PoE2 Butchers a Classic: Raise Zombie Reduced to a Useless Shadow of PoE1

"

SHAPERSAPPRENTICE#7658 wrote:

1. The Backbone of the Build is Now a Temporary Buff.
2. They Swapped Identities with Skeletons.
3. They Killed an Archetype, Not Just a Skill.
4. The Gem is Unbuildable as a Main Skill.

The way you call a skill "MAIN SKILL" or a "Backbone"...
You really want to walk around and do nothing.

Like, you cannot do this in POE2. Even if you rely on persistent, you need to click some button somewhere on the screen.

Unearth, flame wall, frost bomb - whatever.
But this passive afk walking simulator is not really a thing.

Also what is the main issue here?

Are you cosplaying or what?

What is the difference if you walk with 40 persistent skeletons, instead of 40 persistent zombies?

To make a game changes, just to replace one model with another seems extremely pointless to me.

GGG may give me a horde of chickens that follow me, and as long as they do the same as skeletons, I would be fine with it.

"

You can go with perpetual charge when you raise.(which I call double zombie)

And then go brutality/heft/heavy swing/impale/execute/prolonged duration/feeding frenzy/rapid attacks...

Or combine with status effects like pin/blind/bleed/poison and so on.
They are okay, especially if you invest in the new duration nodes.

The main problem is that unearth exists. And it raises corpses too.

And unearth is very good. They are not worthless. They just lose to a better skill.

Rugs has a perfectly optimized build for this specific "map tileset." He knows the monster packs, the layout, and how to efficiently clear it. He's not just surviving there; he's dominating. It's like having a Atlas strategy perfectly specced for Rituals, knowing you can crush every single encounter and rake in the rewards. You don't just throw that away because someone else wants to try a different, unproven strategy.

When Rugs says he "can beat those guys," he's talking about having a meta-defining build in that specific area. He's put in the time to master the environment and has a competitive advantage. Asking him to move is like telling a player with a perfectly juiced mapping strategy to go run low-tier white maps instead. It makes no sense.

Beast wanting to move the shop because he's "broke" is like a player who blew all their currency on a failed craft and now wants to change the entire league mechanic to something they think is more profitable. You don't re-balance the whole game around one player's bad luck or poor planning. You adapt your own build.

The right call here is to maintain the status quo. Rugs has found a winning formula. The "balance" we need is to stick with the strategy that's proven to work, not to upend everything for a less effective one. You don't nerf a build that's performing perfectly; you tell the other player to go farm some currency and optimize their own setup.

"

The way you call a skill "MAIN SKILL" or a "Backbone"...
You really want to walk around and do nothing.

Like, you cannot do this in POE2. Even if you rely on persistent, you need to click some button somewhere on the screen.

Unearth, flame wall, frost bomb - whatever.
But this passive afk walking simulator is not really a thing.

Also what is the main issue here?

Are you cosplaying or what?

What is the difference if you walk with 40 persistent skeletons, instead of 40 persistent zombies?

To make a game changes, just to replace one model with another seems extremely pointless to me.

GGG may give me a horde of chickens that follow me, and as long as they do the same as skeletons, I would be fine with it.

Brand Identity:

Build Recognition
In GGG, your build's visual identity is your unique signature in the community. When Grinding Gear Games changes how skills appear - like turning skeletons into zombies - they're essentially altering your build's "uniform" that other players recognize.

Think about it: when you see a character with a cascade of freezing pulses, you immediately recognize an Ice Nova Hierophant. When you see skeletons swarming, you know it's a Necromancer. These visual cues are part of the game's language - they communicate build archetypes without a single word typed in chat.

When GGG changes these established visual identities, it's like changing the color of unique items - players might still recognize the name, but the immediate visual recognition is lost. This is why many veteran players were frustrated when skill effects changed dramatically - their build's "brand identity" was altered without their consent.

Employee Satisfaction: Player Agency and Build Comfort
Player satisfaction in ARPGs comes from having agency over your character's development and appearance. When you invest dozens of hours perfecting a build, you develop a relationship with how it looks and feels - not just how it performs.

The skeleton vs. zombie issue is the perfect example. Many players chose Necromancer specifically for the dark fantasy aesthetic of commanding skeletal minions. When that visual identity was changed, it felt like having your carefully curated build appearance forcibly altered - like having your favorite MTX replaced with something you didn't choose.

This is why cosmetic microtransactions thrive in PoE. Players want control over their character's appearance because it affects their enjoyment and connection to the game. When developers make unilateral visual changes to core skills, they're essentially overriding player agency, which naturally leads to dissatisfaction.

Customer Experience: Gameplay Familiarity and Flow
In ARPGs, players develop muscle memory and visual recognition for skills and effects. This familiarity creates a smooth gameplay experience where you can instantly identify what's happening on screen without conscious thought.

When visual effects change dramatically, it disrupts this flow. Imagine playing your Cyclone build for months, then suddenly the skill effect looks completely different. Your brain has to relearn the visual cues, even if the mechanics remain identical.

This is why many players resist changes to established skill effects. It's not about being against change - it's about preserving the comfortable gameplay experience they've developed. The visual consistency helps players process information quickly during intense combat situations where split-second decisions matter.

The most successful skill updates in PoE have been those that maintained visual familiarity while enhancing clarity or performance. This respects players' existing experience while still improving the game.

"

Skellymancer#5263 wrote:

"

SHAPERSAPPRENTICE#7658 wrote:

But this passive afk walking simulator is not really a thing.

Its.. You again! =)


Hmm.. Full AFK summoner, not tested. I will ponder this.

"

SHAPERSAPPRENTICE#7658 wrote:

"

The way you call a skill "MAIN SKILL" or a "Backbone"...
You really want to walk around and do nothing.

Like, you cannot do this in POE2. Even if you rely on persistent, you need to click some button somewhere on the screen.

Unearth, flame wall, frost bomb - whatever.
But this passive afk walking simulator is not really a thing.

Also what is the main issue here?

Are you cosplaying or what?

What is the difference if you walk with 40 persistent skeletons, instead of 40 persistent zombies?

To make a game changes, just to replace one model with another seems extremely pointless to me.

GGG may give me a horde of chickens that follow me, and as long as they do the same as skeletons, I would be fine with it.

Brand Identity:

Build Recognition
In GGG, your build's visual identity is your unique signature in the community. When Grinding Gear Games changes how skills appear - like turning skeletons into zombies - they're essentially altering your build's "uniform" that other players recognize.

Think about it: when you see a character with a cascade of freezing pulses, you immediately recognize an Ice Nova Hierophant. When you see skeletons swarming, you know it's a Necromancer. These visual cues are part of the game's language - they communicate build archetypes without a single word typed in chat.

When GGG changes these established visual identities, it's like changing the color of unique items - players might still recognize the name, but the immediate visual recognition is lost. This is why many veteran players were frustrated when skill effects changed dramatically - their build's "brand identity" was altered without their consent.

Employee Satisfaction: Player Agency and Build Comfort
Player satisfaction in ARPGs comes from having agency over your character's development and appearance. When you invest dozens of hours perfecting a build, you develop a relationship with how it looks and feels - not just how it performs.

The skeleton vs. zombie issue is the perfect example. Many players chose Necromancer specifically for the dark fantasy aesthetic of commanding skeletal minions. When that visual identity was changed, it felt like having your carefully curated build appearance forcibly altered - like having your favorite MTX replaced with something you didn't choose.

This is why cosmetic microtransactions thrive in PoE. Players want control over their character's appearance because it affects their enjoyment and connection to the game. When developers make unilateral visual changes to core skills, they're essentially overriding player agency, which naturally leads to dissatisfaction.

Customer Experience: Gameplay Familiarity and Flow
In ARPGs, players develop muscle memory and visual recognition for skills and effects. This familiarity creates a smooth gameplay experience where you can instantly identify what's happening on screen without conscious thought.

When visual effects change dramatically, it disrupts this flow. Imagine playing your Cyclone build for months, then suddenly the skill effect looks completely different. Your brain has to relearn the visual cues, even if the mechanics remain identical.

This is why many players resist changes to established skill effects. It's not about being against change - it's about preserving the comfortable gameplay experience they've developed. The visual consistency helps players process information quickly during intense combat situations where split-second decisions matter.

The most successful skill updates in PoE have been those that maintained visual familiarity while enhancing clarity or performance. This respects players' existing experience while still improving the game.

Right on!

I was super happy when skellys in poe 2 where now like zombies where in poe 1. Thinking this is gonna be great! now i can have them both up since the hole timed summones just isnt for me, never have enjoyed the idea of it. Beside in old Final Fantasy games.

But well, now zombies had a timer.

Ok, well, i can still have the Skelly warrior skill and Skelly warriors from my scepter (the minion i honestly like the most) and still be able to have a gemsetup for 2x skelly warriors gems, cleric gem and brute gem. I had sooo much fun with this first season.

SO no zombies but more skelly warriors. I just very much enjoy the horde of skelly warriors and how it plays so that works also. Old warhammer fantsy undead enjoyer (Nagashs old army), but then they removed the Skelly warrior skingem also, its just on the scepter.

And you cant get out as many skelly warriors early anymore as i could before.

Ok, so they maybe changed zombies instead to be permanent up like skellys?

No? ok.

If they did change it back and give the skelly warrior skingem back id be happy again, since i felt that took the spot of zombies. But it is what it is, and who knows! maybe there will be some new summons coming with druid that patches the hole for me personaly atleast.

Or we get back terracotta dudes as budget specters again! (that was great fun also with that slowmo army!)

I still enjoy summoner, but im just not as happy as i was in season 1. How-ever strange that may sound to many.

"

Its.. You again! =)


Hmm.. Full AFK summoner, not tested. I will ponder this.

Okay, that actually landed. Thanks for sticking with me on it.

I was stuck on the idea of making a 'Full AFK' summoner that could just handle everything while I'm away from the keyboard, but you're right, it's a dead end because of all the new boss mechanics that target the player directly. Minions can't dodge for you, and you'll just get deleted by a ground effect you didn't even see. Good call, it's like realizing your whole build needs a different ascendancy.

So, with that in mind, what's the real play here? I'm thinking of building a more active 'Guardian' style aurabot that still focuses on minions but requires my positioning and awareness to keep them and myself alive. That way, I can still play with the cool new minion mechanics and give GGG some solid feedback on how that active support playstyle feels."

"

Right on!

I was super happy when skellys in poe 2 where now like zombies where in poe 1. Thinking this is gonna be great! now i can have them both up since the hole timed summones just isnt for me, never have enjoyed the idea of it. Beside in old Final Fantasy games.

But well, now zombies had a timer.

Ok, well, i can still have the Skelly warrior skill and Skelly warriors from my scepter (the minion i honestly like the most) and still be able to have a gemsetup for 2x skelly warriors gems, cleric gem and brute gem. I had sooo much fun with this first season.

SO no zombies but more skelly warriors. I just very much enjoy the horde of skelly warriors and how it plays so that works also. Old warhammer fantsy undead enjoyer (Nagashs old army), but then they removed the Skelly warrior skingem also, its just on the scepter.

And you cant get out as many skelly warriors early anymore as i could before.

Ok, so they maybe changed zombies instead to be permanent up like skellys?

No? ok.

If they did change it back and give the skelly warrior skingem back id be happy again, since i felt that took the spot of zombies. But it is what it is, and who knows! maybe there will be some new summons coming with druid that patches the hole for me personaly atleast.

Or we get back terracotta dudes as budget specters again! (that was great fun also with that slowmo army!)

I still enjoy summoner, but im just not as happy as i was in season 1. How-ever strange that may sound to many.

Hey, thanks for the reply and for taking the time to explain the thinking behind the changes. I appreciate the courtesy.

I get what you're saying about giving minions more "distinct identities." For me, though, the whole point of the undead army was that they were a permanent, shambling wall of death. That was their identity. The timed summons just feels... frantic, and not what I'm looking for in a minion build.

And yeah, I understand making the Skeleton Warriors scepter-only to create a "build-defining item," but it feels like it just removed a ton of flexibility. I loved having a 6-link for them in my armor and another from the scepter. It made the horde feel massive and was super fun. Now it feels like I'm just hunting for one specific item to even make the build work, and the early-game is definitely slower to get the army going.

Anyway, I'll keep my fingers crossed for the Druid. Maybe there'll be a permanent pet or something in there that clicks for me. It is what it is, and I'm still playing, just not with the same joy I had in that first season.

Thanks for listening, anyway. Good luck with the ongoing development.

I still do not get your complain.

What is really the difference what model your minions will have? Does how something looks like really matter, when it is essentially the same thing?

And why do you want to copy paste a build from POE1 to POE2, when the system obviously has nothing to do with each other?

"

I still do not get your complain.

What is really the difference what model your minions will have? Does how something looks like really matter, when it is essentially the same thing?

And why do you want to copy paste a build from POE1 to POE2, when the system obviously has nothing to do with each other?

To our community,

We have always seen POE as more than a game; it is a living world, and you are its storytellers. The builds you have crafted, the characters you have leveled, and the triumphs you have shared are the epic sagas written in its history. We understand the deep connection you have with these creations. You have spent thousands of hours mastering a very particular language—the grammar of our skill systems, the syntax of the passive tree, and the prose of itemization. It is natural to feel a profound attachment to the tools you used to write your first great works.

POE2 is not an epilogue. It is the next volume in a continuing saga, written in a new and evolved dialect.

Think of yourselves as the master authors of this world. In POE, you perfected your craft within a rich, established literary form. You knew how to build a compelling protagonist, how to structure a gripping narrative of conflict and survival, and how to deliver a satisfying conclusion. Now, with POE2, we are handing you a new volume. The world is familiar, but the language has been refined. New narrative structures exist, and a fresh vocabulary of mechanics awaits your command.

Your first instinct may be to search for the old, familiar words. But your true mastery was never in a single turn of phrase; it was in your understanding of theme, pacing, and character development. Your knowledge of how to weave a tale of overwhelming power, or how to craft a narrative of unbreakable resilience—that is the author's spirit that endures. This new volume is not a rejection of your past work; it is an invitation to apply your seasoned wisdom to a richer, more expressive canvas.

A Player's Path Forward

To continue this saga together, we ask you to embrace the role of the pioneer author, ready to shape a new literary movement.


Honour the First Volume: POE builds are celebrated, completed works. They are the foundation upon which everything is built. We honour them not by replicating them word-for-word, but by carrying their thematic spirit into the new volume.

Focus on the Narrative: What was the core story of the favourite character? Was it the commanding fantasy of leading a vast army? The lone-wolf tale of an indomitable survivor? Let us seek to tell those same fundamental stories using the new mechanics. The words may change, but the power of the narrative remains.

Embrace the New Lexicon: There is a unique and profound joy in the blank page. We encourage to approach this new system with curiosity. Experiment with its strange grammar. Combine its unexpected words. Find the beauty in a sentence that had never been thought possible. Let us all rediscover the thrill of creation.


Become the Scribes of this New Era: The most valuable contribution a veteran author can make is to help define the language for others. Instead of comparing drafts, let us share our discoveries. Let us be the ones who write the first guides, who explain the new metaphors, and who help the next generation of authors find their voice. Your wisdom is the most valuable resource our community has.


Your experience is not a relic of a past chapter; it is the wisdom that will write the future. The story of POE is far from over. Together, let us turn the page and begin writing the next great chapter.


Cheers and Thank you

"

SwedishTavern#6176 wrote:

"

TechnicallBrains#4648 wrote:

"

karsey#2995 wrote:

...you know you can still play poe1 right?

You don't have to play poe2 and be mad that it's not poe1.

i play both, while i do enjoy the improved way of skeletons in poe2, i dont see how Zombies in poe2 are in any way shape or form an improvement from poe1.

It does feel like a downgrade. As a zombieplayer on and off since when they where added in poe 1 i feel your pain. I want to use them, but dont really know how atm.

But poe 2 is still being worked at, so i choose to belive that there is more build tools inc we have not seen yet that will solve this questions for the zombie lovers :)

ye im mostly just mentioning in the"hope" that the devs are like "oh shit they right" and in whichever league it may be that it gets fixexd (hopefully before the game gets out of EA)