE crit chance with 7 power charges [and every non-crit has 10% chance to generate power charges on the way])

3. at least in current version of how offerings work, mistress of sacrifice for 2 points is pretty insane. bone offering can give you 35% spell block and regular block. lets put it that way, if you have a regular 28% block shield with no shield nodes, that gladiator passive gives you 28% spell block for 4 points. necromancer can have a 63% block/34% spellblock with just two points. of course it wont be 100% uptime, but still
Last edited by grepman on Nov 21, 2015, 10:22:03 PM
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grepman wrote:
crits ignore ele resists might sound really, really good at first, but then most crit stuff is on the right side of the tree and you cant make the resists negative via cursing or EE. even worse, most mobs have either little (30 max) or no resists, with mostly a few bosses and specific mobs overcapped or even having more than 30% ele res. just some food for thought.


Suppose you're running rare high level maps with resist/curse immune/EE without a support on an ele attack build. It's really really good, ele and phys conversion builds will rarely be able to use a penetration gem. Many people will choose Enfeeble/Warlord's Mark as their curse to be able to survive anyway.

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grepman wrote:
necromancer can have a 63% block/34% spellblock with just two points. of course it wont be 100% uptime, but still


It also doesn't come free. You have to give up a big damage boost in Flesh Offering. Barely anyone uses Bone Offering right now as their go to, doesn't really benefit SRS. And most summoners don't use a shield. But I agree it's really strong.

Crit sweep huh?
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Dark_Chicken wrote:

Unbreakable - Why? Unwavering stance




I think unwavering stance is a terrible node though, I take it on a CI build and its the only build I take it on. Evasion is just too good for melee, even just a small amount of it like 3-4k.

Unbreakable is really strong for a 2h build with no shield. Im gonna move my 2h axe build to marauder for sure, and Ill take juggernaut unless one of the other marauder trees is better. Ill get over 6k armour from unbreakable, which will put me at around 17k armour + 13.5k evasion, unflinching will take it to 8 endurance charges and then unstoppable because cyclone and fuck temp chains/chilled maps. I think its going to be pretty hard for the other 2 trees to be better for what I want.

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