Guide to map pool management
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Part 1
I tried to type this directly into the interface here and somehow I managed to get half of it eaten by the browser. Should have built it in word and copy pasted *_* anyway this is just a work in progress at the moment. Overview and preface: There is this random guy who jumps in to make comments and ask questions from time to time through out this guide, you are a lot smarter and more well mannered than he is so clearly it isn't you but I thought i'd warn you all the same... you will know when because he shows up with quotation marks, "Hey are you talking about me again?", and no I'm not talking about you...you think everything is about you don't you...*sigh* some people...anyway lets get started:
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This guide is to help with map management. This is not a magic in a bottle guide. It is just a pragmatic approach at trying not to run out of maps. These suggestions are by no means the only or even best way to build a map pool, these are just some basic techniques to get you going and help you have a better chance of avoiding bad luck. If you feel you are too pro to get anything from this guide, your probably right, so just bookmark this for future use...not that you'd need it just other newbs who your too busy to speak with so you can just link them here ;-) TLDR:
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If someone just made a post saying they ran out of maps so they are going to quit POE, just link them to this thread...or troll them so hard that they will leave knowing our entire community is nothing more than nerd raging ass holes...you know if copy pasting a link is just too much effort...Also skip down to "guide starts here" if you don't want to read all the finer details...but prepare to be disappointed, even still, since there are plenty of things called words down there too! It is like that big fish head guy said from that star wars movie when he found out the death star was operational....o_O!! A bit about me and my perspective on mapping:
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1. I generally play hardcore mode leagues. "Is that cos' you think your better than everybody?" No, I am not a pro, "yeah we could tell that just by reading your crappy guide" don't shower me with your sweet compliments yet we are just getting started. I'm just a decent player who is offering some simple common sense advice. I played beyond for about 7 weeks and got to 92 and lvl 77/78 maps, "Yeah well I got to level 100"....ok then why exactly are you reading this guide again? "To troll you." given that this is an internet game that seems valid, moving along, I generally manage to stay at 75/76 maps and above, sometimes I'll do lower just for fun. 2. I don't have anything against folks who play on the non permanent death leagues. I mention my hardcore play just to indicate that I take a more conservative approach than many of you will need to take. For example, if your wondering why I may be recommending to just transmute/alteration/augment a map at a particular level that you would normally just alchemy and run then odds are you are either a much better player than I am, or you are playing in a softcore league, or your a much better player than I am and your playing in a softcore league. 3. Either way, it doesn't really matter since if I can sustain my maps on less % quantity than you then you should do even better if your adding even more quantity by doing rare maps while I am doing blue maps. 4. If you go over everything in this guide in detail only to realize that you already knew all of these things and you are applying these principles and still running out of maps, you are probably the most unlucky person on the planet. For everyone else, there is hope :-) 5. I write from a very conservative perspective. "I hate George Bush", no no not like political conservative like cautious...anyway I know it is possible to build a map pool in much much faster and more effective ways, the idea here is to grow a map pool consistently with stability, on a budget, and not to run out of maps. I.E. the guide is more about not going backwards rather than going forward and lightning speed. 6. I generally do short duration leagues. Although sometimes if I'm fortunate I'll get to play a lot of evening and weekend hours, generally I have to try to work within the confines of a time and currency budget. So I develop a map pool accordingly. I ideally want to be in maps sometime in the first 3-5 days of a new league, I know some folks get there early in the first day, but that just usually is not an option for me. 7. Most of you are ok with resorting to trade, or even enjoy trading, some of you would like to avoid trading at all costs. So I've built this guide with both sets of folks in mind, but more generally focused on trade minded people. You will, however, find "self found" tips in each section as you go, because I did not forget about you guys! That is correct, I didn't forget you, I just don't treat you that well...hey don't hate me its the same policy GGG has toward you guys :P I'm going to skip over particular mods and crafting on maps since that has already been done:
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Guide to crafting your maps: http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/339977 ---------Guide Starts here-----------
Starting out - I have no maps!
1. Run whatever act 3 merciless non map areas you prefer and can clear with the most safety and speed. Leveling is not just about being in the highest level zones, it is also about clearing those zones quickly and effeciently. 2. Do not start mapping until you are sure you can handle it. It doesn't matter if you are hardcore or softcore, have 100 maps or 2 maps, there is no point in running maps when really your gear just is not ready for it. If you pop your first map in only to get rekt in it, and fail to clear it then you lost a map and lost the opportunity to try to find more inside of it. Don't ever let that happen to you. 3. Don't worry about your map pool. Invest your focus on leveling and getting solid gear and farming/trading for/saving up some currency making sure your character is solid and ready for maps 4. When you get ready to map don't be afraid to buy some maps. Check poe.xyz, trade chat, and don't be afraid to spam trade chat a little bit. Getting 6-10 lvl 66 maps for a chaos was very do-able toward the end of the first week in the beyond league, check your local league for map rates, but they should be very cheap. If you wana take the slow but steady route just keep buying/trading/finding 66 maps and running them until you are level 80 and have 12-20 67+ maps. --> If you are so poor after buying gear good enough to get into maps that you do not even have a chaos orb then use chance/jewelers orbs to trade for lvl 66 maps. You should find someone who will sell you a 66 map for a jeweler or a chance, again xyz, trade chat, don't be afraid to spam, also don't be afraid to troll your guild chat for trades or put up a status message for your friends offering your trade offer. If you aren't in a guild join one. If you play the current hardcore 3-4 month leagues and cannot find a guild hit me up and I'll shoot you an invite *Self found tip: Self found is totally different!! Make sure you are ready in terms of maps, orbs and gear before you start mapping: Put off going into maps as long as your sanity can stand it. For the self found player Ideally getting 6-10 maps to start is good insurance that you will never again leave maps. Since you cannot trade, making sure your initial pool is larger than those who can fall back on trade is very important. Try to grind as long as you can stand it or until you are level 78-80 whichever comes first. Also make sure you feel good about your gear and your currency reserves. Just because you have a map pool, if you don't feel like you are able to clear effectively or safely or properly roll your maps it may be worth a bit more farming before jumping into maps to make sure that once you enter you will never go back! I've known hardcore players who grind regular game zones to 80 before even entering maps, there is no shame in it, and nothing feels worse than going to back to regular zones after running out of maps!
Starting out - ok I have some 66 maps now what?!
1. Once you start mapping use the chaos recipe and regal orb recipes: one rare for every item/gear slot = chaos orb (requires level 60+) same recipe for regal but requires level 75+ 2. Once you vendor your first set of rares for a chaos you have enough to go buy another 6-12 66 maps. 3. Wear rarity gear! If I told you there is an item mode you can wear that will increase your map drops would you use it? Yes. I know item quantity doesn't work on map drops...but I am not talking about quantity I'm talking about rarity. I don't care what kind of build you are using, somehow you can find a way to squeeze in 20-80% rarity over 100% is cool and all, but if your poor and cannot afford it don't worry about it just try to get to 50% it is a good threshold and will get you enough drops. 4. Why do I need more rares to drop? See chaos recipe above. Every chaos that drops = a healthy amount of low lvl maps. If you can farm a chaos every 5-6 maps you run you will never run out of maps. And odds are you will do much better than that. 5. Map quantity helps on two levels: map quantity bonus helps with map drops, but just as importantly it helps with item drops also, which gives you more chaos orbs and the ability to trade for maps at will. Wear some rarity and your getting even more benefit from the quantity bonus. 6. Generally speaking, don't alch low level maps. Yes, when we get to my fuzzy math section we will see that this rule could very well not be always true for everyone, but if your reading this thread it is true for you. Even though popping an alchemy on a map will generally give the map more quantity than transmuting the map there are some problems: A. Just sell the alchemy for 4 66 maps, you've done away with all the variance, and would you have been happy if that 66 map you alched had dropped you 4 66 maps? I know it is less psychologically fulfilling to trade than to find, but this isn't a guide to psychological fulfillment. B. Also if you are not O.P. McGee then odds are Murphy and his law will smite you with the world's worst mods on your alch roll and force you to scour and re-alchemy that map until you want to shove a fork in your eye (Why alch+scour? Because they are usually in conjunction cheaper than a chaos at the start of a league and we are cheap so we alch+instead of chaosing to save resources, what about at the end of the league you quip? WHo the F cares 'bout the end of the league you already got bored and quit waiting for the next league to start? Besides you already built up your map pool and are set by then.) Anyway, the point is, you shouldn't quit the game because you ran out of maps, you should quit the game because you just spent 7 chaos worth of currency on an item worth 1 jewelers orb (that level 66 map your convinced you can turn into a little piece of heaven if you just keep chaos orbing it.) 7. Use transmutes/alterations/augments. Try to get mods that work well for you. If your having to spend a chaos worth of alts to roll your 66 maps remember you could have just bought a huge fist full of maps for that price, so try to roll each map as little as possible, if your character is a little weak don't be afraid to just run white maps and purchase more as needed, if 66 maps are worth equal to or less than a couple of alts then there isn't much to worry about. 8. Sell excess rares you don't need for the chaos recipe. This will get you alterations, Every little bit counts especially if your poor! Keep an eye out for chromatic recipe and jeweler recipe items. Trade chromes 1:1 for alts as needed. 9. Don't be afraid to pick up a few random blue items and sell those too 10. If you run out of ID scrolls sell some transmutes and keep rolling forward Fuzzy Math
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factors: 1. financial value of your time 2. risk of death to dangerous map mods on hardcore modes 3. value in terms of orbs of a map at a particular level 4. quantity bonus on a map 5. value of chisels and vaal pieces vs. the added quantity bonus they provide 6. the amount of rarity (and quantity) you have on your character 7. your kill speed 8. your relative level of wealth Here are a couple of different perspectives: you have a level 69 map and lets just say in some random league it is worth a chaos orb. You put 4 chisels on it and in this league that is about 2 chaos worth of value. You alch it and chaos orb it twice to get mods you feel good about. You also add in 3 vaal pieces when you use the map. Lets say in this hypothetical league you've spent 6 chaos worth of total currency on this map not counting the map. And the map its self is a white map. You could have purchased 6 more white 69 maps and presumably run them all much faster since with no mods they may be easier than the rare map mods you are working with. On the other side of the spectrum lets say you have godly gear do amazing damage and have 200% rarity. Maybe you should always alch every map you run. Even a level 66 map. While spending an alchemy on a map worth a chance orb seems silly, the quantity bonus you will get also means you will get a lot more items and when combined with your 100%+ rarity boost that is a lot more items. Even if you get bad rares that is still more fodder for your chaos recipe, and there is some probability of getting a few decent rares worth a few chaos and maybe even something godly worth an exalt or more that you'd otherwise miss by not stacking up the extra quantity onto the map. if your dps is so high that you one shot stuff regardless then if there is no extra time wasted for extra hard mods maybe always alching is the way to go. I cannot give you a clear one size fits all answer, but do consider the above scenarios and factors and consider these things as you grow your map pool to see where you think you fit in. Concepts
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-Zana gives 1% quantity bonus per level she levels up -zana sells maps and chisels (generally worse than at market rate but if your self found you do what you gotta do) -chisels add 5% quantity to maps on white maps and 2% on blue/yellow maps, so chisel whites when possible -vaal pieces add 5% quantity when used in the map device with a map (don't use midnight they are valuable) -you get no quantity boost to maps from quantity on your gear or members in your party -do daily chains to level up your zana faster -do zana daily quests to get a shot at "free" map drops -get a group of friends to take turns on making maps especially on high lvl maps (if 6 players each put in one 78 map then you all win) -Guild's are also a decent option to find mapping companions -use rarity --> get rares --> vendor for chaos/regals --> profit, I mean buy maps as needed ;-) -3 maps of the same type vendor for a +1 level map -try to trade 5 maps for 2 +1 level maps if you can find anyone who wants them before you start doing the map vendor recipe -any white hammer (not a battle hammer) and any map = chisel -save your 66/67 maps for chisel recipe, never vendor them up as generally they are worth more as chisel recipe ingredients -it may be worth purchasing white hammers from vendors on self found mode -if you can sell 3 maps for more than it costs to buy a map of the next level up then selling is preferable over the map vendor recipe -white mobs drop maps up to the current maps level, blue mobs can give maximum +1 map level, yellow mobs maximum +2 map level -some people say magic/rare/pack size mods are very useful. I personally feel the magic mods is very good, rare is alright, and I don't care about pack size except for exp gain. -Piety in Lunaris level 3 has a somewhat decent map drop rate, this may be helpful for self found players if they run out of other options Looking for more guild members for races/4 month hc leagues, pm for info Last edited by TEBird on Nov 18, 2014, 10:59:38 PM
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Question/Answer section:
Question: How much life do I need to start mapping? Answer: It is a difficult answer to answer properly because there is no one answer. There are some really low life builds that can map just fine, but you might instant rip with 5k life if your build has no defense or resists, so here is my best shot at answering the question semi-intelligently: 1. Are you playing on permanent death league? If so You will want to be a lot more cautious. 2. Are your resistances at 75% resist all? (except for chaos) -Having maximum resistances is extremely important for mapping. Overcapped resists are handy for lower resistance curses, but having a remove curse flask or too and being quick on your toes can help you get bye without overcapping if need be. -Ideally having at least 0% chaos resistance would be nice, especially for a league like beyond. But if the rest of your resistances are at max and everything else is set, don't let negative chaos resist stop you from mapping, but be very careful about chaos damage 3. Consider all your mitigation. Having 6k life with no significant armour/evasion/block/extra dodge chance could be worse than 3k with really high stacked up multiple defensive systems. 4. With all of this in mind I personally as a general benchmark like to have 1k life going into cruel, 2kish life by the end of cruel, and ideally 3k+ life when I start maps. But this is with maximum resistances and either high evasion and one or more of these additional defensive systems: block chance mind over matter (mana shield) arctic armor acrobatics ondars cast when damage taken totems and or minions (anything that can help tank helps even if its just a little bit it is something) life leech life regeneration spell block lightning coil increased maximum resistance to a particular resistance or all resistances playing in a group of friends (playing with strangers can be dangerous if they do things that put you at risk, but playing with friends who look out for you or help tank for you can be a huge help especially when diving into maps for the first time.) freezing mobs other So in a nut shell, try to have at least 3k life to map, but it does largely depend on things like max resistances, Getting some Armour and or Evasion and the other types of Defensive systems you are running. As an extreme tongue in cheek example you could be chaos innoculation and map just fine with your 1 life point. ^_^ In all seriousness if your going ES I think on the conservative side 4k ES would be ideal to start with maps. If that sounds like an arbitrarily high amount consider that if you shop wisely on poe xyz you can probably pick up a 500es chest for 2-3 chaos in the first week of a league. Granted the rest of the mods on it will be garbage, but you can make up resits on other pieces that traditionally have less ES anyway like belt/jewelry. Looking for more guild members for races/4 month hc leagues, pm for info Last edited by TEBird on Nov 18, 2014, 10:46:36 PM
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2nd
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Question (although maybe you'll answer it later):
How much HP, damage and survivability you should have to start mapping. I'm on Merciless, the only thing that I have to kill yet is Dominus, I'm killed a lot in normal levels if I'm not careful or it's a corrupted area. Look at my Shadow if you wish to know how well I'm doing (level 66, 2.7kHP aproximately, Acrobatics, some block, a decoy totem, and cwdt + enduring cry). Add a Forsaken Masters questline
https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/2297942 | |
" Numbers are irrelevant. Can you easily clear Lunaris 3, without coming close to death? Time for 66 maps. Dying too much? level a bit. Clearing 66 maps easily? Move to 67. Feeling this stuff out is far more effective. A comprehensive, easy on the eyes loot filter:
http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/1245785 Need a chill group exiles to hang with? Join us: http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/1251403 | |
" I think Antnee is correct that feeling things out is really your best bet. Having said that, here are some things to consider: 1. Are you playing on permanent death league? If so You will want to be a lot more cautious. 2. Are your resistances at 75% resist all? (except for chaos) -Having maximum resistances is extremely important for mapping. Overcapped resists are handy for lower resistance curses, but having a remove curse flask or too and being quick on your toes can help you get bye without overcapping if need be. -Ideally having at least 0% chaos resistance would be nice, especially for a league like beyond. But if the rest of your resistances are at max and everything else is set, don't let negative chaos resist stop you from mapping, but be very careful about chaos damage 3. Consider all your mitigation. Having 6k life with no significant armour/evasion/block/extra dodge chance could be worse than 3k with really high stacked up multiple defensive systems. 4. As a general benchmark I like to have 1k life going into cruel, 2kish life by the end of cruel, and ideally 3k+ life when I start maps. But this is with maximum resistances and either high evasion and one or more of these additional defensive systems: block chance mind over matter (mana shield) arctic armor acrobatics ondars cast when damage taken totems and or minions (anything that can help tank helps even if its just a little bit it is something) life leech life regeneration spell block lightning coil increased maximum resistance to a particular resistance or all resistances playing in a group of friends (playing with strangers can be dangerous if they do things that put you at risk, but playing with friends who look out for you or help tank for you can be a huge help especially when diving into maps for the first time.) freezing mobs other So in a nut shell, try to have at least 3k life to map, but it does largely depend on things like max resistances, Getting some Armour and or Evasion and the other types of Defensive systems you are running. As an extreme tongue in cheek example you could be chaos innoculation and map just fine with your 1 life point. ^_^ In all seriousness if your going ES I think on the conservative side 4k ES would be ideal to start with maps. If that sounds like an arbitrarily high amount consider that if you shop wisely on poe xyz you can probably pick up a 500es chest for 2-3 chaos in the first week of a league. Granted the rest of the mods on it will be garbage, but you can make up resits on other pieces that traditionally have less ES anyway like belt/jewelry. Looking for more guild members for races/4 month hc leagues, pm for info Last edited by TEBird on Nov 16, 2014, 10:54:17 PM
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Thanks for the advice people.
Does Lunaris 3 farming include Piety? (I can kill her kiting slowly). Add a Forsaken Masters questline
https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/2297942 | |
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nice long post yha got man. You must be a writer and totaly shit batty insane ;)
ususaly i find you never EVER need to buy lower than 70 maps. What i ususaly do is somewhat similar to yourself , but in other ways very diffrent. I farm merc till about 70-75 depending on the character. As soon as i can i start farming pity ( she is really easy to MF farm just swap out for 2x resist auras with a granet flask and she is nothing ) once character is rdy for it i farm dom for the last 2 or 3 levels , Mf cull , gear swap , all that good stuff. now at this point maps are pretty cheap already you can get level 70 maps for fuck all , if you are keeping up with a new ladder , or in a race , you may have to start with 66's and work up. Not a big deal since you only want to tranz/alt them but cryps always chance them at the start of a new ladder ( after ladder is a bit older than no need to do this ) Roll the ususaly stuff majic mobs / pack size / high q% mods /2 x exiles / 2 boss , nothing new hear. ususaly i buy 10 of the highes map tier i can aford , ususlay it's level 70. Tranz/ alt them to good stats OR over 35 q% . Run the level 68 and 69 maps you get the idea is to start sustaining 70's while getting thge odd 71 or 72 , just save them for now.Start working your way up the ladder and move up when you get 10 maps or the next level. when you hit level 71 strand or level 72 maps you want to start alching them , if your character can handel it of course. spend no more than 1 chizle , 1 alch , 1 chaos per map AT THE MOST !!! ususaly try to use just 1 alch. Also level 72 maps is whare you REALLY want to be spending curency on cartboxes , not uncommon for me to spend up to 10 chaos on a cart box in a 72 ( you can get many much higher level maps out of them if rolled right ) Start chaining up if you have to move back a tier to rebuild up a bit that's ok try to keep at least 5 - 10 maps of the tier you want to be on if less than 5 fall back a tier. When you get to level 74 maps now you can start chiziles ,alch , chaos/vaal roll them good and hard get that map to drop you maps much harder to sustain hear. Level 75 + for hear you will stabalize at 75's pretty nice if rolling them properly sometimes spiking up to 78's try to build a pool a tier higher but sustaning much higher is expensive, don't roll yourself poor !! Also cart boxes MUST be rolled at this point , spend whatever it takes. Now for 1 of the largest diffrences in your aproch vs mine . fuck Mf gear in maps untill you hit level 75. Use Mf gear to farm standard game but once in maps go full tank/gank. you will get moire than enfougf drops till then to at least = out you maps cost just from vendor recipys , let alone the odd drop you can sell. HOWEVER once you have a nice level 75 + map pool start trading out gear as you can for MF, now you can get the nice tier rares , now you can get all the expensive uniqus. I find you are better off with pure clear speed efficency till you get to this map tier then you start to be better off with MF since now mobs have a much better pool of loot to draw from. my 2 cents on it. I never have a problem sustaining maps . I have no time to play this season , iv made literly like 3 trades all to buds at bro deal prises. Im only level 86 and i have a sustained level 74 map pool spiking pretty hard to 75's ( even got a few 77's ) . I only purched maps 1 time ( 8 level 70's for a few 5 c if i remeber right ) just to get the ball rolling . 95 % of total play time is solo , im not against team work or trading at all and offten do take part in both but this season im working way to much to try so fuck it mostly solo self found just out of necesity. Just a sec let me grab a beer...@#*@ Ok how did I die this time
Learn the rules, it's the only way to exploit them. | |
" Yes cuz she has a dedicated map drop slot. She always drops a map. Just a sec let me grab a beer...@#*@ Ok how did I die this time
Learn the rules, it's the only way to exploit them. | |
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Good god thank you for this effort. We've needed a good updated version of this for a long long time now. I'm lost about optimizing my maps with what roles work best.
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