Merveil - Is she really a fair boss?

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Mortal321 wrote:

However, when you beat her the first time and she goes meele with the 2nd form, it`s already over. Why? Because if you were strong enough to beat the first form, you will certainly be able to win against the weaker 2nd form. I think her 2nd form is in need of a small buff.

Agree, the second form is just yawn, but if it's to be buffed then make the first one easier for ranged then. Because though she isn't hard she's a bit long with those two forms.

So am I the only one who got killed by Andariels poison attack before even seeing the boss the first few times before figuring out antidote potions were a good idea?

Yes another D2 reference but that's the only other arpg that I've played

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wiggin wrote:

@idczn: Well the OP (if understand well) made this post after his first fight with Merveil. So you can take it as a first impression of act boss fight. There will be many similar ones in open beta. The beatdown doesn't really help anything, the specific tools you suggested do, though.
I think it is kinda hard too, for a first timer. The only thing tested in that fight is patience. You keep dodging the ice spear and sneaking in some spell/attack. If you are impatient you die. So you can spend 20 minutes there instead, is it fun? I am not sure. But then you make another char, get 75% cold resist and tank it while flasking. It is not fun either. First fight is too hard, second one too easy. This is not a balance issue... I'm not sure how to make it better, maybe telling people to grab two sapphire rings before the fight is just enough.

I agree with the sentiment that its too hard/too easy. I said as much in my initial response.

Possible ways to make it better:
slower projectiles to give a chance to move out of the way
slower cast rate
more/better placed obstacles.
More bosses: as the only act boss so far, its kinda hard to compare difficulty as theres only 1, who uses cold. More bosses = more variety, so having difficulty with one depending on the build won't seem so bad. As the only boss currently, its hard to draw a fair comparison.
Adjust the base stats of the implicit mods, rings in particular. 30 life, or 30% resist, as the base stat makes too much of difference at a low level, even worse factoring in freezing. I know the devs said they want things to make a difference when equipped, but I think its a bit too much, as shown by this case.

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indczn wrote:

slower projectiles to give a chance to move out of the way

It's actually perfectly possible to dodge the ice spear infinitely as long as merveil doesn't get too close. Movement speed bonus isn't even necessary for that. In the video, the OP doesn't try to dodge them, so no wonder he gets hit.

Also, he lets merveil's shield recover too often. Unless you have energy shield yourself, it's pointless to run around.

But basically, PoE stick to the arpg genre, even if you can succeed with some "skill", it's always mostly a gear/build check.

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zriL wrote:

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indczn wrote:

slower projectiles to give a chance to move out of the way

It's actually perfectly possible to dodge the ice spear infinitely as long as merveil doesn't get too close. Movement speed bonus isn't even necessary for that. In the video, the OP doesn't try to dodge them, so no wonder he gets hit.

Also, he lets merveil's shield recover too often. Unless you have energy shield yourself, it's pointless to run around.

But basically, PoE stick to the arpg genre, even if you can succeed with some "skill", it's always mostly a gear/build check.

Right. I was just throwing it out there.

I feel like Merveil shoots ice too quickly in the first form, this should be fixed, you can be perma slow and frozen.

2nd form Merveil is a joke.

Since I suggest nerfing Merveil's first form to slower ice shooting.
I suggest her 2nd form use lightning damage.

This will make the boss challenging(can't just stack cold resist and WIN!) but not impossible.

So make her first form easier and more manageable by slowing the constant shooting of ice by merveil

but making 2nd form harder like her using spark, increase her HP in later difficulties like cruel and merciless

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zriL wrote:

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indczn wrote:

slower projectiles to give a chance to move out of the way

It's actually perfectly possible to dodge the ice spear infinitely as long as merveil doesn't get too close. Movement speed bonus isn't even necessary for that. In the video, the OP doesn't try to dodge them, so no wonder he gets hit.

with ranged attacks, you have to aim to have a chance to hit, and it is a bit difficult to run (to at least see where you have to aim), to shoot, and to try to dodge (her) attacks... additional consider, that you even may get "hit" if the attack only aims nearby you from its cold aoe! (and, remember, you can only do one thing at a time...) another fact is, that you have to stand to shoot your arrows, but while not moving you're a perfect target for her cold snap, also with a relative huge radius.

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zriL wrote:

Also, he lets merveil's shield recover too often. Unless you have energy shield yourself, it's pointless to run around.

You have to run around just to avoid getting hit (mostly from cold snap if the distance is too high for her) and also to be able to aim... the fast es regeneration of Merveil makes it even more difficult to harm her, if you're not able to handle her attacks in close distance.

but I think, the announced reduction of her attack distance and maybe some lower attack speed will give a good balance.

She was kinda easy on my Templar, I wasn't sporting any resistances that I can remember, I just hit her over the head with my mace..
Took her down on the first try.

However, with my bow ranger (better geared than my Templar for her level) I found it to be a lot harder.

To me there's no doubt her spells pose a greater threat to ranged than her melee attacks do melee.

What if for example, completing the Allflame quest grants you a ring with cold resist, with a way of telling the player it'll help in the fight against a future enemy of great skill in cold magic or whatevs?

Newcomes to (a)RPGs might find that very usefull...

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Toltie wrote:

What if for example, completing the Allflame quest grants you a ring with cold resist, with a way of telling the player it'll help in the fight against a future enemy of great skill in cold magic or whatevs?

Newcomes to (a)RPGs might find that very usefull...

not a terrible idea, many will miss the clue but later cant say they were not warned.

This boss feels poorly balanced classwise. As a summoner build, she has proven impossible. Her cone attack is so fast and powerful the skeletons cant even reach her, even holding the key down.

My 2 cents: in all the games I've played in the past where players are given so much freedom with their build, the devs usually did a great job of playtesting the boss (and the game) with every possible build made available (by the devs!) to the players.

If you think minion based builds are too easy, why did you include them? If you included them to round out your game, then I recommend playtesting with more combinations in order to ensure they are all mostly viable. Otherwise, you may want to consider removing the minion element (although, I agree, excising this from your passives tree would be a daunting task indeed).

The build was working great, FWIW, until this boss. Perhaps all that's needed are some tweaks to make her less powerful to the minions.

You know, I did notice other bosses earlier in the game that would pay a lot less attention to my minions and would go straight for me. If Merveil did the same the skeletons would at least manage to get a single hit in. As it is, they are playthings for her. And fireball's cast time is long enough for Merveil to get in 3 cone shots before I can even sidestep.

But, we can see the melee classes don't seem to be having a problem! So, there's that.