SET FREE THE ASCENDANCY POINTS (or rework the lab) [New ascension methods/lab rework ideas]

fuck it they dont change nothing i am very sad about the direction it goes.

its stupid without the 6 points.

ok these words maybe too late

no fun = done :(

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dickhole_mcghee wrote:

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Char1983 wrote:

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dickhole_mcghee wrote:

Yes, when I have a spotty connection ( either on my end or ggg's) I hate the lab more than 10 hitlers

Congratulations. You win the prize for the most inappropriate comparison of the year.

Well, it's not more than 50 hitlers, if that's what you're thinking.

WOW, calme down there, 50 hitlers is a little too much.

I give 15 hitlers and 1 Stalin.

the mess is done.

i am sad about ...

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Turtledove wrote:

1. Least of not is the fact that PoE is an ARPG where the fun game play we all love is killing monsters not trap game play.

POE is an hack and slash.

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2. Building for trap game play is stupid in an ARPG where we want to build in order to kill monsters. For example, getting more life makes killing monsters easier whereas it makes some traps harder because damage is same and life flasks are less effective.

Not in hack and slash. Player must think before go in, observe trap to make correct move.
Less effective ? All the time i did wrong move, life flask saved me, you just need use more charge.

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3. Lag will more likely kill when in traps.

I agree, but depend to your network and what server node you choosed on log screen.

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4. When dying in the labyrinth, the whole boring tedious thing must be rerun.

Maybe offert 5 portal like a map ?

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5. Don't like trap game play anyway so already in a bad mood before dying. This is like the opposite of my free solitaire on my iPhone. When I win then they switch to a full screen advertisement for other apps, knowing that people in general will be in a better mood if they just won and are less likely to rage quit the solitaire game because of an ad if they just won.
6. We expect to die from monsters not traps. Perhaps in this same point is we're more used to dying from monsters? If GGG thinks we should die more then GGG should beef up monsters not add trap stuff.

I like trap because they remember me DD pnp (and DDO) where trap can kill you like a monster can do too. This is a opinion not a general truth and i accept people don't like trap.

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7. I can't believe that GGG is actually adding the stupid push box crap to the game. I don't know how you can die from this yet but it is such a horrible idea I had to add it to the list anyway. :-(

Never did this map, i don't know.

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Rhilnix wrote:

POE is an hack and slash.
[...snip...]

Thank you for your comments. What I saw in your comments that could be summarized and included in the list is the hack and slash point. I've tried to rewrite to incorporate it. I also rewrote #2 and #5. Please feel free to correct clarify or comment further.

Why it is extra frustrating to die during trap game play.

1. Least of not is the fact that PoE is a hack and slash ARPG where the fun game play we all love is killing monsters not trap game play.

2. A character build for a hack and slash ARPG is frequently not compatible with a character build for trap game play. For example, more life improves the hack and slash game play whereas it makes some traps harder because damage is a percentage of life and life flasks are a fixed amount and so less effective. Another example, it goes against hack and slash ARPG game play for a relatively godly level 80 character to sometimes be so easily killed by a level 30 trap.

3. Lag will more likely kill when in traps.

4. When dying in the labyrinth, the whole boring tedious thing must be rerun.

5. Don't like trap game play anyway so already in a bad mood before dying. The reason I love PoE is because of the great hack and slash game play. Labyrinth has replaced the best part of PoE with horrible boring tedious and not fun trap game play. So I'm already hating on labyrinth and so if I die it makes it all the more frustrating.

6. We expect to die from monsters not traps in a hack and slash ARPG. Perhaps in this same point is we're more used to dying from monsters? If GGG thinks we should die more then GGG should beef up monsters not add trap stuff.

7. I can't believe that GGG is actually adding the stupid push box crap to the game. I don't know how you can die from this yet but it is such a horrible idea I had to add it to the list anyway. :-(

The "pushbox" thing is just a moving Elreon mission style mini-game with a ton of monsters spawning at you. It is, for me, the least painful "trap" there is.

Traps do not lag. I do. Traps do not DC. I do. POE is a game about drunk driving and running over pedestrians. Not drunk driving and dodging trucks/buses.

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rephikul wrote:

Traps do not lag. I do. Traps do not DC. I do. POE is a game about drunk driving and running over pedestrians. Not drunk driving and dodging trucks/buses.

removed #7 thx to comment from SudianX, clarified #6 by adding rephikul's brilliant summary

Please feel free to correct clarify or comment further.

Why it is extra frustrating to die during trap game play.

1. Least of not is the fact that PoE is a hack and slash ARPG where the fun game play we all love is killing monsters not trap game play.

2. A character build for a hack and slash ARPG is frequently not compatible with a character build for trap game play. For example, more life improves the hack and slash game play whereas it makes some traps harder because damage is a percentage of life and life flasks are a fixed amount and so less effective. Another example, it goes against hack and slash ARPG game play for a relatively godly level 80 character to sometimes be so easily killed by a level 30 trap.

3. Lag will more likely kill when in traps.

4. When dying in the labyrinth, the whole boring tedious thing must be rerun.

5. Don't like trap game play anyway so already in a bad mood before dying. The reason I love PoE is because of the great hack and slash game play. Labyrinth has replaced the best part of PoE with horrible boring tedious and not fun trap game play. So I'm already hating on labyrinth and so if I die it makes it all the more frustrating.

6. We expect to die from monsters not traps in a hack and slash ARPG. Perhaps in this same point is we're more used to dying from monsters? If GGG thinks we should die more then GGG should beef up monsters not add trap stuff. "Traps do not lag. I do. Traps do not DC. I do. POE is a game about drunk driving and running over pedestrians. Not drunk driving and dodging trucks/buses." by rephikul

As a side note, I think that they should just introduce checkpoints before each Aspirant's Trial, and increase the delay of logout to 3 seconds - heck it would be far better that it is now then, no more bragging about lag => fast logout => fast login and continue to play, if you're playing Hardcore, you should be treated as such (after they have sorted all the stability issues) - even on Standard we are losing 10% progress each time we die, which should be the normal for every difficulty...

The best solution regarding traps and Labyrinth layout, would be to chose between:

1) Destructible traps (doesn't it bother you that you can obliterate entire screens and a small iron pike will kill you no matter what, and you can't just crush it >.< )

or

2) Propose an alternative path way more complicated and longer filled with a +5-10 area level mobs, or even more difficult ones (heck they could just activate reflect packs or thorns and it would be a far better experience than trap dodging for some) - GGG can just adjust the XP and drop penalties to not undermine maps and Acts and they can call it a day...

Everyone would win those ways, those that want to race get to race as now, the others could do Labyrinth old school - good old slash and hack way (and the best part of Labyrinth - the exploring and the Izaro fights would stay unchanged - and getting the Ascendancy points will still be meaningful in context with the lore)...

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Turtledove wrote:

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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Egocentrism

Actually this article is very enlightening. I suspect that egocentrism is more common in adults when evaluating the rather subjective perception of game play. There's an absolute refusal on the part of some here in this thread to even accept the possibility that someone could perceive the trap game play in a way differently from them. Some people liking the lab seem to accept that fact after an explanation but others just absolutely refuse to accept the possibility that others might perceive the same thing differently than they way they perceive it.

Turtle I was hoping to get a wiki review from you. I hope that's not just reserved for harassing goetz.

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dickhole_mcghee wrote:

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Turtledove wrote:

I think it is a common theme for players to hate dying to traps worse than they hate dying to monsters. That is for a number of reasons. I think it might be useful for getting a high level view for the theme of this thread if we could investigate why this is in a bit more detail. If any others agree then let me start off by making a list in my approximate order of importance. I encourage others to comment, change, add, and present alternatives.

1. Least of not is the fact that PoE is an ARPG where the fun game play we all love is killing monsters not trap game play.

2. Building for trap game play is stupid in an ARPG where we want to build in order to kill monsters.

3. Don't like trap game play anyway so already in a bad mood before dying. This is like the opposite of my free solitaire on my iPhone. When I win then they switch to a full screen advertisement for other apps, knowing that people in general will be in a better mood if they just won and are less likely to rage quit the solitaire game because of an ad if they just won.

4. We expect to die from monsters not traps. Perhaps in this same point is we're more used to dying from monsters?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/False_dilemma