A potential change I'm keen to hear your thoughts on

I'll condense this entire thread into one line:

These changes are bad in a vaccuum. We need to see more of act 4 to judge properly.

so with an rf skilltree with zealoths oath you would just have around 10% of es (mana in this case) regenerated per second?

this is actually a HUGE amount of regen, if you get around 3k es (it would equal 300 mana regen then). now slap mom ontop of it and you STILL have a huge defense, youre just missing arctic armour, thought you could run 1/2 more auras to counter that.






i dont know what youre all whining about ._.

The idea is insanely bold and interesting, of course - it would turn the metagame inside out and after some general rebalancing we'll see a new generation of fresh builds.

There is a major problem there, though, and not in this particular change only, but in multiple recent changes. In short - GGG seems to be trying (maybe even unintentionally) to slow the gameplay down a little, and sometimes does it in unfun ways.

Skills get cooldowns (often shared ones), enemies get periods of invulnerability that you need to wait through (phylacteral link, otherworldly), and now this change. The general theme here is "you have to wait" - doing nothing fun while you wait. Not the best thing for an action-RPG.

I'm aware, of course, that all these things are caused by different design problems, and solve those in reasonable ways. I'm also aware that you generally can avoid or mitigate the waiting (spending charges for some skills, running past p.link packs, getting some kind of energy shield regen), but the defaults DO matter.

For example, for most players encountering a p.link pack, it would be a default action to kill it. It would take unpleasantly long and be very frustrating, but we are all conditioned that we want to kill everything.

The same thing seems to be coming for this change: the default would be "let me take this node to get more auras and I'll just cast in bursts, because other ways cost too much points". Fine, but casting in bursts leads to waiting for recharge - and is, once again, frustrating.

Please, invent some kind of "better default mode" before implementing this change. While a few inventive players will find interesting ways to subvert the new EB, most beginners who will try it would be frustrated and unhappy, but keep playing for some time through that frustration. It would certainly leave an unhappy memory.

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TikoXi wrote:

I'll condense this entire thread into one line:

These changes are bad in a vaccuum. We need to see more of act 4 to judge properly.

You just won the internet.

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Serleth wrote:

This is just flat out wrong. You can get it working efficiently without taking a single aura reservation node. Setting up acro/phase/ondar's requires a lot more travel to get done, nevermind the six point investment on its own for the actual nodes.

Both Discipline and Clarity are essential to EB/MoM. You need reservation nodes to be left with enough unreserved mana if you want to run any more auras.

Both Ondar's and Acrobatics fall directly on the natural path between ranger/shadow when making an evasion build... They don't require any additional investment beyond the nodes themselves.

Not a huge fan of the mechanical change as it sound right now. Would need to be proven otherwise, but I'm open to the idea, I suppose.

What does bother me greatly is how the Mana/ES interaction will work. If it's used as "backup" mana, it might be ok, since your Mana Regen will allow you the time to regen ES, possibly (at least more easily). Otherwise, if it's used first, sustained use of it seems... problematic.

I was a little interested in the possibilities of this mechanic, but the drawbacks really severely outweigh the advantages. To quote someone on reddit:

"Yeah, that's not even a nerf, it's just straight up making EB useless."

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Charanjaydemyr wrote:

"

TikoXi wrote:

I'll condense this entire thread into one line:

These changes are bad in a vaccuum. We need to see more of act 4 to judge properly.

Cannot +1 this enough.

yeah thats about it, the way things are now it just kinda sucks but who knows what changes 2.0 will bring

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Kirana wrote:

"

Serleth wrote:

This is just flat out wrong. You can get it working efficiently without taking a single aura reservation node. Setting up acro/phase/ondar's requires a lot more travel to get done, nevermind the six point investment on its own for the actual nodes.

Both Discipline and Clarity are essential to EB/MoM. You need reservation nodes to be left with enough unreserved mana if you want to run any more auras.

Both Ondar's and Acrobatics fall directly on the natural path between ranger/shadow when making an evasion build... They don't require any additional investment beyond the nodes themselves.

discipline was never essential, only clarity was.

also, with the new version, you wouldnt care about how much unreserved mana you have, as your es is your mana pool then. this change actually gives you more open mana for MoM

"

so with an rf skilltree with zealoths oath you would just have around 10% of es (mana in this case) regenerated per second?

this is actually a HUGE amount of regen, if you get around 3k es (it would equal 300 mana regen then). now slap mom ontop of it and you STILL have a huge defense, youre just missing arctic armour, thought you could run 1/2 more auras to counter that.






i dont know what youre all whining about ._.

Perhaps because that would require running an RF skill tree for a non-RF build? You'd end up with no life regen, the same mana regen that you can get currently, no AA, and a build that does not focus on your skill's DPS. It's trash.