Zealot's Oath + Vaal Pact + health regeneration

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Dreggon wrote:

So ZO works in a similar way to Blood Magic? Do all of the calculations, get the total amount of life regeneration, VP multiplies that by 0 - and then apply that number to energy shield.

So it's a good idea to have VP and Ghost Reaver if you're a CI build, but VP and ZO together don't work. I can't imagine actually getting VP on anything except a CI/Ghost Reaver build.

Certain life builds can use VP to an effective degree.

Could a 1% life regen be added behind Zealots oath, in a similar way the CI node was done up.

The problem is that nothing in the descriptions describe the ordering of the effects.

Either:
Vaal Pact sets life regeneration to do nothing
Then that nothing applies to Energy Shield instead of Life

or
Zealots oath removes life regeneration and replaces it with energy shield regeneration.
Then Vaal Pact sets the already zeroed regeneration to do nothing.

Either would make sense.

Vaal Pact could be worded:
Life Leech applies instantly. 100% less life gain from flasks, and 100% less life regeneration.

Although people would still need an understanding of how stat conversion works, so it does not really help, as that appears to be frequently misunderstood, too.

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ben_sphynx wrote:

The problem is that nothing in the descriptions describe the ordering of the effects.

No it isn't. The problem is that regeneration is displayed improperly, and vaal pact needs to specify that it zeroes your life regen, not your life recovery from life regen.

Zealot's oath specifically says "Life Regeneration applies to energy shield instead of life", not "Life regeneration is converted to energy shield regeneration". While the second one could technically be avoided by some sort of ordering technicality, the first one can't.

If you have "0% +0 (0)" Life Regeneration being applied to energy shield, you get no ES regen.

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Although people would still need an understanding of how stat conversion works, so it does not really help, as that appears to be frequently misunderstood, too.

Neither of these skills do any conversion. ES does an application, not a stat conversion.
This is why actual conversion like blackgleam is "50% of physical damage converted to fire damage", and not "50% of physical damage applied as fire damage".

Conversion takes a base stat and changes it to another base stat, application takes a base stat and applies some or all of its value as if it was something else, without actually adding to your base stat. You don't get "x% +y" energy shield regen, you get "x% +y" life regen applied to energy shield.

What a hilariously stupid thread.

If you didn't know how VP and ZO would interact upon immediately reading them, you have a serious problem.

This is argument for argument's sake.

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Mark_GGG wrote:

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JahIthBer89 wrote:

If you didn't know how VP and ZO would interact upon immediately reading them, you have a serious problem.

As currently worded, VP is explicitly stating that it only prevents the recovery of life, not ES from regeneration - the wording actually says that you would still gain ES from ZO, which is incorrect. This will be fixed with the updated wording in 0.11.1

Trust me, I don't want to be "that guy" that argues with a mod for the sake of arguing with a mod. But Vaal Pact states: "Life leech applies instantly. Life recovery from flasks and regeneration has no effect."

I'm not really sure how it could be any more clear. Anything regarding life regen is immediately negated, period.

I just think this thread is silly, sorry.

I really do think that displaying it as something like "5.3% +15 (227)" would be an improvement, any chance of that?

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Xendran wrote:

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ben_sphynx wrote:

The problem is that nothing in the descriptions describe the ordering of the effects.

No it isn't. The problem is that regeneration is displayed improperly, and vaal pact needs to specify that it zeroes your life regen, not your life recovery from life regen.

Zealot's oath specifically says "Life Regeneration applies to energy shield instead of life", not "Life regeneration is converted to energy shield regeneration". While the second one could technically be avoided by some sort of ordering technicality, the first one can't.

If you have "0% +0 (0)" Life Regeneration being applied to energy shield, you get no ES regen.

Ever noticed that when you talke ZO it changes "life regen" to "energy shield regen"

It is quite obviously a conversion.

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Although people would still need an understanding of how stat conversion works, so it does not really help, as that appears to be frequently misunderstood, too.

Neither of these skills do any conversion. ES does an application, not a stat conversion.
This is why actual conversion like blackgleam is "50% of physical damage converted to fire damage", and not "50% of physical damage applied as fire damage".

Conversion takes a base stat and changes it to another base stat, application takes a base stat and applies some or all of its value as if it was something else, without actually adding to your base stat. You don't get "x% +y" energy shield regen, you get "x% +y" life regen applied to energy shield.

Hyperliteral reading.