I just rage quit

Rubber banding is a bug, not a feature.

I don't have it in WOW or SWTOR, it was stupid crazy in D3 (I think they use old WOW servers for D3) and it does happen quite a lot in PoE.

I attributed the rb in PoE to the fact that this is a beta. My natural assumption is that rubber banding would be banished to the land of bug hell by the time this game goes into release.

Rubber banding can often make or break a fight; it can make the game unplayable. MUST....BE....FIXED!!!!

But Mark already exmplained that rubberbanding is a kind of feature fixing the desync which is the original problem just few posts earlier.

What if the server had fuzzier logic for movement recognition?

What I mean is: the server has to receive some sequence of events which move your character from position A to position B. This is probably some form of vector arithmetic, which would cause an error to build up between the client's instance and the server's instance (because of latency).

The trouble is, server can't interpret player's intention, only the exact move events that the client sends. Player moves to point B, but server interprets him to be stuck on a ledge half screen back. Server wins, and on the client side the player is flailing away at monsters that take no damage, and himself taking ghost damage from monsters he doesn't see. Bad.

WHAT IF: the server had a mechanism for deciding when it can just give the client its requested position? You'd need an algorithm to decide whether the client's requested position makes sense within some set margin of error.

Data you need: A stack of movement events between the last checkpoint (wherever you last stopped moving for more than 2 seconds?) and the current position.

A "close-approximation" pathing algorithm that can jostle the endpoints of movement vectors around terrain obstacles. Goal would be to see if you could arrive at the client's requested position within a certain minimal amount of skew. If the test passes, server rubberbands to CLIENT. Now game and server re-sync, but with me standing where I wanted to.

Of course the danger in this kind of approach is that you have to make it un-exploitable. Hence the pathing algorithm. Also monsters still have to re-sync to where the server wants them (could you re-sync and let monster AI on the client take precedence over the server? That'd be kind of tough.... especially with the multiplayer aspect). This is a pretty big safety concern, because now you actually might teleport right into a dangerous spot.

Well, whatever, it kind of sucks that we can't be mobile in this game because the sync deteriorates with every step. Big desyncs with 20+ mobs in the picture really suck.

Joel, can I just say I am deeply envious of the fact you have the title of Dungeoneer?

What ? Rubberbanding is a solution ? Cmon ... gimmie a break ...
Solution is a really BAD words here. If anyone who has been writing some programming code knows about errors and how they are handled its obvious that rubberbanding is not a solution. Dont try to generalize about such easy topic. Rubberbanding is a really bad effect of a client error - out of sync. Yes - reducing OOS effect reduce rubberbanding.
Most OOS (rubberbanding) issues are caused by high ping, server issues, bad coding. Most of rubberbanding i got in PoE came from high number of monsters around (happens really often - positioning code errors) and some ping peaks (happens from time to time). With a constant ping of 200 - 300 ms from Poland it makes the game "lagging" a lot.
To note i didnt have those problems pre vendor patch when there werent necromancers and more monsters were overwhelming the player. Probably because those time there were max 400 players on the server and now ive seen 1300+, sometimes 2000+.
I can understand the point of Your post Chris but never ever tell me rubberbanding is a solution. Solution is fixing OOS errors. Rubberbanding is still an error.

Actually some Games don't even have a solution to desyncs. I remember tanking a whole WoW-Instance with zero HP, since my HP were not synced with the server^^.

I don't know of a solution to avoid desyncing completly I don't even guess it is possible. You have some things that may cause it.

It's like getting a cold. You have a lot of things that help you catching one, but there isn't really a cure to completly avoid or easily fix it. The only option you have is try to avoid getting a cold which isn't completly possible.

So Rubberbanding is a solution to fix Desyncing. Actually you should say Resyncing is a solution to fix desyncing, since thats what rubberbanding is, it is just telling the client that there was a missunderstanding.

And rubberbanding is actually always something good for the player. If the game would not do this you will get hit by zombies that are far away from you, can't collect loot, since it is actually in another room etc.

I guess some of the Desync-Issues are related to being a beta, since I guess that the actual work is centered around giving visual improvements to players and not doing something in the background that people might not even notice. So I guess some improvements are made later on which will reduce the issues.

I guess I'm one of the lucky ones who does not have most of the errors, since I have a good ping to the servers (from 50 up to 150 in germany depends on what time of day).

a thread started by someone who admits they had issues with other games also... followed by people providing no more info.

Where are you, what gateway do you use, ports taken care of, firewall checked, hardline/wifi, if wifi connection strength/speed, your isp speed, internet speed test results, and the list goes on..

if i were a dev all these responses get ignored because they don't help me out or provide more info on the problem; unless i know there's a server problem in which case your rage isn't needed anyways too.

so to all those "+1'ing" the OP... you know you're just supporting the fact you have issues across multiple games and most likely it's an issue on YOUR END right?

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prodiii wrote:

What ? Rubberbanding is a solution ? Cmon ... gimmie a break ...
Solution is a really BAD words here. If anyone who has been writing some programming code knows about errors and how they are handled its obvious that rubberbanding is not a solution. Dont try to generalize about such easy topic. Rubberbanding is a really bad effect of a client error - out of sync. Yes - reducing OOS effect reduce rubberbanding.

Re-syncing something that's out of sync isn't a solution to being out of sync?

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prodiii wrote:

Most OOS (rubberbanding)

This is the problem: you think being out of sync and rubber-banding are the same thing. They're not. If you didn't rubber band, you would simply stay out of sync forever. Rubber-banding is nothing more than the client putting you in the correct position since you weren't showing up where you should have. That's a fix to being out of sync.

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prodiii wrote:

I can understand the point of Your post Chris but never ever tell me rubberbanding is a solution. Solution is fixing OOS errors. Rubberbanding is still an error.

There is no way to completely remove all sync issues. Therefore, there will always need to be an amount of re-syncing (rubber-banding). Drop the notion that rubber-banding is a bug or error, because that is the exact opposite of what it is. Being out of sync is the error. Rubber-banding back to the correct position is the fix. If this didn't happen, characters would stay out of sync forever.

This is what Chris meant when he said he would like it to happen more often. A lot of miniscule resyncs would go almost unnoticed by the player and keep him where he should be on the client. The problem is that would require more sync checks. They just have to find the best balance between the two.

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Shaolungbao wrote:

a thread started by someone who admits they had issues with other games also... followed by people providing no more info.

Where are you, what gateway do you use, ports taken care of, firewall checked, hardline/wifi, if wifi connection strength/speed, your isp speed, internet speed test results, and the list goes on..

if i were a dev all these responses get ignored because they don't help me out or provide more info on the problem; unless i know there's a server problem in which case your rage isn't needed anyways too.

so to all those "+1'ing" the OP... you know you're just supporting the fact you have issues across multiple games and most likely it's an issue on YOUR END right?

''multiple'' as in 2. good argument, ive played coutless games on the pc and only 2 have rubber banded so much to make me rage.