Kickstarter Campaign for PoE's Optional Self Found League!

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Deadpeng wrote:

I thought the point was clear in that SFL thread. Everyone was saying that the intention of the SFL league was pure and sincere until we read 'slightly increased drop rate'.

Seriously to hell man. The motive is just about an easier game. With that, everyone including me will migrate there since it is easier to play.

lol no is not trading is ez as shit mode. i definity wont play sfl. whole reason i came here was trade from d3

but let em have it they'll learn frustration of rng builds no min maxing etc

u want proof? go to d3 forum they still cry about drops even though it rains ...because u can never get exactly what u want w/o trade

i say u could bump drops in sfl by an order of magnitude and regular ladder will hit 100 way before sfl...trade is that much easier.

hell i only played 2 maps and then uber with my incinerate witch in sig all made posssible by trade.

Seriously, If you want a SFL youve got to promote it as "ultra-hardcore."

So this would mean stuff like:
Character only stashes: Self Found (Character) rather than Self Found (Player)
Normal droprates
Account Bind on pickup (if youre going to allow party easy mode) to kill drop trading
Hardcore only
FFA loot only

Stuff like that.

GGG likes hardcore, you might need to exploit that somewhat.

B. (who thinks the whole thing is unnecessary)

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nait2k4 wrote:

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Caustic2 wrote:

Why don't HC players just play SC but delete their characters if they die? I mean, why fragment the player base n' all when they can just play HC in standard?

Put on your leather jackets and board shorts, boys, we're going shark jumping!

He raises a hell of a good point though. Fundamentally no different than a 'no-trades' league (with same drop rates as HC/Std).

The whole "they can just play X in standard" argument is exactly the same for both HC and SF.

The drop rate thing is just a red herring. I play solo self found in HC mostly except when I'm having connection problems or playing in my sleep. Why solo? Because in HC even, an SF is gimpy compared to a bought gear build and I don't want to be a leech.

Self found is very interesting and to me at least goes hand in hand with hardcore YOLO. Your builds aren't set in stone based on buying this unique and those QL20 gems, they have to adapt to what you find and what you can craft simply using vendor recipes and masters. Yes, RNG can screw you on gear just as easily as it can with killer mobs and desync, so what? Them's the breaks.

Playing self found in HC or STD lacks any sort of bragging rights, any comparisons with other players on equal footing, grouping, sharing builds, etc. Just lacks. I still do it because I'm a roguelike player and it comes natural to me, that and having to use an 3rd party site and tools to play the trading meta game is ridiculous to me.

My 2c anyhow.

12k points vs no-itemforumzyxlinking
Deal ?

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bredin wrote:

Seriously, If you want a SFL youve got to promote it as "ultra-hardcore."

So this would mean stuff like:
Character only stashes: Self Found (Character) rather than Self Found (Player)
Normal droprates
Account Bind on pickup (if youre going to allow party easy mode) to kill drop trading
Hardcore only
FFA loot only

Stuff like that.

GGG likes hardcore, you might need to exploit that somewhat.

B. (who thinks the whole thing is unnecessary)

I would play this.

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againwetryagain wrote:

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nait2k4 wrote:

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Caustic2 wrote:

Why don't HC players just play SC but delete their characters if they die? I mean, why fragment the player base n' all when they can just play HC in standard?

Put on your leather jackets and board shorts, boys, we're going shark jumping!

He raises a hell of a good point though. Fundamentally no different than a 'no-trades' league (with same drop rates as HC/Std).

The whole "they can just play X in standard" argument is exactly the same for both HC and SF.

The point has been raised before, and argued before, and debunked before.

It is far more likely that the comment was made as troll-bait, rather than as an opening for a genuine discussion. Even if the latter is the case, a read through this thread will show that the question has already been asked and covered off.

I have no strong opinion on the implementation of a SFL, I would play it if it was there (just for see and for know).

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nait2k4 wrote:

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againwetryagain wrote:

The whole "they can just play X in standard" argument is exactly the same for both HC and SF.

The point has been raised before, and argued before, and debunked before.

Raised and argued, granted; debunked, hardly.

There is, however, one argument against a SFL that I would buy, at least from GGG's perspective: Along with the cost of setting up a permanent league, there is at least one point - the per character stashes - that would require new coding. Not sure about the account binding as I think that is already done with legacy items?

So yeah, as the poster a few posts above noted, it would have to be 'harder than hard core' to fit in GGG's overall vision I guess, and then would also, from a business standpoint, have to bring in enough revenue to pay for the coding, setup, servers, etc. It would take away time and effort from GGG's current projects on what would be a gamble so, would love to see it, not holding my breath.

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bredin wrote:

Seriously, If you want a SFL youve got to promote it as "ultra-hardcore."

So this would mean stuff like:
Character only stashes: Self Found (Character) rather than Self Found (Player)
Normal droprates
Account Bind on pickup (if youre going to allow party easy mode) to kill drop trading
Hardcore only
FFA loot only

Stuff like that.

GGG likes hardcore, you might need to exploit that somewhat.

B. (who thinks the whole thing is unnecessary)

That sounds awesome, this is exactly what I would want to play the most! Very good idea!

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againwetryagain wrote:

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nait2k4 wrote:

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againwetryagain wrote:

The whole "they can just play X in standard" argument is exactly the same for both HC and SF.

The point has been raised before, and argued before, and debunked before.

Raised and argued, granted; debunked, hardly.

There is, however, one argument against a SFL that I would buy, at least from GGG's perspective: Along with the cost of setting up a permanent league, there is at least one point - the per character stashes - that would require new coding. Not sure about the account binding as I think that is already done with legacy items?

So yeah, as the poster a few posts above noted, it would have to be 'harder than hard core' to fit in GGG's overall vision I guess, and then would also, from a business standpoint, have to bring in enough revenue to pay for the coding, setup, servers, etc. It would take away time and effort from GGG's current projects on what would be a gamble so, would love to see it, not holding my breath.

Yeah, poor choice of words on my part. Perhaps defunct? I don't know - essentially what I mean is that if we go the "just delete it yo!" we'd be looking to merge the SC and HC leagues, whereas because there are already separate leagues the path of least resistance is to leave it as is :)

Don't think I don't see your point (and you make good ones), just the value of the original comment was negligible (as was my response, trolololol).

My view on few aspects:

1) "SFL would split players even more"
Players that currently play SF are already not interacting economically with others and usually same comes to parting. If not SF ppl would join such a league then they would have two options :
- not enjoy it and quit
Or
- stay in such a league which would mean current GGG vision is flewd (at least for them)

2) "SFL is same as hardcore"
For me it is because its just another game mode such as standard, hardcore and ultrahardcore(SF)

3) competition aspect
As for me current ladder is a joke, sadly. We can close our eyes but RMT is a huge problem in poe.
I would really like to be able to check myself on ladder with other people with ONLY the same possibilities. No cheating etc.
Time investment could be a problem, but in permanent league it would be solved.

4) "trading is an easy mode"

Srsly anyone sayin it is not is just plain wrong. What is harder with 50 ex in stash:
- finding shavs
Or
- buying shavs from xyz?

SFL should be just another game mode for most hardcore players. But it would mean Chris vision of PoE is wrong, resulting in never happening...