Question regarding Armor/evasion and Iron reflexes.

Okay so i understand when i have iron reflexes and i put points into increasing evasion amount it works like this.

Gear/Grace Evasion = x multiplier = total evasion = armour

Now my main question now is what happens with passives that increase your armor?

Does it work like this?

Gear/Grace Evasion = x multiplier = total evasion = armour x multiplier = total armor

or does it work like this?

Gear/Grace Evasion and armor = x(all multipliers here) = total evasion = armour

In the first scenario you would have more armor in the second it would be pointless to get armor multipliers.
no one knows?
In the case of Iron Reflexes, the order of calculation goes accordingly: all effects to your accumulated Evasion Rating (Grace and your equipment, in this case) are applied, then the Total Evasion Rating is converted to Armor, and then all effects to Armor are applied to the sum.
Not actively playing. Message me if you have questions or whatever.
"
Completed 1 ChallengeIao wrote:
In the case of Iron Reflexes, the order of calculation goes accordingly: all effects to your accumulated Evasion Rating (Grace and your equipment, in this case) are applied, then the Total Evasion Rating is converted to Armor, and then all effects to Armor are applied to the sum.


This doesn't seem to be the case, I get substantially more effect from a 10% Evasion node, using iron reflexes, then I do from a 10% armor node. Also, the 30% evasion node is noticably more effective then leather and steel big node.

I believe the devs specifically nerfed this, how and the particulars escape me
IGN: RussianAlpaca

Sa'ori nala quaso.

@WhozDat
Ah, really? I actually heard mention of something like that, but only once, so I thought it was just an idea or a falsehood. Thanks for the correction.

Sorry about the misinformation, Lordzero2. I'll look into it a bit more and post my findings if someone else doesn't already do so.
Not actively playing. Message me if you have questions or whatever.
yes, kripp mentions it in I think his last video, but doesn't go into detail about it.
If you go IR, then dont take 'Leather and Still' nodes
"
EpsiIon wrote:
"
Completed 1 ChallengeIao wrote:
In the case of Iron Reflexes, the order of calculation goes accordingly: all effects to your accumulated Evasion Rating (Grace and your equipment, in this case) are applied, then the Total Evasion Rating is converted to Armor, and then all effects to Armor are applied to the sum.
This doesn't seem to be the case, I get substantially more effect from a 10% Evasion node, using iron reflexes, then I do from a 10% armor node. Also, the 30% evasion node is noticably more effective then leather and steel big node.

I believe the devs specifically nerfed this, how and the particulars escape me
That's not a nerf - the conversion has never worked liked that. That would be incredibly overpowered, as it would make the additive bonuses to evasion and additive bonuses to armour be multiplicative with each other.

Anytime the game converts one stat to another, the converted amount is affected by total modifiers to both.
All your base evasion is affected by your total modifiers to evasion and to armour, and you get the result as armour. All your base armour is affected as normal only by increases to armour.

If you have 100 base armour, 100 base evasion, 10% increased armour, 20% increased evasion, and 24% increased armour and evasion (from Leather and Steel), then:
From evasion: 100 x (1 + 0.10 + 0.20 + 0.24) = 100 x 1.54 = 154 armour
From armour: 100 x (1 + 0.10 + 0.24) = 100 x 1.34 = 134 armour
Total armour: 288

This is exactly the same as how all conversion in the game works, such as converting damage. Anytime some amount of a stat is converted, that base value is affected by the total of modifiers that affect either stat.

The only thing that's changed about this is that when originally implemented, Leather and Steel did something different. It used to provide two separate bonuses: 24% increased evasion, and 24% increased armour. Those were separate bonuses, and thus any evasion converted to armour by iron reflexes was affected by both, which was not the intent of the nodes. They are now one bonus providing a 24% increase to evasion and armour, and thus apply only once to each value.
"I'm a strong, independent blue gem and I don't need no other gems to support me. -sassy finger wag-" - Stormquake
Last edited by Mark_GGG on December 18, 2012 8:54 AM
Ah, okay. Thanks for clearing that up, Mark.
Not actively playing. Message me if you have questions or whatever.
"
EpsiIon wrote:
"
Completed 1 ChallengeIao wrote:
In the case of Iron Reflexes, the order of calculation goes accordingly: all effects to your accumulated Evasion Rating (Grace and your equipment, in this case) are applied, then the Total Evasion Rating is converted to Armor, and then all effects to Armor are applied to the sum.


This doesn't seem to be the case, I get substantially more effect from a 10% Evasion node, using iron reflexes, then I do from a 10% armor node. Also, the 30% evasion node is noticably more effective then leather and steel big node.

I believe the devs specifically nerfed this, how and the particulars escape me


Well, you have quite good amount of dexterity, which buffs you: +(Dex/5)% bonus.
And it turns out that with Iron reflexes its better to use pure evasion or pure armor nodes with evasion armors.

Or, in other words, Leather and Steel nodes are bad for Iron reflexes keystone.
IGN Incanar
Last edited by Incanar on December 18, 2012 9:59 AM
"
Mark_GGG wrote:

All your base evasion is affected by your total modifiers to evasion and to armour, and you get the result as armour. All your base armour is affected as normal only by increases to armour.

If you have 100 base armour, 100 base evasion, 10% increased armour, 20% increased evasion, and 24% increased armour and evasion (from Leather and Steel), then:
From evasion: 100 x (1 + 0.10 + 0.20 + 0.24) = 100 x 1.54 = 154 armour
From armour: 100 x (1 + 0.10 + 0.24) = 100 x 1.34 = 134 armour
Total armour: 288

Man, I'm so confused, and I have so many questions.

1. Why is evasion being affected by Armor percentages? Evasion is different from armor isn't it? Or does the armor% only affect evasion if your armor has evasion on it? What about if your Armor only gives armor value and no evasion?

2. Where/When does buffs like Grace and Determination and Molten Armor play into the calculations?

3. What about shields? Are shields considered a piece of armor and affected by armor%? Or are they modified only by the shield defences passive? What if your shield has evasion or energy shield and not armor?
IGNs-
Gyeff // Greff // Gyaff
Last edited by geffreyy on December 20, 2012 12:07 AM

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