Is the benefit of no full respecs worth its costs in lost players?

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Necromael wrote:

Its like 8-12 hours to make a new character, maybe even faster with expansion now. Don't see whats the problem.

If someone can't handle it, they are free to play a game of their choosing that caters to their specific needs.

8-12 hours for veterans. not new players. and frankly I'd prefer to have fun during those 8-12 hours. Also, one full respec may not be near enough if you are really trying to experiment.

Did you see the discussion about Diablo III when it was being made? There was an enormous outcry about removing stat and skill point assignments, lamenting the loss of character investment. They later implemented the paragon system where you get to assign points, though you can respec those whenever and will eventually reach the point where you can assign all the points. I bet some people have skipped Diablo III or quit it early because unlimited full respecs allow going through all the options very fast and you literally can't FUBAR your character.

Personally I think PoE has a pretty good balance. The free respec points you get while leveling allow fixing small mistakes. Every three months the free full respect gives an option for a larger overhaul. The limited respecs and time investment for leveling skill gems give me an incentive to make my build work rather than abandon it at the first sign of trouble. And I do make my own builds; six characters have made it to maps so far, with various levels of efficiency.

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ladish wrote:

I find respec stinginess fairly arbitrary due to full respecs each patch. On the other hand I also wouldn't want it to be too cheap to completely respec a week into a new league to fotm build. I wouldn't have a problem with a respec orb as rare as exalts.

yeah i do think there should be a grind of some sort to get a full respec item, but not the grind required to get enough currency for respec orbs. Again this is for new players, not for veterans who understand everything about the game.

I have very little attachment to characters I create using a net guide but the game is too tedious to go in blind. All you do is click the nodes in the order they tell you and try to get the items they tell you to.

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Shagsbeard wrote:

What aspect of your character can't you respec? Trade for regrets and you can respec all you want. You just want stuff for free.

I'll tell you... I lose interest in a character as soon as I respec it. I might play it a week or so before retiring it, but the respec never leaves me feeling a sense of ownership of the character. Feels like cheating. Probably is... even if it's allowed.

There's a reason cheats aren't allowed in games. It lessens the sense of accomplishment, and that's pretty much what we play for.

there's nothing preventing you or others from rerolling even if there are full respecs. If that's what you enjoy just reroll and gear a new character and swap whem you want.

I think they are keeping a lot more players than they lose by making it not trivial to fully repec your characters. Everybody already gets 3 to 4 full respecs on every one of their characters per year. If there are any players "lost" by not giving free respecs at will, they are not really the kind of players who will be around for the long term. Give them the free respec and they'll want free max level gems to make use of it. Give them that and they'll want free equipment upgrades. There are other games for people who don't want to work for their progress. I left D3 before they started having seasons, but there was a reason they gave so few character slots. It was because it was pointless to have more than one of a class. And to me that's not the way to keep players playing for a long time.

So I guess my point is that they are not losing any players that were going to be long term players anyway.

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visage wrote:

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PrivateRiem wrote:

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The fun in ARPGs is at "endgame", not leveling

1000% disagree.

1000% disagree with your disagree

Been playing since league 1, and leveling through the same acts 3x per character has become more of an annoyance over being fun

lvl 60-65 When you start mapping is where the fun begins

he was disagreeing with the fact leveling becomes become/is boring and prefers end game xd

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PrivateRiem wrote:

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The fun in ARPGs is at "endgame", not leveling

1000% disagree.

If we go by numbers, only 1% of the population makes it to end game maps which is sad since builds and the game itself does not really shine until the challenge ramp up at the map start.

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Shagsbeard wrote:

What aspect of your character can't you respec? Trade for regrets and you can respec all you want. You just want stuff for free.

I'll tell you... I lose interest in a character as soon as I respec it. I might play it a week or so before retiring it, but the respec never leaves me feeling a sense of ownership of the character. Feels like cheating. Probably is... even if it's allowed.

There's a reason cheats aren't allowed in games. It lessens the sense of accomplishment, and that's pretty much what we play for.

I came here just to say the first part - you do have unlimited respecs OP, so your premise is flawed. But now that I'm here quoting this, I'll agree with the rest (minus the cheating semantics). I'm the same way with my characters...I can't bring myself to respec something into a different main skill gem, I'd rather just make a new character. I also try to level up with whatever I'm going to use at end game ASAP, even if I would be better off leveling with EQ/Flameblast.

Hmm, well lets see

The game has continued to grow in players (both accounts and retention of players)
Guess people like that their choice means something

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databeaver wrote:

Personally I think PoE has a pretty good balance. The free respec points you get while leveling allow fixing small mistakes. Every three months the free full respect gives an option for a larger overhaul. The limited respecs and time investment for leveling skill gems give me an incentive to make my build work rather than abandon it at the first sign of trouble. And I do make my own builds; six characters have made it to maps so far, with various levels of efficiency.

You made a really good argument. I no longer agree with myself about a potential full respec orb, even a super rare one :D