Block is an inflated Defensive Stat that is way too OP and completely out of Line

thats.. far from being accurate analysis.


what allows current '8 passives for 75/50 block' are two things:

- very favourable passives AND masteries changes

- rolls on shields

1) As The Mountain / Wall of Steel clusters in Marauder area. first one grants +20% attack block for 3 passives, second one 16(19) for 3(4) passives. Both are very new. (Im pretty sure there are more spread around the tree but Im very familiar with these two)

Masteries - this one is huge as it makes Versatile Combatant not necessary. (Block Mastery) 1% spell block per 5% attack block. in practice it means 15% spell block per one passive. With Tempest Shield (25%) it means 40% spell block. it is already half-way till regular cap for a minimal investment.

(Shield Mastery) 1% attack block per 5% block on shield. for a reasonable 35% block shield -> 7% attack block per passive (along whatever value you get from Shield cluster - there are several). And if you wanna min-max it Heat Attuned Shield (29 base) gets you 50%+ with top roll (block chance% has high weighting so it is reasonable to self-craft).

These changes were MASSIVE and made block FAR more accessible to non-block-dedicated builds.



2) removal of flat +block chance suffix (iirc that rolled up to max of 15?) and replacement with up to 80% chance to block preffix. sadly it now shares prefix space, but the difference is HUGE esp with high natural block chances (base choice matters a lot more than before)

in the past a shield with 50% block chance was unobtainable. and reaching max block required some multi-pronged effort

after changes you start higher (40% base? 45%? base) and passives just are FAR stronger, evenly spread out and the spell block mastery makes huge difference. when values range from 0 to 75% getting 'free' 10-20 extras actually is a big deal

2a) addition of natural spell block chance (up to 15%) prefix, replacing shaper/hunter(?) suffix (up to 10%). this is incredibly important piece. 15% out of 75% max is HUGE deal


Versatile Combatant is a leaguestart keystone nowadays, pretty much requiring 'lucky' block to function as difference between 65% and 75% actually is noticeable.

Svalinn is stupid design, Azadi's is 'i do not learn on my mistakes' item - both are toxic. but block is very, very strong and cheap without neither of these two.



Shield(shaper)
--
80% increased block chance
15% spell block
140 maximum life
-
55% reduced damage from crits
whatever floats your boat
5% life recovered on block

(the bold parts are necessary and are actually easy to craft. you craft one, use it while crafting second, better shield as you go)

beat that with 2h :)


also

75% attack block works the same vs LVL1 mobs and LVL86 mobs. Evasion - scales with mobs. can be affected by blind or mob's precision aura. if you rely on Grace - also by map mods/effect. And to get to 75% evade chance vs T17 mobs you need a f..ton of investment. on the other hand - 8 passives and 2 rolls on a shield get you the same 3 out of 4 'evasions' AND healing on top.

im all for Marauder area actually having something good for once - but block is just busted. what makes it less broken than spell suppression is that in endgame boss fights attack block is rather useless and what is actually dangerous are the degen puddles

"

sidtherat#1310 wrote:

Shield(shaper)
--
80% increased block chance
15% spell block
140 maximum life
-
55% reduced damage from crits
whatever floats your boat
5% life recovered on block

That's a 700 div shield on a good base item. In standard it's a mirror. I would reasonably expect a character to be tanky beyond words at that level of investment.

https://www.pathofexile.com/trade/search/Standard/qyYaRp9hg

I can see an argument for increasing the penalties on Svalin - given its comparative rarity - as it's very very powerful for the cost. But mirror-gear is, by design, extremely potent.

I don't see problems with incredibly rare and expensive items breaking the game to a degree.

the bold part you can self craft with ease. and use it while you spam orbs to get the second, better copy

"

cowmoo275#3095 wrote:

This is just false. Block functions now the SAME as it always has mechanically. In fact, we were able to get more MAX block in many other older leagues than we are able to now, making it mathematically much more powerful across the board in the past.

Yeah, this hits the mark. Block has always been solid if you actually invest into it properly, but it’s never been some "OP cheat code." If you're relying on it as your only avoidance layer and praying not to get hit, you're basically just evading with a different name.

It’s funny how people suddenly think that slapping on 8 passives and an aura turns any build into a god-tier tank. That’s not “low investment,” that’s just low understanding of the base game. Block didn’t suddenly get better, people just finally noticed it works because it’s been in the spotlight with the recent surge in popular builds.

What’s next on the OP list, evasion? Since it's basically the same gamble, Do I get hit, or do I not? lol

"

sidtherat#1310 wrote:

and before you load up T1 bases with tripple T1 armour rolls

It’s quite the spectacle when you demand others to improve your foundational knowledge by sharing basic Defensive Mechanics 101 templates, while simultaneously asking to avoid leaning on T1 mods as a crutch. Then, just a page later, link a near perfect, close to mirror-tier shield to justify a nerf for something that isn’t nearly as overpowered as you seem to believe.
The irony here is almost palpable.

"

sidtherat#1310 wrote:

the bold part you can self craft with ease. and use it while you spam orbs to get the second, better copy

The bold part alone sells for more than 500 div on good bases. I do a lot of crafting, I'd expect to pay about 300-450 div in currency, fossils and beastcrafts and about 10 million dust to get a shield like that. With no solid guarantees on outcome. It could cost double that with a bit of bad RNG.

Those levels of time and investment - which include a well functioning Kingsmarch - should provide you with a pretty potent defensive element to your character.

As long as extreme power is gated behind expense I don't really see the problem. That helps people strive for something more.

Things in PoE break down when you reach heavy defense + power on a budget. Which is why Svalin and the ascendancy granting jewels are such a frequent topic of (legitimate) debate. When I look at their potency, I almost feel they should be nearly mirror-rare given their might. (But that is a different topic for a different thread).

But when someone paths heavily into defense and spends high-hundreds to thousands of divine on a shield... well... the general expectation is that it will be a massive boost to defensive stats - as much as a similarly priced weapon would be to their offense.

holly molly what a wall of impossibilium

here, done it on a budget:

https://pobb.in/DIpeMJ9eWzMj



here you go, a shield you can craft in SSF for pennies - i just did, before my morning coffee

75%/53% block (with lvl20 tempest shield, deal with it)

8 passives, garbage shield, one 25% reservation

it turns out you dont even need T1 block roll (they all have equal weight so it isnt as big of a problem compared to say %phys)

sure - it isnt THE shield of all time, but to say you need 100s of divs , kingsmarch and whatever to reap benefits of how easy it is to stack block is ridiculous. you craft this and farm to craft better one. because actually crafting shields is quite straightforward


edit: just for the lols tried Rog:


ofc it isnt shaper, but i hit it on a 3rd shield. get first shield from him, farm for shaper bases with scarab of shaping, craft up (sell this one), repeat 2-3 times till you get your final shield (you know that you can live with T2 roll here and there?)

block is king... at least until you hit 100.

awakener orb for mana reserve + life on block and craft block chance on prefix.

peanuts opt would be to just alt spam for the life on block mod and bench the incr block chance.

"

sidtherat#1310 wrote:

holly molly what a wall of impossibilium

here, done it on a budget:

https://pobb.in/DIpeMJ9eWzMj

here you go, a shield you can craft in SSF for pennies - i just did, before my morning coffee

75%/53% block (with lvl20 tempest shield, deal with it)

8 passives, garbage shield, one 25% reservation

it turns out you dont even need T1 block roll (they all have equal weight so it isnt as big of a problem compared to say %phys)

sure - it isnt THE shield of all time, but to say you need 100s of divs , kingsmarch and whatever to reap benefits of how easy it is to stack block is ridiculous. you craft this and farm to craft better one. because actually crafting shields is quite straightforward


edit: just for the lols tried Rog:

ofc it isnt shaper, but i hit it on a 3rd shield. get first shield from him, farm for shaper bases with scarab of shaping, craft up (sell this one), repeat 2-3 times till you get your final shield (you know that you can live with T2 roll here and there?)

Those are not even close to what you posted.

expected that :)

my initial point, point that still stands despite some attempts at refutal:

you can get very high block/spell block chance for VERY cheap (and cap it with few extra steps) - 8 passives, a cheap AF shield and Tempest Shield - 75/50 done

ive seen some insane refutal attempts (these, that were not only empty words) - concerning the astronomical cost etc bollocks - it is all either deliberate spreading of misinformation or actual lack of game knowledge. block changed, esp spell block is now much more accessible (previously spell block was a shaper/hunter suffix with ~10 as max value IIRC)


block is nowadays VERY, very easy to get, is universal (does not care about mob level nor the damage value) and is active - you GET something when you block (mostly recovery but there are other options)

and because it takes next to nothing to get it there, you can stack it with other stuff

meanwhile armour, evasion, even spell suppression demand A LOT MORE. it doesnt make them not effective - but much, much more expensive


oh, and you can stack all these with block if you wish - ive proven that it doesnt take much to do so.


for the min-maxers there are the ways of raising it above 75%, lucky options etc - but that is hardly needed in practice. unless someone is alergic to non-min-maxed versions of stuff ofc - then he would go yapping that you need uber shield to make block be strong :) that shield I posted (good bait) is more about what shields are than block itself. dual wield and 2h play naked in comparison - even completely ignoring block for a moment

"

The bold part alone sells for more than 500 div on good bases. I do a lot of crafting, I'd expect to pay about 300-450 div in currency, fossils and beastcrafts and about 10 million dust to get a shield like that.

that.. kinda didnt age well. but i understand