Immune to Life Leech

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Natharias wrote:

In some cases, you could just skip it. But there are some monsters in some areas that one cannot just "skip". One good instance is a mob with insane movement speed, has a shit ton of monsters, and have reflect. You're dead.

Lure him into a pack of other monsters you can leech from, and kill them together.

Just be a little creative.

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Natharias wrote:

So a build that cannot leech, should be able to kill a mob with reflect while dealing 100k or more damage?

Nice logic.

Just hilarious reading how little you comprehend of the game, tell me, do you actually play it, you have any decent or above characters?

Reflect + cannot leech is probably the worst thinkable combo, but guess what, it's about toughness vs toughness. The monster is gonna die way before you die from reflect, again unless your build is really really bad. Hence why i also suggested it to only be a rare monster affix, to avoid situations where you have a full screen of things that cannot be leeched from.

You have experienced that in the game haven't you? how much health monsters need to have if your defenses are good before you are able to kill yourself with reflect. Man so funny dudes with this hilarious blind argument then blaming everyone for having no logic can't think etc. Hah. Rofl rofl, so funny.

How about a mod that says "You can only leech back up to 20% (or x%) of your health/ES back per leech hit."

Wouldn't be too gamebreaking except against high damage builds.

You could still insta-leech, just that it caps at 20% of your health.


OR



Your leech is capped at x% against this mob. (Preferably near the reflect amount)

So it would not affect builds that get some leech as defense, but it would severely reduce the effectiveness of builds that rely purely on leech as a defense.

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Peterlerock wrote:

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Natharias wrote:

In some cases, you could just skip it. But there are some monsters in some areas that one cannot just "skip". One good instance is a mob with insane movement speed, has a shit ton of monsters, and have reflect. You're dead.

Lure him into a pack of other monsters you can leech from, and kill them together.

Just be a little creative.

Yeah, by the time you would've found another mob those enemies have desynced you enough and hit you enough that you're dead. Hence why I mentioned mobs with insane movement speed.

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Crackmonster wrote:

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Natharias wrote:

So a build that cannot leech, should be able to kill a mob with reflect while dealing 100k or more damage?

Nice logic.

Just hilarious reading how little you comprehend of the game, tell me, do you actually play it, you have any decent or above characters?

Reflect + cannot leech is probably the worst thinkable combo, but guess what, it's about toughness vs toughness. The monster is gonna die way before you die from reflect, again unless your build is really really bad. Hence why i also suggested it to only be a rare monster affix, to avoid situations where you have a full screen of things that cannot be leeched from.

You have experienced that in the game haven't you? how much health monsters need to have if your defenses are good before you are able to kill yourself with reflect. Man so funny dudes with this hilarious blind argument then blaming everyone for having no logic can't think etc. Hah. Rofl rofl, so funny.

No, it's hilarious to see that you can't do anything but attack me. So let me tear your idiocy apart, yet again.

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Crackmonster wrote:

Reflect + cannot leech is probably the worst thinkable combo, but guess what, it's about toughness vs toughness.

In some cases yes, in others no.

Your build does 2-3 million DPS, like Shatter Chuck. Well guess what, you're so powerful that you cannot deal with any amount of reflect without leech. Each 1% yields 10k DPS worth of reflect, and seeing how there's 12% or 14% to deal with, you'll insta-rip on a single enemy.

It's obvious it is you who doesn't play this game.

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Crackmonster wrote:

Hence why i also suggested it to only be a rare monster affix, to avoid situations where you have a full screen of things that cannot be leeched from.

Then there's no problem. In fact, there's no reason for the mod at all. So what if you can't leech from a single monster?

I thought we were talking about making an affix that can be a challenge to players, not one that would be useless.

As I said. Apply the mod to a boss and see if it forces players to change their gameplay. If they can adapt and still kill the boss, the mod should be implemented. If the mod prevents most others from killing it, then it shouldn't be added.

You nicely ignore the central point, which is that the rare itself will not have enough hp for you to die by its reflect, creation your main arguments based on it, and then at the end recognize that point anyway as it suits your misguided typing, this time trying to bring it up as something pro your case.

There are many mods that only rare monsters have, generally the most powerful.

The best comparison is curse immune which does not spawn on magic monsters. That is great, works as intended, what does not work is when they add curse immune to maps that was a mistake from the very beginning.

You want the right combinations, let say cannot be leeched, extra resists/life and regen, reflect or whatever whatever to be a challenge, that's what it's all about. If you wanted 1 mod in itself to almost completely be a stopper, what happens when you combo 2-4 of those, then you simply can't do shit, which isn't ideal, it must be the right combinations that will be good. Cannot be leeched + reflect in a reflect map etc.

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Natharias wrote:

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Mr_Mustasch wrote:

GGG, have you considered a monster prefix or suffix that reads Immune to life leech?

Think about it!

Most builds would be destroyed or would have to bypass it.

Vaal Pact is used to counter reflect and burst damage, and this would totally negate it.

No.

To be the devil's advocate, wasn't your mission making this game all about making builds all-rounders to deal with stuff?

It's in stuff like this we see the flaws in our points of view :)

That being said, I agree with you. It would destroy certain build concepts without adding any meaningful gameplay depth.
It'd just be a "play/build differently" flag.

The same goes for Curses.
The same goes for everything else.

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Crackmonster wrote:

You nicely ignore the central point, which is that the rare itself will not have enough hp for you to die by its reflect, creation your main arguments based on it, and then at the end recognize that point anyway as it suits your misguided typing, this time trying to bring it up as something pro your case.

...and when are the lies going to stop?

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Crackmonster wrote:

There are many mods that only rare monsters have, generally the most powerful.

Some of them wouldn't be missed. Like Armored, extra life, and Ancestral Bond.

But others do actually impact gameplay, like Corrupted Blood. These mods are powerful in their own right and force builds to be ready for them. Once you're ready for them, they aren't a problem.

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Crackmonster wrote:

The best comparison is curse immune which does not spawn on magic monsters.

Now it is obvious that you don't play the game.

Magic and rare monsters can have curse immunity. The only ones who can't are white mobs.

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Crackmonster wrote:

That is great, works as intended, what does not work is when they add curse immune to maps that was a mistake from the very beginning.

It's really harder to run into a map with curse immunity-which you can change, but you don't know that since you don't play-, than it is to kill a curse immune mob?

Funny.

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Crackmonster wrote:

You want the right combinations, let say cannot be leeched, extra resists/life and regen, reflect or whatever whatever to be a challenge, that's what it's all about.

No, it's not.

The regeneration mod is meant to do one thing: stop builds with little to no DPS from continuing.

The Corrupt Blood mod is meant to do one thing: stop high attack/cast speed builds from continuing unless they can recover life/ES faster than CB removes it.

A truly good mod is one that is powerful in its own right. It challenges players to adapt to it in some form. If they don't adapt, they run or die.

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Crackmonster wrote:

If you wanted 1 mod in itself to almost completely be a stopper, what happens when you combo 2-4 of those, then you simply can't do shit, which isn't ideal, it must be the right combinations that will be good. Cannot be leeched + reflect in a reflect map etc.

Well, let's see then. Corrupted Blood was meant to destroy high rate builds, yes?

Then why is it that Incinerators, which can do 5 projectiles every 0.06 seconds or so, not get destroyed by it? Oh and assume they aren't using Cybil's Paw. It's called leech, and likely Vaal Pact. After CB is dead, they pop an anti-bleed flask to survive.

What about highly accurate mobs, which also gain increased crit chance and damage? That's meant to counter evasion builds and it is easily countered by Blind and Enfeeble.

Curse Immune? CWDT (level 1) + CWS + Frost Wall + Increased Duration. The enemy now deals absolutely no damage unless it is one of the very few that can bypass it.

So what if you come across three mods that are meant to directly counter your build? If your build is successful, you've already accounted for it and planned for it.

I could be wrong about magic monsters rolling curse immunities, but hell, i don't recall ever having encountered that and i was the originator of one of the most unique tri-curse builds in the game, played at least 2k hours on that character alone. If someone is certain about this feel free to tune in.

Alright, let me give you an example of how curse immunity on maps is extremely disruptive. Yes, you can roll the map again, but it is very very bad for teamplay, it means you often get fucked in maps, or have to demand for the map to be rerolled etc, it's just garbage, and for no gain. 50% curse effectiveness would have done the job right instead of curse immunity.

You may come and claim whatever the you want(and already did for curse immunes), but those changes effectively ended the original curse builds, who relies completely on curses to be compete. That's fact. Those builds that were not overpowered were destroyed then, primarily due to curse immunities on maps, and with it came the complete death of energy shield builds focused around actual energy shield regen, it was simply too impractical to play the builds. That's just fact, so buggar off with your conjured excuses of how you just do it with this and that item and bla bla, that's just talk, doesn't match with reality.

Btw, if you think corrupting blood is not based around considering possible combinations of affixes, then you are blind. That like any other mods are balanced around combinations, if there are certain combinations that are simply unkillable for too many builds, then they get balanced for good overall gameplay. For example corrupting blood has been balanced keeping monster defensive mods in mind. If there were zero defensive mods, than they would increase the damage of corrupting blood. Basic logic so please spew your conjured garbage elsewhere.

It is just so funny that you think CB is "A truly good mod", while also stating that it is "meant to destroy high rate builds", while stating your initial opposition here as "Most builds would be destroyed or would have to bypass it". Surely you must also know that most builds are "high rate" builds. The shattershuck that you used as an example earlier is one of the highest rate builds around, and yet, for you its okay for CB to be intended to destroy it.

At the end of the day, you are revealed as speaking from emotion rather than your reasoning. Probably you play one leecher as well, hence your defensive reaction, do you not?

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Natharias wrote:

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Peterlerock wrote:

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Natharias wrote:

In some cases, you could just skip it. But there are some monsters in some areas that one cannot just "skip". One good instance is a mob with insane movement speed, has a shit ton of monsters, and have reflect. You're dead.

Lure him into a pack of other monsters you can leech from, and kill them together.

Just be a little creative.

Yeah, by the time you would've found another mob those enemies have desynced you enough and hit you enough that you're dead. Hence why I mentioned mobs with insane movement speed.

And what superfast superhardhitting monsters are you speaking of?

You're just making up stuff.

Reflect + leech immune + insane movement speed + high enough damage to trouble you

What monster do you picture in your head that would destroy you in such a scenario?