Ziz and Blue Just Killed Shaper On EHC!

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kamil1210 wrote:

2. 15 hour of playtime on character that killed Shaper

If he only played 15 hours, why didn't he get the kill in the first day? :P

It doesn't matter how many hours you have on a character if you can load it up with gear you got while playing another character.

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kamil1210 wrote:

raiz > Ziz + blue

1. he did not used totem
2. 15 hour of playtime on character that killed Shaper
3. solo

Just to humor this meme, 15 hours played means nothing when the same amount is spent logged on another character to do all the trading needed etc. Ignoring the time spent trading is just a nice little thing he can claim, but essentially means nothing.

Solo, with gear acquired with currency from his group while pushing ladder since the start of the league (rip bob's money), not to mention all the untainted runs he was fed by viewers etc.

Ended up having to use vinktars with the never ending flask trick which in my book, is quite a bit cheesier than using a totem.

All that being said, solid kills from both groups, but waggle did it better.

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dudiobugtron wrote:

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kamil1210 wrote:

2. 15 hour of playtime on character that killed Shaper

If he only played 15 hours, why didn't he get the kill in the first day? :P

It doesn't matter how many hours you have on a character if you can load it up with gear you got while playing another character.

that sounds like salt from someone who didnt kill hc shaper in under 24 hours played. (: lulz

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dudiobugtron wrote:

"

kamil1210 wrote:

2. 15 hour of playtime on character that killed Shaper

If he only played 15 hours, why didn't he get the kill in the first day? :P

It doesn't matter how many hours you have on a character if you can load it up with gear you got while playing another character.

YOu are right, also it doesn't matter that you manage to kill bosses in this game faster than new player because you have load up experience from previous time you have played.

Also I have found it funny that people also write this on reddit. Meanwhile they upvote "lvl 90 in 11 hours, new record" xD.

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Just to humor this meme,

What meme?

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Czerpakistan wrote:

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dudiobugtron wrote:

"

kamil1210 wrote:

2. 15 hour of playtime on character that killed Shaper

If he only played 15 hours, why didn't he get the kill in the first day? :P

It doesn't matter how many hours you have on a character if you can load it up with gear you got while playing another character.

that sounds like salt from someone who didnt kill hc shaper in under 24 hours played. (: lulz

LOL. I couldn't kill shaper in HC even if I had 2400 hours played.

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kamil1210 wrote:

raiz > Ziz + blue

1. he did not used totem
2. 15 hour of playtime on character that killed Shaper
3. solo

by far not.
blue+ziz played that way better, not to say he palyed it horrible
time played doesnt matter unless selffound or from skretch
solo is an argument but actually 2man HP makes it harder than it is solo.

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Bars wrote:

- ES has always had regen and leech options in the last 3 years, you're either speaking about an older period or I'm missing something
- ES VP builds were incredibly good and much stronger than life builds years ago; ES was directly or indirectly nerfed hard in a couple of major patches
- life builds have been predominant by a large margin for years

1) obviously, there was a time when ZO did not exist and neither did GR
2)ES builds where good in the past couple of years, but their gear was hard to acquire and somewhat of a luxury, which made them less prominent and allowed less balance around their existence.
3) life builds have always struggled in this game, or rather, melee has which is dominantly run on a
life-pool. Like point 2) the gear was just more available and economically more efficient to build around.

The problem here is, is that ES builds and their associated EHP pools are becoming more mainstream, forcing GGG to balance around that. Coupled with the existence of vaal pact and your in for a rough ride on any
life-based build.

Attacks designed to burst down 12k+ EHP pools don't sit well on those 6K life based builds, no mater the excessive defensive layers.

Not to mention life leech scales with life pool buffer size, ironically making it also better on ES builds.

They just goofed by giving ES to much candy instead of interesting mechanical changes.

Peace,

-Boem-

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Boem wrote:

The problem here is, is that ES builds and their associated EHP pools are becoming more mainstream, forcing GGG to balance around that. Coupled with the existence of vaal pact and your in for a rough ride on any
life-based build.

Attacks designed to burst down 12k+ EHP pools don't sit well on those 6K life based builds, no mater the excessive defensive layers.

Not to mention life leech scales with life pool buffer size, ironically making it also better on ES builds.

They just goofed by giving ES to much candy instead of interesting mechanical changes.

I agree with most of the points, the only thing I don't agree with is that the problem is making ES too good: I think the problem is life being subpar due to a steady power creep. I remember a time when having 7k hitpoints was top-notch and HC players regularly played with around 6k.

Nowadays, there are white fucking mobs in high-tier maps which hit for roughly 5k phys damage per hit, unbuffed (!). Add in the occasional crit and you'll feel like paper at 7-8k hitpoints encountering a random pack of ranged mobs with fast projectiles, Vaal Constructs for example. This means you either need an absurdly high hitpoint pool, or extremely solid mitigation - and just evasion/dodge is not an option. The problem comes when you add the existence of extremely hard single hits from volatile mobs, some Beyond and map bosses, some hard-hitting magic and rare mobs, crits and the ton of map damage mods. This makes even a 75/75 blocker feel like Russian roulette if you don't have at least 7k life: and having 75/75 block and 7k life means you have taken no damage nodes whatsoever. It's either a high hitpoint pool with extremely good flat mitigation (a.k.a. juggernaut or pathfinder) or just an absurdly high hitpoint pool (over 10k, which generally means ES although I've achieved it with life/mom but that requires a more significant passive tree investment and gear finetuning than ES builds). And here we arrive at the question 'why not have an absurdly high hitpoint pool combined with excellent mitigation', a.k.a. pathfinder, and the only answer is 'indeed, why not?'.

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dudiobugtron wrote:

LOL. I couldn't kill shaper in HC even if I had 2400 hours played.

Not with that attitude.

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Boem wrote:

They just goofed by giving ES to much candy instead of interesting mechanical changes.

Sure have, not much difference between life and ES now and they were night and day at start.

Percentage regen is a big problem, yes, too easy to stack nowadays. I recommend switching to significant amounts of flat regen with passives to boost it in lower part of the tree. Regen + leech is too much, just leech might be easier to manage.

Let's try a 'spot the difference' game

Amulet - up to 38% crit chance
Ice golem - up to 30% crit chance

Amulet - up to whooping 7 life regenerated per second
Stone golem - up to 105 life regenerated per second

Anyone?