Player feedback on trading (both sides welcome)

"

EzBreesy wrote:

The vendor system is fine but the trading system is aweful.
Having to use third party software to sell items is a true pain and may put people away from the game.

I don't see yet any bad side of auction house.

I agree and this "HAS" put me away from this game on more than one occasion, I keep coming back hoping they have added an auction house, they haven't so I check out what else they have added, and than by the time I have it checked out, I remember that trading for me in this game is a no no and I take a long break again, at least 4 months long.

What I am against (and consider most free people should be against) is being against another's freedom. This means that I do not want a system which prevents me from talking to the other individual and also do not want a system which forces me to talk to the other guy if I don't need to. It should allow people to trade how they personally want.

Problem with poe.trade is "This site is fan-made and not affiliated with Grinding Gear Games in any way.". So, trading the way poe.trade allows is not endorsed by GGG.

On a side note, trading should also not be the only way to gain access to certain items (relying exclusively on RNG is just bad). At this time, if you want to develop a specific build, you may never get all the parts for it. People who want the challenge of being self-sufficient should be able to do it as working hard for an item is much more rewarding than just trading for it for many people (masters get you most of the way there, but there are still many non accessible items). I am mentioning this because people who like to trade DEPEND on other players HAVING to trade with them as much as possible. So while not directly a trade issue, if you removed this aspect (somehow not requiring people to trade), you would see a much different requirement of what the trading system should be.

In the end, the system should meet its users requirements. Mine are :
- Asynchronous trading when trading with or for currency
- On-line status linked to the account (not the character) which does not require the character to step out of his instance for supporting non currency based trading
- Functional item search

"

EzBreesy wrote:

"

goetzjam wrote:

Anyone that uses trade chat or party board as arguments that the "system' sucks is just ignorant. The "system" people are talking about is using poe.trade and one of the 3rd party programs.

Did you just read what you wrote or play the game at all ? Having the party board screwed is the direct result of the actual in game trading system who is inexistant, hence players who don't want to use poe.trade to sell items 95% of players screw the public party.

I've talked with some players telling me they vendore ilvl70 unique because they don't want to waste their time with this "trading system".

Yup, I vendor stuff I shouldn't too, because of the trading system. Its not worth my time or effort and I dont feel like participating in it.

With an auction house, I could just put something up on there and not have to worry about it, if someone wants it, cool, if not than no big deal. Without an auction house, I either vendor or fill up my stash and end up taking long breaks from this game because I dont like using the current trading methods.

Auction house has the clear disadvantage, that people will start underprice each other. The market from Games like Final Fantasy 14 and Guild Wars 2 suffer alot from having an auction house. At some point, items aren't worth shit anymore, except the REAL good ones (like ultra rare uniques in PoE). I don't know if an auction house would be the real solution...

What I would like to see is an integrated version of PoE.xyz. You can search for specific items with specific stats, but the shop WON'T show you any price and people you put there items in the shop system can't set prices or names. This way, people still have to chat with each other and haggle for a price.

"

Did you just read what you wrote or play the game at all ?

Nope I just have spent over $1k on supporter packs for a game I don't play. I just did a detailed explaination of how trading works in the first post, but don't play the game. If you STILL think that I don't or haven't play the game just check out my characters, I am literally the 1% of PoE players.

[Removed by Support] you have have a low level ilevel 70 unqiue that isn't worth more then an alch or chaos for some people, that isn't and shouldn't be worth the time to sell. Its actually quite funny you didn't mention the unqiue as it would have been clearer to why it isn't worth the time to sell.

"

Its not worth my time or effort and I dont feel like participating in it.

Then why should you be rewarded with a system that caters to a larger playerbase, honestly use arguments against the system, because if you read the original post (you probably didn't) you would understand that I am asking GGG to integrate the ability to search for and list items in the game, without adding the ability to automatically buy items.

"

With an auction house, I could just put something up on there and not have to worry about it, if someone wants it, cool, if not than no big deal. Without an auction house, I either vendor or fill up my stash and end up taking long breaks from this game because I dont like using the current trading methods.

And this is why an AH is terrible. You don't give a fuck what you get in return as long as you hopefully get something. Everyone will do the same and items that are worth 10c now, then become 5c because it takes no work and no investment into selling something. Not to mention the increased supply on the market means that your item that would be worth 10c now is worth less because of inflation of items.

Non-automation enables people that are willing to spend such a small amount of time in pricing items and listing items to be rewarded with the sales. An automation system is just a clusterfuck that doesn't reward anyone properly in the end.


@ace

What you are suggesting is actually "worst" in terms of convenience that I am suggesting. I dont think requiring people to haggle is the right approach, but giving them the option is. For example in an automated system theres no haggling at all, in the current system, even though people have b\os you can haggle with them.



Again people I specifically requested this thread NOT be another circle jerk on AH's or automation, but rather constructively give feedback on the current system, your experiences and how my suggestion (or others that aren't AH's) can be implemented into the game to help people trade.

I've given up on maintaining a shop. It's just too much dicking around, and I just want to play. Overall the process of accumulating wealth (missing trade features, overly-micro 3c recipe) it not enjoyable in PoE.

The gameplay and build-depth however are great, and keep me playing.

"

MrTremere wrote:

"

goetzjam wrote:

Again people I specifically requested this thread NOT be another circle jerk on AH's or automation, but rather constructively give feedback on the current system, your experiences and how my suggestion (or others that aren't AH's) can be implemented into the game to help people trade.

Should I say that I request this thread NOT to be another circle jerk on how the current system is fine, and the only thing that can and should be done is moving the available tools to GGG?

It's not because you don't like one of the recurring ideas that you should automatically dismiss it. There isn't a single version of AH, and the way poe.trade currently works is really close to the version you seem to dislike so much. By the way, don't think that poe.trade wouldn't automate the trades if they were able to.

Your phrasing is terrible. Seriously it was really hard to read that.

Its not that I dislike the idea (although I do) I don't want this discussion to end up like every other trade thread ever. Which is 2 sides circle jerking on automatic trade, specifically an AH. Feel free to necro one of those threads or make a separate one specifically regarding that.

I've personally covered in this thread all I want to about an AH, GGG has said in the past, specifically after the D3 AH was going to be or was taken down they would never do it. Not to mention it doesn't align with the principles or idea of the game.

So request all you want (and discuss all you want) in a separate thread, but keep that shit out of this one.

I'm looking for experiences first and foremost regarding the current system, arguments for or against various (not AH systems) or what QoL things can be added to improve the game.


If poe.trade could automate it they probably would, that doesn't mean it would be the right call or GGG should automatically do it. I would guess the majority of players that play this game are lazy and don't care to spend 5 seconds to do anything they dont "want to"


I've spoken specifically to why GGG should and can never do an automated system, aka AH (really buyout house) and like I said they have said they would never do it. That alone should be enough to keep the circle jerk away.


Now if you have some experiences or suggestions that don't "destroy" or remove the current system I am open to hear them. That is after all why I created this thread.

I think its clear that if the current system could all be done within game, aside from the one off forum post of items that actually don't have b\o's trading would be much better for everyone, which is why I suggested it.

There have been ideas posted about QoL things that can and will improve trading as well, such as putting time limits on trade chat spam. Adding a separate tab on the party board if people want to list items for sale.

Those are improvements that can make the current system better I don't use the current one as much as a lot of people, but it is quite clear it works whenever people spend the little time needed in order to setup a shop or find items. Removing the 3rd party element would be a huge step in the right direction for improving trading, following the rest of the QoL suggestions made as well would make trading much better.

Ultimately the bones of the system is fine, I've said it before and I will say it again, an AH is not a trade system, its a trade system replacement. The current system has good bones it just needs to be finished.

Trade in game is broken it needs a 3rd party program to work.
The minimun they need to do is port it to the game itself and make more easy and a good tutorial.