PLEASE AUCTION HOUSE

Can we also stop calling a better trade system an "auction house?"

Auctions imply people are bidding for something (and D3's auction house, was done with real money.)
"
Can we also stop calling a better trade system an "auction house?"

Auctions imply people are bidding for something (and D3's auction house, was done with real money.)


Though having a bidding function for higher end items is quite nice, i agree that the rmah was fucking stupid and all sorts broken+piss poor logic
Ign: ChaosCrits
Hi,

make an escrow system like in eve online.
max 5-10 escrow slots per account - you can sell your items for a fixed price (buyout)
putting things in escrow removes them from the game temporarily.

o/ termi
@Bex_GGG, i get it, but it still not "in game" system so basically it won't be so effective like in game mode. Maybe i should say not Auction house, but Trade House/Post or what ever. I allowed myself to make my concept art of it:
Spoiler


I hope that Trade House supporters like it and maybe GGG too. That will allows You to buy items, so easy and quick. Offer button is available only when seller mark "negotiable" option that give buyer option to buy items in other currency that is in offer.
For example:
You Wanna buy some item for 1 ex, but You don't have it, or You can't buy it. So You click the offer button and then You can change offered currncy for example chaos orbs in higher amount. When seller became online, he will see Your offer in chaos obs and he can accept it or refuse.
How simple is that hmmm?
After TH in game, trade chats will have only orbs, gems, maps etc on spam.
Think about it, becouse it wont runi the game felling.

Best regards
/Xaros
Let's just wait until GGG releases their thing. I'm completely against Diablo 3 style Auction Houses though, they would degrade the economy of other leagues and Standard league economy is already broken imho.

I thought I would be able to someday buy a Shav's from items and orbs I grind until I reach the required level. Turned out nobody wants to buy my stuff because however good it is they want higher level stuff.

I got like a 20 exalted worth of stuff if I stretch it and grinded so far 3 pure exalted which I traded for items I really needed.

With casual play I would never be able to gather even half of the exalted's that needed to buy a 6 linked rare or even 6 linked shav's.
So an Auction house or Trade house would make no difference for me only to people who have tons of currency and good items.
"
Peterking72 wrote:
So an Auction house or Trade house would make no difference for me only to people who have tons of currency and good items.

It'll help sell Your items, without spending hours for spaming on trade chats and write a trash topic on forum. Trade house helps both sides of trade business in PoE. It'll norm currency volue.
"
Xaros1989 wrote:
@Bex_GGG, i get it, but it still not "in game" system so basically it won't be so effective like in game mode. Maybe i should say not Auction house, but Trade House/Post or what ever. I allowed myself to make my concept art of it:
Spoiler


I hope that Trade House supporters like it and maybe GGG too. That will allows You to buy items, so easy and quick. Offer button is available only when seller mark "negotiable" option that give buyer option to buy items in other currency that is in offer.
For example:
You Wanna buy some item for 1 ex, but You don't have it, or You can't buy it. So You click the offer button and then You can change offered currncy for example chaos orbs in higher amount. When seller became online, he will see Your offer in chaos obs and he can accept it or refuse.
How simple is that hmmm?
After TH in game, trade chats will have only orbs, gems, maps etc on spam.
Think about it, becouse it wont runi the game felling.

Best regards
/Xaros


I love the look of that trading post that you've designed, its more or less exactly what i myself wanted. This would speed up transactions and simply give the community more "play time" due to not needing to spam their asses off for a good hour.
Ign: ChaosCrits
"
Xaros1989 wrote:
@Bex_GGG, i get it, but it still not "in game" system so basically it won't be so effective like in game mode. Maybe i should say not Auction house, but Trade House/Post or what ever. I allowed myself to make my concept art of it:
Spoiler


I hope that Trade House supporters like it and maybe GGG too. That will allows You to buy items, so easy and quick. Offer button is available only when seller mark "negotiable" option that give buyer option to buy items in other currency that is in offer.
For example:
You Wanna buy some item for 1 ex, but You don't have it, or You can't buy it. So You click the offer button and then You can change offered currncy for example chaos orbs in higher amount. When seller became online, he will see Your offer in chaos obs and he can accept it or refuse.
How simple is that hmmm?
After TH in game, trade chats will have only orbs, gems, maps etc on spam.
Think about it, becouse it wont runi the game felling.

Best regards
/Xaros




Oh my god that is a great idea!
There is a very good reason why in a game like this, trading items between players should not be easy.

The main problem is that items in this game are persistent. They don't get 'used up' as they're used. This means that the best items by and large never leave the game, and more are being created all the time.

This is simply not sustainable, and having it harder to trade those 'good' items mitigates the problem somewhat.

For an AH and easy trading to be feasible, items would have to wear out. If you for example adopted a Diablo like 'durability', and once it reached 0 the item would be broken and useless, then it would work.
Such a change would require a lot of game balance changes, and of course a shedload of buckets for all the tears from existing 'rich' players :-p
just no.

why do u want an auction house? when I was in nemesis league (my first league) I always cried about why this game didnt have an autionhouse or an easy trade system because i couldnt beat merciless dominus or even reach lvl 70 because I didnt have a 5l or that nice life/tri res/ ring. BUT this thing forced me to LEARN HOW TO PLAY (what item can I use later, when to ID an item, when to use currency on an item, ilvl for resist mods, ilvl for sockets/links, hrs in poe.wiki, lerning the crafting recipes, pros/cons of my build or char, what can I get from the tree and what can I get better from the gear) and after playing nemesis, invasion, domination, ambush, beyond and rampage (my actual league), tons of races, shit tons of <70 chars (i deleted a lot of RIP standard char when I was a hardcore player). AFTER all of that now I can finally play the game WITHOUT any trade till lvl72. and all i can say is u can lvl up to <72, kill merci dominus and doing maps up to 68-69 (easy mods ofc) with some rares and blue (magic items) and a shitty 4l.
After that time i consider myself a "medium" or average player since I can beat and farm dominus so easy BUT i cant even imagine myself doing atziri. I cant play with all the classes the same way i can play/build a marauder/templar..even more I can play as a MF so easily but i cant play as a damn crit reaver even when the build is waay cheaper (i can make way to buy a 10-13ex gear to be 550+iir/60+iiq in max 2 week). U need to focus on you, your char (his pros/cons) and his passive tree and u need to realise that u cant do the damn 200k dmg shadow being selfound for 3 month or u cant master all the classes like havoc or willywonka (even more, they 90% of the time used the same class for races) u dont need a damn shav or a perfect ring/amu/belt to actually play the game.


If u do the trade easier ppl will simple run to action house /trade post buy the damn 40%+ tri-res ring+life+mama leech for someone who needs to do currency fast and u will wear it and faceroll content instead on focus on what are u doing wrong or open the damn passive an check if it will be better to use 5 regrets to grab that res/life/attack/dmg/spell/charge node or taking an hour to craft (trasm+alt even regal) that 4l chest/gloves/boots from greust or hagan.


if u want a brainless game like d3 u can do THE SAME THEY DID...an auction house. Or u can keep this "damn shitty trade system" that forced u to actually LEARN THE GAME.

U are a freaking lier!! no one can beat merci dominus with no trade/ only blues/ being selfound/ no party or doing it in a hardcore league.
Check the link. This link just changed my mind, inspired me to be better and actually to play and learn the game. (if he could do it...why i cant!)

NEMESIS MERCILESS CLEARED AT LEVEL 67
Never partied in merciless
No rares
No uniques

http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/698071/page/28/#p6537924


So as a resume: actionhouse = NO! why=it makes the game easier (as much of these ppl is saying)...and making the game easier means that u will have shit tons of no brains players/no economy/no learning curve/no motivaion (obsesion in my case)/no feelings when u ID a rare hopping that can upgrade ur gear.. .. so u will play the game for 1 month facerolling content with ur auctionhouse items and then u will be installing another ARPG with no auction house and asking this same crap there..and repeating the same history.

quote from the link above : (huge spoiler...but worth the time)

Spoiler
[Spoiler]
-LETS BURY SAM

Dominus is dead and I hope sam dies with him. I think I proved conclusively that skill and strategy is more important than gear, that there is more to the game than grinding for better numbers, and this game lets you be capable of truely amazing things.

There has always been players of my skill level doing amazing things but I seem to have attracted the most attention. Maybe its my writing or the dramatic call out against Sam the scrub? Well I hope I did some good.

For the sake of the community and the future of PoE let bury Sam together and give him a eulogoy. No more talking about gear checks or petty whining.

Maybe Sam can reborn? Learn how to play, how to win without just stacking stats, find a strategy, clever ways to fight, and develop quick reaction time and a mind of steel.

Maybe not, maybe he will find more excuses and never learn. Maybe we should put a noose around Sam's neck?

I have absolutely no hatred for bad players, not the slightest hostility. It is the processing of acquiring skill, or learning it, testing it, and refining it that makes this game fun for me. Anyone can enjoy this. Whether you are a top-tier player trying to push yourself even farther or you just started playing 10 minutes and hillock killed you I think everyone can enjoy this game and improve themself.

What I do not tolerate is Scrubs which is exactly what Sam is.


-ANALYSIS OF THE SCRUB-

What is a scrub? Well Sam is one but what does that mean?
Sirloin said it best

"
Now, everyone begins as a poor player—it takes time to learn a game to get to a point where you know what you’re doing. There is the mistaken notion, though, that by merely continuing to play or “learn” the game, one can become a top player. In reality, the “scrub” has many more mental obstacles to overcome than anything actually going on during the game. The scrub has lost the game even before it starts. He’s lost the game even before deciding which game to play. "~from Playing to win (one of the most best pieces of literature on video games ever)

A scrub sets up boundaries for himself that prevent him from growing.
He wont try to win with ways other than just grinding/farming for GG because he convinced himself that its the only way to win
He wont try new strategies because he's told himself that they wont work and he should just follow a guide
He won't experiment because he thinks he already knows everything.
He wont learn from his mistakes because he thinks its the games fault not his "the game needs to give me better gear"
He will blame his character, or the game, or RNG not himself.

A scrub will never grow as a player, he never attempts to evaluate himself, he thinks if he just keeps mashing the buttons he will gain skill. Personal skill doesnt work like level ups. Its much deeper than that, much more rewarding and satisfying to acquire.

He becomes sore that he can't win despite putting so much time into the game and makes very angry statements, lashing out at people on message boards.

This is one of the ways that scrubs are different from casual player or 'bad player' or 'new player'.

The casual/new/bad player will play badly, die, laugh, and have fun and maybe learn something
The scrub will play badly, die, rage, and blame rather than learn.

He will never know the joys that come from self-improvment. Never know that feeling of power when something that seemed impossible is now something you have mastered. Everyone should know what I'm talking about, even the worst of the worst will be able to recall fondly the feeling of mastery.

Its something you force yourself into. I dont think the average player in PoE is a scrub.
I think (or rather hope) that all players understand and seek out the joy of self-improvement but I feel many are lost and have picked up scrub-like habits.

-THE EASY BUTTON

Why is PoE filled with people like Sam? Why is he in this game and not another?

Because gamers from this generation are used to easy games and being pampered with "carebear land"? Thats true but gamers from this generation are also capable of learning and adopting. No one is born hardcore, you shape yourself into it.

Because its a free game and free games attract children? Well children can be pretty bad-ass at game like those kids who beat ninja gaiden when they were 8 years old

Because it launched on steam and is now flooded with players who expect it to be like modern mmos or diablo 3? Yeah thats definitely a reason but again, players are human beings that can learn. You don't have to have a black belt in action rpgs and masters degree in button mashing from tokyo university to figure out how to play PoE.

PoE is presents the player with so many ways to win without developing skill that one is always tempted to take the easy way out. As a matter of fact its so convenient to do the easy way, and the hard way so mysterious and unmentioned many players probably don't even realize there was a choice between easy and hard to begin with or that personal skill mattered at all?

Overgrind all the level zones, load up on godly gear while leveling, pay for boss kills, run anything dangerous in a large party. Many people play this way, its a way that allows you to progress with very little personal skill.

The game makes doing these skill-breaking things so easy its no wonder everyone is tempted into doing it. A boss kill is what 1 chaos? Hey if you split the price amoung 5 people thats only 4 alts from each player. Joining a party and letting them carry you through docks till you gained 5 level ups is as easy as clicking the bulliton board.

Think of your favorite action game: doom, ninja gaiden, mega man, or contra.Now imagine that there is button on the keyboard/controller that instantly resurrects your dead character. You know pressing that button would cheapen the fun but you would probably do it anyway. This is the same situation PoE is in the 'easy button' is far too easy to press

It is the job of the game designer to take the hand of all new players and gracefully guide them down the paths that provide the monster entertainment. Part of this role as a designer means that he must try to obstruct the players efforts towards doing boring things. Grinding is boring but many players do it because it offers easy access to powering up. The designer's job is to protect the player from himself. That is why when a designer does have you resurrect your character at the press of a button he hides it behind a cheat code and makes you type "babymode" into the console to activate it. This simple act suddenly makes the player realize exactly what he is doing and he will than think "do I really want to do this?"

With the game industry filled with lots of new players and unskilled players every game needs to have 'easy buttons'. Thats fine, I have no problem with that. No problem at all. I'll just play my way and you play your way. However PoE's 'easy button' is way to easy to press. Many people don't even realize they are pressing and think that this is the only way you can win in the first place. When this is the case the player never grows. the 'easy button' is supposed to be bike with training wheels. Eventually you take off the training wheels because its more fun to ride a bike without them. Not even knowing the training wheels can be taken off is a sad situation.

There is a place for trading: trade is an entirely new level of depth and lets you do builds that would normally require too specific gear to ever pull off self-found.
There is a place for grinding and for 'power leveling' by wearing gamebreaking game. Grinding helps smooth out the difficulty curve and serve as bandaid for bad RNG. Power leveling with godly gear is fun every once in awhile, just like 'god mode' is fun every once in a while.
Maybe theres even a place for boss kill services? Many players have PCs that crash at Dominus.

All these things have a place
But these should not be the prime gaming experience they are 'easy buttons'.

I think GGG has failed in their design of the easy button. PoE borrows very heavily from diablo 2 and diablo 2 had the same design flaw. Maybe GGG can fix this some how?
Even if they don't it doesnt matter much.

Even if the easy buttons are accessed so effortlessly its still up to the individual player to decide what do to do with them.



-LOOKING ONWARD

Theres a lot of talk about how interconnected players actions are in PoE. A group of players popularizing a build might make it get nerfed. The types of trades you do change the entire worled economy. What you say in chat and on the forums affects the culture of the game. All of this is true to some exstent.

But more than anything PoE is about you, the individual. You set the rules on how will play, what you will do, what you wont do, and how you do it.

You can talk about 'farming effieincy' 'risk vs reward' and 'build tiers' but these are all self imposed rules. If playing risky with heavy face tanking and needlessly 1v1ing the storm herald mob when you could have ran from it, being poor and not using 'good items' , and using a 'bad' gem like stormcall makes you happy than thats exactly what you should do.

It doesnt matter that I could have 'done quicker' or 'done it safer'. Video games are entertainment not a fucking job.

If you the rules that you set up for yourself, your way of playing, is not fun for you than I would encourage you to try to change.

If you are bored with grinding, paying for boss kills, and winning only by stacking on better and better gear till you dont even feel the damage, and being an orb accountant.

If what I say inspires you, or sounds interesting to you than I encourage you to try it yourself. Go on an adventure. Travel the path of self-improvement, take the more difficult approach, push yourself, improve, learn. You will probably die and have many exciting close calls pushing yourself is the only way to grow. There will be stressful times, walls you cant get over but I promise you that once you get over that wall the view is beautiful.

You don't have to wear all blues, you dont even have to be good at the game.




NEMESIS MERCILESS CLEARED AT LEVEL 67
Never partied in merciless
No rares
No uniques

Its been fun playing and talking with you guys. I hope you were entertained and learned a few things!

Sometime I will compile a pdf of all my logs, as request of some readers.

I will continue doing fun things at http://www.twitch.tv/outzonestream/ see you there!
[/spoiler]

Im sorry if I sound mad/angry wasnt my intention at all...im kinda passionate xD. Im sorry for my english too isnt my native language. Hope u guys can get what I tried to say.


Melee 2 Hander Since nemesis.

Melee forever!

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