Has the idea of class specific gems ever been thrown around?
"Except that restriction properly executed amplifies the number of options and choices you have to make. In D2 the restriction of skillsets to certain classes made your choice of class meaningful and a greater investment. The restriction of some gear makes that gear a compelling reason to play a class, or allows it to be more unique or niche than it otherwise would be. These are mechanics amplifying both the number of choices you make and the total effect of those choices. There's a reason D2 became the benchmark that aRPGs are held against, and it's not just nostalgia. IGN - PlutoChthon, Talvathir
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Let's see:
WITCH: Baby Gem, throw dead babies SCION: Husband Gem, throw your husband TEMPLAR: Bible Gem, quote from the bible RANGER: Short Hair Gem, cuts enemies hair SHADOW: No Shirt Gem, takes enemies shirt off MARAUDER: Muscle Gem, throw protein shakes Groundbreaking... "Another... Solwitch thread." AST
Current Games: :::City Skylines:::Elite Dangerous::: Division 2 "...our most seemingly ironclad beliefs about our own agency and conscious experience can be dead wrong." -Adam Bear | |
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Last edited by Mivo on Sep 3, 2014, 1:48:51 PM
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"Did having a dedicated summoner (two actually) hurt the game? IGN - PlutoChthon, Talvathir
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It limited the choice, yes. If I wanted to play a summoner, I had to play as a necromancer, whether or not I liked the model/class.
Does PoE lack anything because there are no class restricted items? I just don't see how restrictions would add anything to the game that makes it more fun. | |
" DUELIST: Douchebag gem, insult the enemy's mother |
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"Just because it limited what you played as for a model doesn;t mean it impacted the game negatively. There can be no meaningful choice without consequences of a choice. Currently choosin ga class has no meaningful impact on what you can do so EVERY class you see is running the same subset of builds. By your mid 60s any "unique" character to your class has been lost. Don;t confuse restrictions with bad mechanics. Restrictions and consequence are an important aspect of conveying a unified theme and making choice matter. Right now class choice is for all intents and purposes meaningless beyond very narrow scope. That may not be a bad thing but it certainly isn't adding any noticeable level of meaningful decision making or class identity. Which is a bad thing. In D2 yes if you wanted to be a horde summoner you had to be a Necromancer or Druid. Or you could be Assassin or Amazon if you wanted one powerful summon. Or you could be a Sorceress if you wanted a "supporting" dps summon. You'll notice that's 5 out of seven classes with some form of summoning. You'll also notice that choosing WHAT you summon is a meaningful decision that impacts more than just "I summon this" because it has an impact on everything else you have access to. In PoE that level of complexity is essentially non-existant, and the much-vaunted "choices" players are presented with are relatively shallow in their scope compared to some other games in the genre including D2. About the only meaningful choice PoE does right is keystones, and to a lesser etent what kind of armour you wear. More areas where making a decision has permanent effects on your future options should be added, not avoided. Does that mean we need class specific armor and weapons? Probably not. Does that mean we could use some tighter requirements on skills? Very much yes. Are class specific requirements bad for offering choice? Not in the least. People always want more choices. So give them more meaningful decisions to make. If I had to be a Shadow to use a stealthy skill fitting with the shadow theme that's a sacrifice I'm willing to make in the name of making my choice actually matter. Every class shoots fireballs, every class uses bows or dagger or spectral throw. That's not making the game any deeper or more interesting, it's just letting every class do whatever it wants. IGN - PlutoChthon, Talvathir
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I guess I moved into Bizzaro world, where limiting your use of something increases your choices. Gotcha.
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"Being able to choose form an infinite number of options does not mean the choices you make are meaningful. It's the whole D3 argument: You get everything for free and you choose what you use. People here hate it because they don;t feel that they've got options. By limiting selection in ways you increase meaninglu choice made by the players, meaningful choice is what players want not a billion different options where 99% of them are subpar. If every character class has the exact same pool of choices to pick from then there's no point in having the classes, it's an empty choice. IGN - PlutoChthon, Talvathir
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