"Path of Exile - Trade Simulator" and why I'm Quitting

It comes with great sorrow that I have to write this.

I'm going to leave a TL;DR at the bottom.

To begin, I want to explain a little backstory about myself:



Now, despite my love for the game for having summoning I haven't seen since Diablo 2, it did have it's flaws. For me, the most notable one was the mandatory trading, and this is what has finally pushed me to stop playing. The average player can easily tell you that this game is economically driven. Everything you do, including your progression, is dictated by how much wealth you have accumulated. In order to enforce this, the game deliberately has poor RNG across the board (drops, crafting, etc) to encourage players to trade with each other.

So, what is wrong with this? Nothing, not unless you're among the few who claim to be one of the dreaded self-found players. Since the game's beginning up to now, threads have popped up every now and then by self-found players. Their request? To add a special league for those who wish to earn their loot the old-fashioned way, with greatly improved drops/crafting to balance the inability to trade. Unfortunately, most if not all of these threads have gone unanswered and the rest of the community responded with ridicule.

Sure self-found players could simply play the game as-is without ever trading, thus treating it like a self-found league all on its own, but you and I both know that doesn't solve the problem. It's one thing to give yourself a challenge, but to forbid yourself from trading in a game practically designed around it, it'd be like smashing your head against a brick wall hoping you can make one single brick come loose.

This flaw didn't become a real problem for me for the majority of my time playing the game, however. As a summoner, you're not restricted to a very small number of items that are rare or hard to come by, so I didn't have to invest much time or resources to make my builds relatively well off. I was able to obtain most of the items myself and if there were flaws in my defense, I could use my army of minions to compensate for my weaknesses. I traded, of course, but the gear I was able to buy was relatively cheap since it wasn't top-notch.

It wasn't until 2.0.0 did I learn how much of a fool I was.

Between the change of how reduced mana/enlightenment functions, the reduction of my minion's ability to draw aggro, monsters becoming even stronger and (non-map) bosses like Malachai obliterating me and my minions almost instantly, my main summoner now struggles to fight anything where I was once able to handle before the update. My current gear can no longer support me and my minions can't compensate for my weaknesses anymore. The only option I have now, if I want to continue using my main summoner, is to get new gear.

It was a simple fix for most, but for a self-found player like myself, it was a nightmare! Because of the overall poor RNG, I don't make a lot of currency, and buying equipment that would make me able to handle zones I could once do costs a great deal more. Ultimately, my plan to rebuild my summoner (and my many other builds) will never come to fruition and will only collect dust from this day on.

Self-found players (who already don't contribute to the market, mind you) wanted a self-found league where we can enjoy the game by progressing through the game all on our own without trading. It's clear GGG has finally responded to our pleas by outright telling us we're not wanted. It's either give in to obligatory trading or go away.

I play this game to enjoy the action, the 'A' in ARPG, not to spend what could be an hour or more browsing items on poe.trade or setting up a store page to peddle my garbage. Apparently, that's not enough.

I once sought refuge from Diablo 3, now I find myself going back to it. It's gotten to the point for me that I'm actually willing to trade away good, true summoning (the biggest reason I've loved this game for so long) if it means being able to progress to the endgame all on my own. This is why it hurts me to write this, that I had to make this decision, when all that was needed was a league that had better drop/crafting chances at the cost of not being able to trade.

I might come back to this game some day, but I can no longer support it like I used to.

TL;DR:
Path of Exile is merely a trade simulator with an ARPG minigame. I, and others, wanted a league to enjoy the actual ARPG aspects. Didn't get it. This game is no longer meant for me.

"

CharanJaydemyr wrote:

Go where you are needed.

You will be remembered.

Kira clearly holds all the answers to the universe ...

The main problem the game is build around trading, but doesnt have a proper TRADING SYSTEM!!

The only reason i found this thread in the first place was your posting over here on the D3 forums :)

Thanks for your contribution to PoE and good luck over there; judging from the upvotes you should have no problem with your return to D3 ;)

"

Tom7i wrote:

The only reason i found this thread in the first place was your posting over here on the D3 forums :)

Thanks for your contribution to PoE and good luck over there; judging from the upvotes you should have no problem with your return to D3 ;)

'Tis a small world, after all.

I also took the liberty to correct your link, you added an additional number that resulted in a page saying no such thread exists.

"

Pizzarugi wrote:

TL;DR:
Path of Exile is merely a trade simulator with an ARPG minigame. I, and others, wanted a league to enjoy the actual ARPG aspects. Didn't get it. This game is no longer meant for me.

Weird. My experience as a self-found summoner is completely different.

With none of my previous characters, I felt so little dependence on gear. And the little gear I needed, I found over and over. With regard to summoner gear, I found 3x Bones of Ullr, 3x Sidhebreath, 1x Vis Mortis, 1x Chober Chaber, 2x Mon'Tregul's Grasp, 3x Queen's Decree, and possibly more stuff that I forgot. I can run at least 3 completely different builds based on my self-found gear.

My character is currently level 93 and doing level 76-80 maps. She can do every single map mod, which is amazing.

As someone who plays self-found since he started with PoE in 2013, I also don't understand the perceived need for a self-found league. Playing self-found works fine as a self-imposed handicap, why would GGG want to dilute their playerbase and give it a separate league? That would also make it impossible for me to do something nice for The Woman Of My Dreams (tm), who also plays a bit of PoE, by gifting her a Death Harp I found, or something similar. I want to play self-found myself, but I don't want to play in a league where I can't make gifts to friends who prefer a different playstyle. If GGG would open a self-found league, I (as a self-found player) would simply ignore it, and play the regular softcore challenge/standard leagues so that I can make gifts when I want to.

In short, I'm sorry, but I don't know what you're doing. It sounds as if you played a different game. If you're interested, we can discuss build details, but it sounds like you're already gone. In that case, have fun playing other games, and feel free to give PoE another shot later.

"

Psyringe wrote:

Weird. My experience as a self-found summoner is completely different.

With none of my previous characters, I felt so little dependence on gear. And the little gear I needed, I found over and over. With regard to summoner gear, I found 3x Bones of Ullr, 3x Sidhebreath, 1x Vis Mortis, 1x Chober Chaber, 2x Mon'Tregul's Grasp, 3x Queen's Decree, and possibly more stuff that I forgot. I can run at least 3 completely different builds based on my self-found gear.

Overused quote is overused, but that's RNG for you. Among those items you've listed, I've only ever found 1x Bones of Ullr and 3-5x Sidhebreath, nothing else. And nevermind the rares I get.

"

Psyringe wrote:

My character is currently level 93 and doing level 76-80 maps. She can do every single map mod, which is amazing.

Well, kudos to you, but every person's experience is different. My main summoner is 83 and I can only do low/low-mid maps. First reason is because of my poor equipment and my lack of ability to find something even remotely sub-par on my own, second reason is that the new way maps drop after 2.0.0 has left me with only low/low-mid level maps and nothing higher.

"

Psyringe wrote:

As someone who plays self-found since he started with PoE in 2013, I also don't understand the perceived need for a self-found league. Playing self-found works fine as a self-imposed handicap, why would GGG want to dilute their playerbase and give it a separate league? That would also make it impossible for me to do something nice for The Woman Of My Dreams (tm), who also plays a bit of PoE, by gifting her a Death Harp I found, or something similar. I want to play self-found myself, but I don't want to play in a league where I can't make gifts to friends who prefer a different playstyle. If GGG would open a self-found league, I (as a self-found player) would simply ignore it, and play the regular softcore challenge/standard leagues so that I can make gifts when I want to.

That's what I mentioned in my OP. People like myself, who want a self-found league, don't want it to be a handicap. The game thrives on trading and forcing yourself to steer clear of it in it's entirety only results in making the game borderline impossible, especially if your goal is to reach the endgame. We want to play the game and not spend nearly-countless hours grinding haplessly for gear we could've otherwise gotten in minutes through trading.

And I similarly don't understand the argument about how a self-found league would further dilute the community. People who don't trade or poorly understand how to work the market already contribute little to the community as it is. Giving these people their own league where RNGesus isn't reaming them isn't going to take away anything.

And it's fine if you don't want to play in a self-found league, because you want to give gifts to your friends. Nobody is forcing you to play in an otherwise optional league. For the less social players, who may have little to no friends, it wouldn't be at any loss to them if trading was taken away, much less if they migrate to a self-found league.

"

Pizzarugi wrote:

Overused quote is overused, but that's RNG for you. Among those items you've listed, I've only ever found 1x Bones of Ullr and 3-5x Sidhebreath, nothing else. And nevermind the rares I get.

How much IIQ/IIR does your MF gear give you? You _do_ have a set of MF gear as a summoner, right?

Regardless though, you found 2 of the 3 summoner uniques that I'm actually using (Vis Mortis is the third one, all others are simply sitting in my stash). And I'm not sure how much good Vis Mortis is doing for me - I like having the 4th spectre, but it reduces my minions' life, and makes me more squishy (287 ES is not a lot for a chestpiece on a lvl 93 character).

Check my character in my profile. If you make your own characters public, I could also comment on yours, if you're interested. If you found Bones of Ullr, then - as a lvl 83 summoner - you can have 3 spectres, 9 zombies, and 13 skeletons running around with you. Not to mention an army of 36 _additional_ skeletons, including archers, mages, and a general, if you use Vaal Summon Skeletons. All those minions _will_ get you to at least level 76 maps if you set them up with the right skills.

"

Pizzarugi wrote:

Well, kudos to you, but every person's experience is different. My main summoner is 83 and I can only do low/low-mid maps. First reason is because of my poor equipment and my lack of ability to find something even remotely sub-par on my own, second reason is that the new way maps drop after 2.0.0 has left me with only low/low-mid level maps and nothing higher.

What do you regard as low/low-mid maps? After v2.0.2, sustaining a pool of lvl 76 maps (with bouts into higher level maps) seems perfectly feasible, if you can do all the previous maps. And as a summoner, even with subpar gear, you _can_ do those. Tunneltrap, the bane of melee characters? Piece of cake. Labyrinth/Terrace Map? You'll wonder why people even fear the boss. Torture Chamber? Requires a bit more player skill and maybe some adjustments, but is perfectly feasible.

And again - I am using one(!) summoner unique that you don't have, and that's actually one that many other summoners deem undesirable. And I have 10 more skill points available, which isn't much considering how many points we both have. Apart from that, I have _nothing_ that you couldn't easily get or compensate for.

"

Pizzarugi wrote:

That's what I mentioned in my OP. People like myself, who want a self-found league, don't want it to be a handicap. The game thrives on trading and forcing yourself to steer clear of it in it's entirety only results in making the game borderline impossible, especially if your goal is to reach the endgame.

You're trying to tell a self-found summoner who is playing the endgame for the last couple of weeks, that playing the endgame as a self-found summoner is borderline impossible. This is not going to work.

"

Pizzarugi wrote:

And I similarly don't understand the argument about how a self-found league would further dilute the community.

People in such a league would not be able to party up, or PvP, with people in the other leagues, although some would want to. Hence, further diluted community.

Personally I don't have anything against a self-found league, it would take nothing away from me. I just think it wouldn't be in GGG's best interest to create one.

It must be a frustrating realization to come to after all this time. I manage to put up with trade enough to progress, but oh how I would love an alternate SFL. Progressing by finding my own upgrades is so much more enjoyable for me.

As a dedicated sf player myself I totally agree though the solution I came to is different. Rather than quit I've decided to pretend the endgame doesn't exist and reroll a lot - which I understand that not being a solution for a lot of people.

The economy being more important than anything else will force the game to have a legacy of what could have been, but it's something I've chosen to accept much like my desire for a sfl.

PoE is like a beautiful french courtesan who will always be missing an arm.