Why use Cast When Damage Taken + Immortal Call when you can't generate Endurance Charges?

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suszterpatt wrote:

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Nssheepster wrote:

My issue with that is the rarity of 100% physical hits that would work in that fashion. Devourers would be the closest example, but last I knew it had fire damage to it, not physical. So where, exactly, would this mythical situation occur? I don't know.

Porcupines, chimeras, those titty spine thingies from Lunaris, birdmen, skelly archers. Not to mention bosses like Argus. CWDT + IC is an absolute lifesaver for any build that doesn't rely heavily on block/dodge/evasion, even if it doesn't protect against everything.

Cough. Character that doesn't rely on Block, Dodge, Evasion....So that leaves Armor? The guys who can get Endurance Charges, or don't need Immortal Call at all? Unless you JUST use Life or ES, and NO other defenses....

Porcupines, not always all phys. Same with Chimeras, Birdmen, the titty things, and...Really? Skelly Archers? Like maybe on an Onslaught map, with a whole swarm of them surrounding an added phys damage rare, but come on, how often does that really happen to you? Skelly ARCHERS are the LEAST of my issues when I map. Skelly Sparkers, THOSE things are really annoying now.

I'm not saying you're wrong. And TBH, I didn't say the setup was bad to start with, simply that I dislike it and see little use to it.

I AM saying that your rebuttal doesn't really work for me, as to proving its usefulness.

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Nssheepster wrote:

Character that doesn't rely on Block, Dodge, Evasion....So that leaves Armor? The guys who can get Endurance Charges, or don't need Immortal Call at all? Unless you JUST use Life or ES, and NO other defenses....

Many players use flasks for defenses (Granite, basalt, stibnite, jade, etc...). These are useless against surprise hits, but work great if you have, say, 0.6 seconds warning. ;)

0,6s immunity is probably more than your reaction time

http://www.humanbenchmark.com/tests/reactiontime


also if yo uget a lot of hits in very short time (blue pack when entering new room, gore balls from birds, monsters exploding spikes) that 0,6 second can really help.

Btw Enduring Cry is easily accessible option for almost any build.

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tm10067 wrote:

Btw Enduring Cry is easily accessible option for almost any build.

Enduring cry is good for for sustaining charges while levelling, sure.

Enduring cry is not good for keeping up charges while in a boss fight and using CDWT + Immortal call (ie: what this thread is about).

^or ranged.. i dont know why ranged ppl use it.. how they generating the charges to even use IM? maybe use warlords mark? frenzy or power charge curses are better, imo

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^or ranged.. i dont know why ranged ppl use it.. how they generating the charges to even use IM?

This is the point of my post. Poison Bladefall trapper = ranged. Not really generating charges so...

For ranged (as I'm bow expert):

This is useful for:
1) Many rhoas charging to you at once
2) Many devourers appearing below you
3) Reflect dmg when shooting phys arrow off-screen in fast succession
4) Against traps as you take no phys dmg for that period
5) Against multiple archers when you enter room and 20 of them shoots at you at once
6) Against ground slam as it can hit you multiple times as wave progresses
7) In any other shitty situation when multiple phys things decide to wreck you at once

But when they really manage to hit you in complete synchronization - same time, then the IC will trigger afterwards of all hits - there must be some small amount of time between hits.

Etups rip last league would not have happened if he had cwdt + IC that .6 sec would have saved him

https://www.livecap.tv/t/etup/uzrLlirsWbI skip to 43 sec

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Nssheepster wrote:

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suszterpatt wrote:

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Nssheepster wrote:

My issue with that is the rarity of 100% physical hits that would work in that fashion. Devourers would be the closest example, but last I knew it had fire damage to it, not physical. So where, exactly, would this mythical situation occur? I don't know.

Porcupines, chimeras, those titty spine thingies from Lunaris, birdmen, skelly archers. Not to mention bosses like Argus. CWDT + IC is an absolute lifesaver for any build that doesn't rely heavily on block/dodge/evasion, even if it doesn't protect against everything.

Cough. Character that doesn't rely on Block, Dodge, Evasion....So that leaves Armor? The guys who can get Endurance Charges, or don't need Immortal Call at all? Unless you JUST use Life or ES, and NO other defenses....

I did say "rely heavily on block/dodge/evasion". As in, at least 50+% chance of avoiding an attack. Anything less and you're still very susceptible to burst damage.

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Nssheepster wrote:

Porcupines, not always all phys. Same with Chimeras, Birdmen, the titty things, and...Really? Skelly Archers? Like maybe on an Onslaught map, with a whole swarm of them surrounding an added phys damage rare, but come on, how often does that really happen to you? Skelly ARCHERS are the LEAST of my issues when I map. Skelly Sparkers, THOSE things are really annoying now.

I'm not saying you're wrong. And TBH, I didn't say the setup was bad to start with, simply that I dislike it and see little use to it.

I AM saying that your rebuttal doesn't really work for me, as to proving its usefulness.

Yeah, skelly archers aren't quite as dangerous as the others, but they can still crit pretty hard. And sure, those monsters sometimes hit with elemental damage as well, but the point is that CWDT + IC saves you from enough damage with enough frequency that it's still very much worth the sockets.