PLEASE MAKE BUYOUTS ALTOSELL FOR GOD SAKE!!

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Completed 1 ChallengeVanesya wrote:
They saved PoE on PC because they didn't use an AH like diablo. Problem is: in an economy where resources are continuously created without been consumed (like PoE pieces of gear) you cannot introduce a perfect market like AH otherwise you have a drastic decrease of prices and only perfect gear would be sold. See diablo cases. As someone says some post earlier, we need another solution to avoid this.


There are TONS of ways to remove resources from the game especially with the crafting system they have.

None of this is a decent reason to not have a buyout.

Simply put, no buyout is ruining the game for a MASSIVE amount of players. SSF of course have no interest, but anyone who enjoys trading which is a lot of players, are having a crap time which can be easily remedied.

We aren't just comparing to D3, we are comparing to all RPG games that can be played with multiple people. I personally have played a lot of MMORPG games and every one of them has a buyout option because developers understood people play in different time zones and can't always get together.

Even EQ remedied it in the early stages of MMO's by adding the auction houses where you could buy your own merchant and that was over 20 years ago.

Hell if nothing else have people pay orbs or whatever to sell on the merchant. There are literally a hundred ways to reduce currency to keep value high and they can easily tweak it as it goes, but to say a buyout would hurt this game when every other game flourishes with it is about as inane of a statement that can be made.

They are costing themselves hundreds of dollars per year just from myself, let alone from other players that obviously want it.
I expect that flagging rares and uniques that were acquired through a modified buyout regime as account bound would act as a fairly robust item sink. Leaving "white" and "blue" stuff unregulated would allow crafting (such as it is on Xbox) to continue.

The trouble is, is that a lot of nice gear would not get back on to the market after being traded once.

I thought that GGG was somewhat clear in the Trade Manifesto that on Xbox, they think people selling what they find is good, but people "flipping" was bad (an interpretation of looting should remain the focus). GGG also said that the situation had gotten away from them on the PC platform.
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I expect that flagging rares and uniques that were acquired through a modified buyout regime as account bound would act as a fairly robust item sink. Leaving "white" and "blue" stuff unregulated would allow crafting (such as it is on Xbox) to continue.

The trouble is, is that a lot of nice gear would not get back on to the market after being traded once.

I thought that GGG was somewhat clear in the Trade Manifesto that on Xbox, they think people selling what they find is good, but people "flipping" was bad (an interpretation of looting should remain the focus). GGG also said that the situation had gotten away from them on the PC platform.


As a counter measure for flipping items, you could as some gained exp threshold while having the item equipped. First I thought of a timer, but ppl would just gear it and stand in town for 10h while afk and let the timer run. But if you would based on itemlevel and dropchance add an amount of experience you have to gain, means you could resell it once u dont need it anymore.

Maybe combine it with a dunno 7 days timer, so what ever triggers first, gained exp or time. Crafting the item would eliminate the timer/exp. So you could still craft any item you see fit. Just not instant selling the bought item, without using it.

Something like that should actually work.

I would just go away from permanent binding an item to account, this would make it so much harder to experiment with some builds and so many ppl are already complaining that items are soo expensive. This would just push prices even more.
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filix wrote:


As a counter measure for flipping items, you could as some gained exp threshold while having the item equipped. First I thought of a timer, but ppl would just gear it and stand in town for 10h while afk and let the timer run. But if you would based on itemlevel and dropchance add an amount of experience you have to gain, means you could resell it once u dont need it anymore.

Maybe combine it with a dunno 7 days timer, so what ever triggers first, gained exp or time. Crafting the item would eliminate the timer/exp. So you could still craft any item you see fit. Just not instant selling the bought item, without using it.

Something like that should actually work.

I would just go away from permanent binding an item to account, this would make it so much harder to experiment with some builds and so many ppl are already complaining that items are soo expensive. This would just push prices even more.


Sounds like a concept worth some further thought.

It would be predicated on players not being able to "bot" their characters which seems to be the generally accepted conclusion for Xbox.

It would need a definition for "experience" but the current experience earned seems a good place to start. Perhaps some thought might have to go into whether or not heavily twinked characters could materially shorten the time required to earn the experience. Should experience earned be split between all the eligible equipped items, or should each such item get a full experience credit?

I would probably go with a slot limit regarding time - no less than x but no more than y - so the experience requirement would affect the time required between x and y.

I would not count adding a master craft (or whatever new form they take) to a rare as a requirement eliminator (but adding a lab enchant or scouring should definitely count). Other things needing a decision are likely out there.

As an addition to your suggestion, perhaps experience could also figure into how much more than the purchase price that the item could be resold for.
So if you bought something for 4ex, you could always sell for 4ex, or less. But if you put some miles on it, you could then sell it for more. At the end of the account bound period, you could sell it for whatever. This might be a little difficult to administer because any remaining account bound requirements would need to stick with the item on sale (and be visible to buyers).


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sehenry10 wrote:
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Completed 1 ChallengeVanesya wrote:
They saved PoE on PC because they didn't use an AH like diablo. Problem is: in an economy where resources are continuously created without been consumed (like PoE pieces of gear) you cannot introduce a perfect market like AH otherwise you have a drastic decrease of prices and only perfect gear would be sold. See diablo cases. As someone says some post earlier, we need another solution to avoid this.


There are TONS of ways to remove resources from the game especially with the crafting system they have.

None of this is a decent reason to not have a buyout.

Simply put, no buyout is ruining the game for a MASSIVE amount of players. SSF of course have no interest, but anyone who enjoys trading which is a lot of players, are having a crap time which can be easily remedied.

We aren't just comparing to D3, we are comparing to all RPG games that can be played with multiple people. I personally have played a lot of MMORPG games and every one of them has a buyout option because developers understood people play in different time zones and can't always get together.

Even EQ remedied it in the early stages of MMO's by adding the auction houses where you could buy your own merchant and that was over 20 years ago.

Hell if nothing else have people pay orbs or whatever to sell on the merchant. There are literally a hundred ways to reduce currency to keep value high and they can easily tweak it as it goes, but to say a buyout would hurt this game when every other game flourishes with it is about as inane of a statement that can be made.

They are costing themselves hundreds of dollars per year just from myself, let alone from other players that obviously want it.


They are simply never going to do this, and to be able to do this they would have to completely change how their gearing system works, most notably what most MMOs ended up doing which is make gear bind on equip which makes it bound to a character once it is used. That is not a minor thing to change and there is absolutely no way they will add it to the current system, because if you could instantly buy your best gear in 30m after hitting maps you will stop playing or at least a lot of people will stop playing and that wouldn't be a good situation for the game.

What I want on trade is improved searching to find something I actually need, but I don't think they will ever add an autobuyout and honestly I don't really blame them
And having a better search is totally against their manifesto as well. So both probably wont happen in a way we want.
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Completed 2 Challengesmetfansc wrote:
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sehenry10 wrote:
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Completed 1 ChallengeVanesya wrote:
They saved PoE on PC because they didn't use an AH like diablo. Problem is: in an economy where resources are continuously created without been consumed (like PoE pieces of gear) you cannot introduce a perfect market like AH otherwise you have a drastic decrease of prices and only perfect gear would be sold. See diablo cases. As someone says some post earlier, we need another solution to avoid this.


There are TONS of ways to remove resources from the game especially with the crafting system they have.

None of this is a decent reason to not have a buyout.

Simply put, no buyout is ruining the game for a MASSIVE amount of players. SSF of course have no interest, but anyone who enjoys trading which is a lot of players, are having a crap time which can be easily remedied.

We aren't just comparing to D3, we are comparing to all RPG games that can be played with multiple people. I personally have played a lot of MMORPG games and every one of them has a buyout option because developers understood people play in different time zones and can't always get together.

Even EQ remedied it in the early stages of MMO's by adding the auction houses where you could buy your own merchant and that was over 20 years ago.

Hell if nothing else have people pay orbs or whatever to sell on the merchant. There are literally a hundred ways to reduce currency to keep value high and they can easily tweak it as it goes, but to say a buyout would hurt this game when every other game flourishes with it is about as inane of a statement that can be made.

They are costing themselves hundreds of dollars per year just from myself, let alone from other players that obviously want it.


They are simply never going to do this, and to be able to do this they would have to completely change how their gearing system works, most notably what most MMOs ended up doing which is make gear bind on equip which makes it bound to a character once it is used. That is not a minor thing to change and there is absolutely no way they will add it to the current system, because if you could instantly buy your best gear in 30m after hitting maps you will stop playing or at least a lot of people will stop playing and that wouldn't be a good situation for the game.

What I want on trade is improved searching to find something I actually need, but I don't think they will ever add an autobuyout and honestly I don't really blame them


It sounds cute and everything, but you with others keep ignoring the fact that the xbox AH is not original in the first place 😎 Because of that it makes no sense to talk for the xbox AH and how it is ggg DNA..
It only support non serious price dumping which makes people ignore the AH
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filix wrote:
And having a better search is totally against their manifesto as well. So both probably wont happen in a way we want.


Yeah, I increasingly view this as a test of wills, rather than being a hopeless battle to change what has been written in stone. Sadly, I suspect that until we get enough mass to start raising a noticeable stink on Reddit, the process is going to be unrewarding.
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filix wrote:
And having a better search is totally against their manifesto as well. So both probably wont happen in a way we want.


Yeah, I increasingly view this as a test of wills, rather than being a hopeless battle to change what has been written in stone. Sadly, I suspect that until we get enough mass to start raising a noticeable stink on Reddit, the process is going to be unrewarding.


Yeah what I am wondering is, if we all would just start to withhold money and stop purchasing mtx, how they would react. I mean either they say, oh yeah lets improve the xbox version or just say, well, it was never really worth the effort, lets just shut it down, which would ofc be sad.

I mean management wise they seem to totally ignore the xbox platform right now, otherwise they might actually adress us in some posts or put some more resources into the development.

I mean even Jeff got super slow in communication, if you check the bug reports. Player not able to leave the city on their main acc. Working with sec account. Then he asks for a pm, but seems still no resolve and no answer. That doesn't look like good old Jeff. I mean a few month ago at least he tried to communicate, but feels like someone told him as well to hold back. Maybe they use the xbox team for the ps4 stuff, I mean its a different platform, but stuff like skill targetting etc, they dont want to develop twice.

But I guess they stopped communicating, because what they would tell us, wouldn't satisfy us, so probably their business decision was to keep hopes up as long as possible instead of telling us the ugly truth :p

Ofc just an assumption and personal opinion combined with guesses :-)
I still think that our best way "out" is growth. When the numbers support more spending by GGG, that's when it will happen. Right now we seem to be in some sort of classic trap - we need progress to grow and growth to progress. In that regard, every resource that GGG puts into Xbox can be seen as a vote of confidence on their part. I hope that I am not the one who bails first.

And personally, I think that there is more than one result possible from shrinking GGG's revenue and I feel that doing so is risky.

If things seemed to get so bad/silly that I stopped playing, I definitely would stop spending. But while I am still playing, I will probably base my spending decisions on whether or not I want something (like a Delve Stash tab, or a supporter pack).

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