RIP defensive curses

Just stop using defenfsive curses on bosses like Uber Elder. They were waste of mana anyway.

"

Asmosis wrote:

It's overall effectiveness vs regular bosses has been further nerfed by about 33%.
It's overall effectiveness vs shaper/elder has actually increased a bit, but is still essentially useless.

I agreed with most of what you said in the rest of your comment that I didn't quote, but your math here is really bad.

Against regular bosses, the curses had 40% effectiveness before and now have 0.5 * 0.67 = 33.5% effectiveness, a 16.25% relative nerf.

Against shaper/elder, the curses had 20% effectiveness before and now have 0.5 * 0.34 = 17% effectiveness, a 15% relative nerf.

No idea where the fuck you got "33% nerf" and "buff" from. These curses were not buffed for shaper and elder.

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codetaku wrote:

Enfeeble and Temp Chains just got even worse for bossing than they used to be.

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Enfeeble

Mana Cost at gem level 1 is now 16 (was 24).
Mana Cost at gem level 20 is now 33 (was 50).
Now causes Normal and Magic enemies to deal 21% less Damage at gem level 1, up to 30% less Damage at gem level 20.
Now causes Rare and Unique enemies to deal 10% less damage at gem level 1, up to 15% less damage at gem level 20.

"

Temporal Chains

Mana Cost at gem level 1 is now 16 (was 24).
Mana Cost at gem level 20 is now 33 (was 50).
Now causes Normal and Magic enemies to have 20% less Action Speed at gem level 1, up to 29% less Action Speed at gem level 20.
Now causes Rare and Unique enemies to have 10% less Action Speed at gem level 1, up to 14% less Action Speed at gem level 20.

So to reiterate, before any special boss modifiers, temp chains and enfeeble have had their efficacy cut in half. Then,

"

Bosses which previously had 60% or 80% less effect of curses on them now have 33% or 66% less effect of curses on them respectively. This includes map bosses, Incursion architects, Betrayal targets, Breachlords, Shaper, Elder and others.

If they wanted temp chains and enfeeble to not be nerfed, then these new values would've been 20% and 60% less effect of curses, to exactly offset the new half effectiveness of enfeeble and temp chains against rare and unique enemies.

Instead, these curses are just worse than they've ever been. Previously they had 20% effectiveness against endgame bosses, now they have 0.5 * .34 = 17% effectiveness. Super lame.

Yep. People were crying about "constant Occultist buffs", well she got hit pretty fucking hard, because most Occultist builds utilisted TC + Enfeeble combo and any rare is now way more dangerous (Deep Delves are on suicide watch btw).

The only Occultist build I can think of that actually benefitted from that change is RF Occultist that didn't used defensive curses to begin with.

Nerf for Juggs and other classes that used low level CWDT Enfeeble and whatnot for defense as well. Though it's buff for most builds that used Warlord's Mark for leech or Elemental Weakness for extra damage.

Is this a player BUFF for map modifiers then?
Or is it a one way street...
As in players are cursed with tempchains/enfeeble.
Will it not be as bad?

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codetaku wrote:

"

Asmosis wrote:

It's overall effectiveness vs regular bosses has been further nerfed by about 33%.
It's overall effectiveness vs shaper/elder has actually increased a bit, but is still essentially useless.

I agreed with most of what you said in the rest of your comment that I didn't quote, but your math here is really bad.

Against regular bosses, the curses had 40% effectiveness before and now have 0.5 * 0.67 = 33.5% effectiveness, a 16.25% relative nerf.

Against shaper/elder, the curses had 20% effectiveness before and now have 0.5 * 0.34 = 17% effectiveness, a 15% relative nerf.

No idea where the fuck you got "33% nerf" and "buff" from. These curses were not buffed for shaper and elder.

You should have a read of what temp chains quality bonus is.

"

Asmosis wrote:

You should have a read of what temp chains quality bonus is.

You think it's unchanged for rare/unique enemies? I'll be genuinely shocked if it isn't brought back in line with the rest of the gem, "Cursed Normal and Magic Enemies have 0.5% less Action Speed per quality, Cursed Rare and Unique Enemies have 0.25% less Action Speed per quality".

Besides, even if you are right about this (which I frankly sincerely hope you are--a temp chains buff would be amazing even if enfeeble is still getting nerfed), your math for "regular bosses" is still wrong. You said it's been nerfed by 33% for them, but in this hypothetical case it'd be

30/40 * 0.67 = 50.25% effectiveness at 21/20 (or 20/23), from 40%, which is around a 25% buff of temp chains for regular bosses, not a 33% nerf.

(incidentally, 30/40 * 0.34 = 25.5% effect, which would also be a roughly 25% buff against endgame bosses)

Hahah this warrants a bump, not only were you wrong but even my own guess about what would happen to the quality bonus was overly optimistic!

Temporal chains wasn't just nerfed by 15% for endgame bosses, it was gutted.

A 21/20 temporal chains was nerfed for bossing by 36.25%, and the effective nerf only gets worse when you consider builds that were running high-level Enhance gems.

Jesus that's sad.

well my assumptions were wrong.

Temp chains (slow) gains nothing from quality now, so enhance is out the window.

You literally only have 14% slow* to work with making it inferior to every other form of slow in the game for substantially more investment.

The original 75% regular effect (L4 enhance, 50% curse effect) which was 15% on shaper and 30% on bosses is now 7% on shaper (come on, really GGG?) and 14% vs regular bosses.

So a flat 50% cut in effective slow, same as enfeeble. /Trashcan

Oh they have f'd up the quality on both TC and enfeeble ? The only use of enhance in all the game was here lol. Very bad news for delvers...

Oh no they nerfed enfeeble aka monsters-go-limp curse.
Oh no gaem harder now.
Oh no I played 0 seconds in new league and the sky is falling.
Oh no it's not like they made at least 4 NEW abusable builds this league and added the fuckin ES leech support.

That being said what the fk am I supposed to use now instead of TC now in my 4L Bane.