Lack of Passive Tree reset diminishes enjoyment
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I don’t know if the Dev’s feel they need to "not" have a full Passive Tree reset to keep this game labeled as hardcore, but considering the depth of the game it feels punishing and counter intuitive for the design of this game. Frankly PoE would keep me playing much longer with a full passive tree reset then how it is now. The passive tree the way it’s constructed is frankly a work of genius in the flexibility it provides, however that flexibility is diminished by punishing the player for experimenting when a non-standard build doesn’t work out as intended. Your virtually tossing out dozens of hours of game play when you find your well planned out build that was going to rock ends up to be a pancake instead. Often it’s just less time consuming to trash an ill-fated build and start anew, I don’t care how hardcore you are that feels like shit. BBB, you have this amassing game that’s deep and full of hundreds of hours of experimentations with skills, support gems, armor crafting …etc., you do not need to make it punishing for the players to experiment with passive skills to improve the games longevity. In fact I believe if you ease up on this and allow inexpensive or free skill resets you’ll scare away far fewer players and promote a much more interesting and diverse character builds. This game could become the Magic the Gathering of Action RPG’s but not if you have to rip up your deck to build a new one. Just my two coppers! This thread has been automatically archived. Replies are disabled.
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Except sadly with this crazy system they got going on, a full tree re-spec would easily break the power of clever players.
Making a leveling build then when late game rolls around buy a full re-spec and BAM you have a free 80 points to make a super build that doesn't have to worry about have a weak early game cause you've already done it... |
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Yep, having an easy respec system would just herald in "leveling builds". Everyone would spec the exact same way for optimum leveling speed, then respec to their preferred build once they hit high level. The devs have also said that decisions for building a character should be on a level-by-level basis. They intend that to be a part of the game, and putting in an easy respec system would completely negate that; your passive point decisions should matter at every point in the game.
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You have to look at the other side of the coin though. For new players.. They don't have a clue as to how the game works. This results in frustration because they can't find that build they want. Sure you can read builds on the internet but, is that your style? Not all of the time. Then you have to make modifications and test to see if it works to your liking.
I made a similar post to this if you read my profile. I suggested that they give any new characters made and any current character 1 full respec. I then suggested that they make any further full respecs a micro transaction based thing. Another thing you can do too is change the Orb of Regrets to 55 (half of current max skill points) or something. It won't be a full respec but, it would be enough to change major mistakes. I guess I will let the community think of a better idea. For now I am off to switch my build.. AGAIN. *frustration* |
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" New players are expected to mess up a build. I know I made one that was a pure glass cannon. That worked out until act three where I got slaughtered, I spent most of my collected items to fix my mistake to get enough life to be live. After I got a few more levels in I was able to have a solid build. Luckily this happened at a point where it doesn't take a day to level up, but it was still possible to fix my noob mistakes. As for a microtransaction respec... I take that as a step towards pay to win. It is not hard to re-roll a new character. Most people find out they messed up before 40, and it's easy to get up to where you were at. Sure it may be frustrating but worth the effort if you can fix your build. |
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" Wow what a novel idea being able to play both a fun leveling build and a solid endgame build all on the same character. Is that a bad thing? Add to that a group build and a solo build and a PvP build is it really a bad thing to be able to optimise the same character for all of these as needed. And actually cookie cutter builds are exactly what you’re going to see because players are going to be more prone to researching what’s known to work rather than experimenting on their own. IMHO the Dev’s are flat out making a mistake not including reasonable affordable respect system. If you want a healthy game with longevity you have to decrease the barrier to entry by taking the fear away from making a gimpped build and wasting dozen of hours of game play. New players finding the game for the first time do not want to waste a handful of characters learning the ropes, and its rather boring taking the safer path and just following someone else’s cookie cutter build you found in a walkthrough on line. |
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" IMO, the problem with full respec is replayability. If you get a character to level 100, you will just keep respecing that. No pain, all gain. Rewards for achieving something in game should be more of an effort. I need more purple titles
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As much as I can understand new players to get frustrated with having to try out with builds, I disagree with Logun about decreasing the barrier. Not because I enjoy other players to getting frustrated, but by reminding them, that sometimes, challenges with the opportunity of failing can bring even more fun when succeeding.
Sometimes I get the feeling that players, who grew up in the WoW era, are only satisfied, if they can have everything a games has to offer immediately and at once with the most less efforts. Since I grew up with the H'n'S of the 90's, I highly appreciate the way GGG is going. It gives Path of Exile some charm, separating it from other modern ARPGs. So, Logun, when you ask if it is a bad thing to optimize every possibility in one character, I'd say yes, because you will reach the point where there is no need to start a new character and enjoy a new path. And when you say, people are afraid of wasting hours of game play, I'd say they should consider their time as a lesson. In the last two weeks, I made and deleted five different characters because I skilled into dead ends. But having to start over again gave me an even bigger understanding of this game, because I had to spend some time thinking about the skill tree rather than just using try and error in form of respecs till it works. And for new players to this game (like I am): There is nothing bad with starting this game with a cc build until you reached the point where you got some understanding of the game's mechanics. Then you can start trying your own builds and can experience the fun this game has to offer. As long as you are willingly. Otherwise, I would say, you are that kind of player I described above. |
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" That’s a good argument but what’s the difference if I play one character or a dozen the longevity is dictated by the gear collection. I will concede that a full respect system may not be practical but a more forgiving passive skill system is needed even if each character you created started with 50 respec points it would make the game more approachable. There has to be a half-way point! Not everyone has 12 hours a day to play and if you do the penalty of putting 20 to 30 hours into a character that becomes hopelessly screwed may not feel all that bad, but if you only have 2 or 3 hours a day that’s 10 days out the window and likely a disenfranchised player, some lessons come at too great an expense. You want to give players the ability to experiment and actively learn and make mistakes without the penalty of an unplayable toon and you don’t want your players to think of their characters as expendable throwaways. I don’t want to make this a case for casual vs hardcore but if you don’t aim for a critical mass of players your target audience may not be large enough to ensure longevity. |
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This subject again? :\
Please just trust us when we say that full reset is *not* a good idea for the longevity of the game. " Because you'd just get some good items and then respec the one character over and over, until you got bored and quit. Invited to Beta 2012-03-18 / Supporter since 2012-04-08 Last edited by VideoGeemer#0418 on Feb 22, 2013, 9:39:10 PM
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