Witch Tree Proposals (Semi-Updated July 15.)

I am still tracking your thread about Witch Tree Proposals. Thank you for your contributions.

Edit: Still working on some changes.
I've added the main defense & utility circles I wanted.
Right now their still just mockups, but I'm making the assets with an online version of photoshop. Fixed for the link graphic.

I've added circles for Hybrid Life+Mana, Energy Shield, and Mana Utility.
All 3 circles have their own notables.
http://postimg.org/image/565dfm4c9/
http://postimg.org/image/9yqyabxoz/
http://postimg.org/image/dluxx477d/

I've also picked their positions relative to other life/defense nodes.
Most of the time in the tree, life nodes are generally separated by 3-5 travel nodes.

Mockup image update:
http://postimg.org/image/3zxiddj43/

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Still working on what to add to the circle nodes. This is going to take a while.

By the way, does anyone know where to find or possibly create a heat map for Witch tree Nodes?
I've seen some before, but can't find them anymore.

Things that I've fixed so far:
New Iron Will Keystone.
New Hybrid Life+Mana Cluster. Includes a new type of hybrid node (2x), Increased Life & Mana Regeneration.
New Reduced Mana Cost of Skills cluster. Going to be in same circle as Deep Thoughts. Thanks for the layout idea Reno.

Things I'm planning for:
Utility nodes: skill duration, cast speed, recovery, etc.
Accuracy nodes, Crit Nodes, Elemental Penetration, more stuff ...
Balancing circles / stats for point efficiency.

Still working on making rough draft, that I will convert into a final draft once I have access to photoshop.

This is all depending on the time frame GGG plans to make ANY improvements to the tree.
So far we've been in the dark on any new changes, and it's been a while since the tree has been changed. This worries me for my proposed ideas, as well as for what they would be changing.

If they make a major change to the area, my proposal is as good as dead. They won't make additional major changes right after one has been done. That I can guarantee.

Still, I'm optimistic.
Might post another draft screenshot later tonight, or later in the week.

Some more draft work done.

Good news is I can partially make a decent resolution draft which is good enough to show for a final copy. I used my large screenshot combined with a high res skill tree image I found.

I've also got one to show for now.
http://postimg.org/image/u3fgiky0z/full/

More good news is I think I can keep all the old circles, depending how I rework them.
Bad news is I have to shift them around, which might mean traveling more nodes for certain ones, less for others, etc.

You might notice I've added another way to get into the top tree.
Those are going to be Critical nodes (left), and Cast speed (right).

I've been trying to theme where I put what type of circles.
For example: Offense, Defense, Utility.

The more Strength/Int side will be focused on power and damage, while the Dex/Int side focuses more on Defense and Utility.
Raw Int area (top) focuses on both utility and offense.

I'll post more later tonight.

I've found my way here from your reddit-post and thought you'd might appreciate another opinion.

You skilltree is lacking both escapability and accessability. Venturing into Witch-Land for a highlvl-nonwitch-summoner to get "Lord of the Dead" takes 4 more points. Getting a bit of AoE on the way to Eldritch-Battery from the templar, also 2 more points. The rebalance of the Elemental-Nodes is also very questionable, buffing the effectiveness of Firenote in particular is just asking to proliferate stronger burns for less points.

Now look at Escape-Routes. Many high-level-builds stretch over vast areas of the skilltree and often got their Mana-Regen fixed over Gear. It really feels not too good to be forced to go through 5 Mana-Nodes to get to another Mana-Notable to then pick up ES. In the end you'll even have a tad less ES than in the current tree. My biggest concern with the current witch-tree is that you only got the choice between those nasty Energy-Cooldown-Recovery-Nodes and 3 Flask-Effect-Nodes to escape. Both are situational and not very pleasant to take.


The addition of the Elemental Penetration-Circle is even stronger. 16% Elemental Penetration, is insane. Add Fire-Pen and the High Explosives, and you got Fire-Traps with 61% Penetration, that's completly out of hand, thus forcing every single Elemental-Build to venture to those Nodes.

Regarding the Addition of the Life and Accuracy-Circle. I don't know why you think that's necessary. Your redesigned Area already has "Ok" Life. Add in that circle and bling, Witch got the most HP out of every Starting-Area.


In my opinion the actual starting-area is quite fine and only need minor adjustment, if at all. The real trouble starts north. Wandslinger's Prowess, Breath of Rime, Gimini and Voilatile Mines. It's been a long time since I've seen people actually picking those up. That's the area I'd lay my focus on.

Thankfully this is all draft work.
Any stats I give examples of can be changed, and probably should. As I'm not the expert on what amount is needed.

For example, I definitely need to tone down the elemental penetration.
Maybe down to 12%( at 3,3,6) or 10%( at 2,2,6).

The feedback does help. Also, I think you were looking at my June draft.

I might swap locations of Deep Wisdom and my notable Mage's Sanctum.
I looked at the tree again and I don't like how far the ES is from the other 3 nodes.
But I also don't like forcing people to choose ES and Maximum mana, versus just taking Deep Wisdom.
I could try moving it into the Life / ES area, directly in the middle or something. But I don't think it's going to be a good design.
The other option is simply removing it, and outright buffing all nodes in the area.
I don't think GGG wants to do that, and I don't really want to either. But I can if I have to.
It's definitely something I'm going to have to change one way or another.
Just keep in mind, My notable Mage's Sanctum was a way of filling the stats gap, and fixing a pathing issue.

As for the Lord of the Dead change, that was just a layout concept. It would take more points to get the notable, which I can understand might upset people. I can always change it back. I never liked the location of the circle to begin with.

I've been hesitant on what specific stats to add.
I've tried to keep all stats in the area consistent to their current ones. %Maximum mana at 28%, Regen at 60%, Maximum ES at 44%, etc.

Even the elemental circle. The total damage bonus you get is 39%, from 8, 15, 8, 8. (I'm not counting elemental dominion)
My changes bump it up by 1% only, for a total of 40%. The only thing that's changed is the point effectiveness, which is why it makes it seem more OP.

If entering from the top, currently you can take 2 points to get the notable. 8%+15% for 23% damage boost. My changes would make it 10%+18%, for 28%. That's a 5% bonus jump.
I tried to make the top side less effective, being 10, 18, 12. I could try something like 10%,16%,14% to tone it down, but still not by much.

As for the AoE to EB example, I'm not seeing it.
I'm assuming your talking about a path similar to this: Linky

Accessibility and Escapability have always been a problem with Witch tree. The side nodes should be easier to access the side notables. It should be 1 node farther away from the witch, rather than where it is now. It should be on the connecting node highway for Inner force / Clear Mind (chaos notable). That's something I can change.

As for the Life and Accuracy Circles, those are also changing. I no longer have those life nodes in my current draft. The accuracy circle is adding a general accuracy into the area, rather than specialize from something else. It also opens the option of removing the accuracy from the Arcane Vision notable, and changing it to something else.

The life that would have been here is moved into my new Hybrid life+mana circle.

About big elemental circle. Maybe make it 8-18-8 and boost elemental dominion notable to 25% ele dmg?

About right starting circle.
For left branch order 8% mana-8% mana-20% mana regen will be better choose IMHO.
For right branch 3x (4% life + 4%ES + 4% mana) nodes will be strange but interesting.

Second right node seems to bee too weak for starting node.

Life&Mana circle will better look somewhere between Hex Master and Minion Instability IMHO.

PS Where it'll be better to post my thoughts? Here or in PM?

bump

Nice thread, hope there will be less nodes to get from witch to scion node (special ES node near scion and AoE scion node).

More spell node/AoE and less ES cooldown, mana on kill, shield node, cast speed for curse and like there nodes.

I don't like the new upcoming tree.

You may think it's a buff, but I don't see it.
Unless we are given the tree early to see exact stats, the raw point efficiency is still the same as the old tree.

I'm referring to this thread.
http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/986647

The difference is we are given more nodes to play around with.

edit: Seems the hybrid nodes are still there, but moved around. Hopefully we get some more raw stats from these.
I would still like to see a new hybrid life regen+ mana regen nodes / notable.
The only way to get this is the Scion notable "Shaper".
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They still fail to balance the distance to the top of the tree above the power charge node.
Going from the bottom of the power charge node, judging from their screenshot, it takes 10 nodes to go left. Unless you go through the Deep Wisdom cluster, which then takes 6 nodes.
That's the exact same point cost it is now.
This Highway still needs improvement

From the right side, it takes 7 nodes, which is the same as it is now.
Right side is shorter still

And then,
Going Straight Through


My goal in balancing the new mirrored version was to correct this mistake.
It's still a poor choice to take the left inner highway versus the right one.
Unless they actually want an uneven tree..... which seems very illogical to begin with.
View my July 25th Draft in the OP.
============================================
They also left a gap in the inner highway nodes again, between the top of elemental damage cluster, and Inner Force. There is no point to taking this alleyway.
This Area

They also seemed to replace the right starting nodes with ES based nodes.
Unless you are choosing an ES based caster build, these are useless starting nodes.
My Life+Mana nodes were meant to be a neutral defense/utility choice, rather than a forced ES choice.
Not all casters have ES as base defense. Some are Life based and EB builds, which totally messes with their point efficiency.

It's also impossible to get any mana based nodes without going through damage or ES nodes.
Something I'm not fond of.
Energy shield should be a choice, not required.

They seemed to have moved Unnatural Calm, and added more ES nodes. Much like my proposed new ES cluster on the right side, except now on the left. That's great for adding more ES nodes, but I have a feeling we still won't see FLAT ES anytime soon.

Sadly, I don't think I'll be posting any more proposals or changes.
I tried to outreach to the community and GGG to grab the needed attention the tree deserved.
Sadly we seem to be lacking both.

Hopefully it will all be for the better. We shall see soon.