I sadly stopped playing in early 3.13. I dont think im returning either (Philosophy-Talk) (Long)

"

Teigo wrote:

...

"

Teigo wrote:

To start, this is not a rant.
Im just sad about the Game and its direction, and wanted to share it. Maybe somebody can get something out of it.

Im a "full-time" playing Nerd.
I play the Leagues since my start in late-Legacy mostly til the end.
I create about 8-12 Charas around lvl 85-95 per League and reroll several of them. As leveling isnt fun for me at all after the 3rd time. And I hate running lab. Love the idea, hate running it.
I enjoy trying out (stupid) new ideas, sometimes the OP Meta, and sometimes just the good old MFing. Never one for Group play tho.
I LOVE theorycrafting new Builds!!!

I had a PoE Break at Harvest Launch, rejoined within the last 3 Weeks of Harvest itself.

So, I play a lot in many ways. I grind Endgame but dont farm eg 20 UElders a Day. I prefer running Maps, and those more fast then slow.


Why did I stop playing:

The last thing pushing me to stop was the way GGG implemented Harvest in 3.13.
Heres a longer rant about that:
Harvest Implementation against Expansion Philosophy (10 Craft Cap)
https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/3009286/page/1

It was just one more decision I couldnt understand GGG doing.
Other Decision are things like an missing Auction House and there philosophy about trading. Trading is so lame and annoying in PoE. I dislike almost everything about it. GGG doubling down on it again and again just rubs me the wrong way.
I think there view on it is absolutly outdated.

Same goes for there affinity for killing players.
At this point it feels like some sort of mislead fetish.
Making a game hard is NOT about how you can screw the player over and killing him lots. I rarly get something out of my deaths too as I couldnt either see whats happening on screen, died to reflect or other mechanics like on Death bullshittery.
Gimme hard, but not unfair.
(Im an old time Monster Hunter Player, I love hard content. But telegraph it accordingly.)
Missing Death Log and the EXP Penealty are the icing on top there.
Outdated and infuriating.

Going with Exp into a Bossfight?
You dont do that, simply because the Game has his ways of screwing you over in ways outside of your control. This, better going save then sorry, feels wrong. When you, the player, makes a mistke, okay. Thats cool and wanted! But the amount of ways the game is directly at fault for EXP deaths...? I dont know man.

Difficulty Curve
Beeing able to run a map 20 times like its nothing to then hit a mob with the wrong sort of mods stacked up.
Its not a difficulty Curve, its a Wall. And not one you can then climb and concour. That would be awesome! But one thats coming at you out of the blue with no warning to screw your gameflow up.
Its just no fun this way.
That white maps can roll harder content as red maps in the wrong circumstances negates everything about a map tiering system to begin with.
And im not talking about 100% juiced vs alch+go. Even with alch+go in both, the potential is there that a white map becomes almost unfinishable cause some mods stacked up the wrong way.

On top, I really dislike the way Hardcore-esque stuff make in into the Softcore world. Tbh, I cannot handle hardcore. I cannot deal with losing a chara and its gear.
So beeing forced into this, no matter how small, makes me wanna vomit. Looking at you Heist...-.-*
(guess thats why I hate running lab too)

Sirus. What a shitshow of a fight.
And I havent even encounter him in maps yet as I stopped playing before that. Glad I did.
Failing the fight/losing the instance also screws any training in the fight like you could do with old UElder spawns.
And the (still!) lackluster introduction of him into the lore...?
Whos that guy that just turns up and trashes all the fun you had?

Looting and my Hands
Im kinda awestruck how a Game about looting doesnt have a modern looting system yet.
Again, so outdated. (I start to see a trend here)
Chronicon has one of the best Looting Systems I experienced for a similiar Gameplay.
The amount of clicking PoE requieres is insane.
My Hands love me again since Ive stopped playing.
EVEN CLICKER GAMES NEED LESS CLICKING
No joke!
Im a Gamer since im able to be one. PoE is hands down (haha) the worst Game for my physical health I ever played.
Even when I ignore 99% of Loot via Filters, its not working out.
And how outdated is it that hiding 99% of your loot is the way to go in a Game ABOUT LOOTING? =o

That the loot keeps moving around cause it "resorts" itself is just making me mad every time. Or Icons beeing visable, but the actualy loot to pick up is next screen...

This point makes me double mad as they just doubled down on the looting aspect of PoE for Item and Gear progression...

Overall QoL
Or better said, the amount of missing QoL Features.

Stash Tabs. They are finally here. But, tbh, way to late as to win me back alone.
Unveiling again every league is cancer.
Finding Trials is horendeous.
The amount of out-of-game resources needed is just laughable at this point.
Wording and naming of mechanics. Why overcomplicate it? Leech rework? Could it have been made anymore difficult to understand?
Missing informations. Eg that Skeletons cannot be called with Convocation. As well as some more.
Why?
The skill states "all" Minions.
Summon Skeleton Skill isnt stating anything either like it.
So, its clearly not all. Why not mention that somehwere ingame? Needed to read the Wiki to understand this as "not a bug but a feature".

Naming of some Modefiers isnt clear at all either. Local or global? You either need to know that beforhand or no luck.

Pricing of MTX.
Just no.

MTX Lootboxes
Double no.

---
---
---

To stop me from turning this in a rant after all:

Im just really sad about a lot of stuff in PoE.
Either cause I dont see a reason behind it or find it outright false and outdated.
For all the missing QoL Stuff. I understand that the most money is in the launches of new Leagues and the weeks around it. So, improvments not involved with launches are second priority.
And since we long term players arent the bulk of money, we dont have a strong voice.
A loud one sure, but not as strong as most of us wish.
I also know that I dont have in any form a perfect solution. I named a few alternatives over the years via posts. Some even made it into patches in some variation. Or at least I could recognize myself in some changes, no matter how much my post actually did something.^^

So, why am I not returning either?

Its to less in to much time.

I love PoE.
I love sinking into it and grinding for hours.
I love testing new stuff and builds.
There is much to love here. And I still do!

But.

But there is not enough happening in terms of Game Evolution.
The game feels stuck in the past and is really slow in catching up.
Both in philosophy and actually changes.

League Launches are always big and exciting and flashy!
And they do hype me up!
But, not about the stuff I really want to see changes in.
New stuff is cool, and keeps the money flowing.
But its not the same as developing the game fast enough at the same time.

Sure, PoE 2 will fix everything. They do say that a lot.
But with it being so far away still, that doesnt mean anything to me anymore. Not until you show me HOW it will fix everything.
Until then its just like an Preorder offer. And we dont do these anymore (i hope).

I still care about the game.
And I have high hopes for the future.
And even when im currently no longer playing and not planning on returning, I will keep my eye on the game itself.

Maybe changes start to roll in. Maybe views change in ways in which I see myself too.

For those loving everything the way it is and how GGG is planing to go forward:
I envy you. I really do.

Until then,
thanks for reading.

See ya around!

"

Rakushi wrote:

Man, your entire post is just... ranting disguised as whining... Or maybe just plain ignorance? I come from a standpoint of Hardcore. Always played it from the start of Nemesis some years ago, to today.

Let's go one by one and analyze your... whining.. and point out what's wrong with your view and what the game is about, or things you just, plainly missed. It's weird that you did, because you mentioned that you at least have taken into account the Philosophies of GGG, but show a lack thereof.

Trading / Auction house: Big oof. The reason why trading itself isn't being more streamlined is because they want you to use the items you accumilate instead of using them for trade. Is this something that you can disagree with? Sure. Is there some things that would be nicer if you could trade them a bit easier? Sure, but it's not necessary. Besides, an auction house would look identically to the tradeAPI they already provide, so the only thing that the "Auction house" would change would be less human interaction. But it's supposed to be more of a market, where you can haggle too, not a shop per-say.

Death / One shots and your experience: Most stuff that is "On-Death" is telegraphed (Volatile Fireorb, X-Bearers [Magicpacks], Detonate Dead, The ghost that posesses enemies and blows them up = All have clear tell-tale signs. If you die by them so often that you have to complain about it, you should start paying more attention.
Dying by reflect is hilarious. If you die to that, it's on you. Sure, there are some enemies that aren't obvious that they do reflect, but dying is PART of the experience of GGG. It's supposed to, it's supposed to be a grim, dark game, and hard to master.
Off-Screen stuff has been tuned down a lot. I don't remember the last time I've died to something off-screen for a few years now. Would like if you could shed some more light ot this.
Missing death log would be nice. Can agree with you on it, but overall unnecessary.

Very rarely there is fights that are out of your control. You can read a pattern into what the bosses do. You can read into their telegraphed attacks if you pay attention to it. When you feel put into a corner, get out, reset the state of the fight, and go in again.

Difficulty curve in maps(?): You do know that you don't need to run a map a certain way, and can re-roll it. Of course if you are phys based melee char, physical reflect will be unfinishable, as an example, but you don't expect them to finish, do you? Likewise double elemental damage with +2 Projectiles, Turbo and the works can be harder than, enemies can't be taunted, point blank and yada yada mods. Again, this is something you DO have control of, so not sure what you are on about...

If you can't handle dying, then this might be simplly the wrong game to you. Death is an experience everyone went trough. It's part of learning. You died to Atziri's flameblast? Probably means you shouldn't have taken it. Dominus makes a bubble and rains blood around it? And the outside is killing you? Maybe the bubble shields you. There are countless examples like that. You might as well hate the game, if you hate the fact that your character's health pool actually can hit 0.


Sirius lackluster introduction, or your lackluster attention to detail? Zana talks about him, Kirak talks about him, the other elder slayers (Drox, Veritania, Al-Nehzim and Baran) talk about him extensively, in their journals, or via small bits of dialogue when he appears. This is on you, buddy. Don't blame the game for your shortcomings, the game gives plenty of lore of Sirius.

Is the fight a shitshow? Kinda. His last phase is infinitely harder than his tutorial phases. Does that mean he's impossible? If you panic, it might. You can practice him btw. The option to remove all watchstones to make him less tanky and less damaging, is one of them.

Looting could be done better, can agree on that. Other games have done it better, and I'd like less clicking (Hey, look at that, we can agree on stuff)

Uhm, making loot appear back to it's position is as easy as pressing a button twice... literally... Press Z (for me at least) twice to hide all and show all, after filter...

Your QoL ranting

Unveiling every league: Tedious, but not so bad, especially since you can just run a few juns for stuff later into the league.
Finding trials: Yep, can be annoying at times

What is so difficult about leech that you don't understand...?

Convocation: Recalls all minions that are following you to your location, and grants them a temporary life regeneration effect.
-> Skeletons don't follow you. Summon raging spirits don't follow you. Which is hency why they don't get re-called by convocation.

Let me know of your other examples, sensing a trend of your own oversights, makes me believe all of them can be easily explained.

Pricing of MTX / Lootboxes: There are quite a few people involved in GGG that also would like to be paid for their work. MTX are cosmetics, nobody needs them, but if you want them, you can get them. Playing the game is free, enjoying the game is free. Even with stashtabs aquiring you pay less than for AAA games. Lootboxes are cosmetics that are cheaper, but random. YOu can hit big, or hit duplicate. Don#t like them? Don't engage with them, nobody makes you do so.

"There is not enough happening in game evolution". Is short-sighted / or your tendency to of oversights.

---> Skill tree constantly evolving
---> Ascendancies lately evolving and improving
---> Master-mission rework and better crafting bench
---> Cluster jewels
---> Able to put passives onto your amulet
---> Constant endgame upgrades. From ShaperVsElder, to the threat of the world by Elderslayers and hunting them, to the Maven, shaping your own atlas further, customizing it to your wishes with every league mechanic present in one way or another
---> Influenced items that have special stats on them, allowing for further customization
---> Various ways to play (Infinite Delve, Infinite heisting, Mapping, Bossing, Juicing up with Delirium orbs, + all the maven stuff to have you play old trheats like more beyond, invaders, etc), Alva Incursions, so much more...
---> PoE2 introducing a full skill gem socket rework, a new story, new playstyles, new engine.

And you say the game isn't evolving. I'd be tempted to throw a profanity at you for your short-sightedness, but will refrain from it.


You say you care about the game, I appreciate if you do, but with all due respect, not nearly as much as you make yourself believe.

"

DarkJen wrote:

GGG reads this post, making brainstorm, then, after hot debates, Chris announces:

A very EXCITING new feature!
Moving currency!
You drop alchemy, and its jumps away from you!
So you'll need alot of clicks to catch currency now!
Feel the Volume of getting currency!
Every single perandus coin needs to be catched from next amazing patch!
Portal scrolls, wisdom, every shard!
All jumping around!

Fun
Fun
Fun

"

Turtledove wrote:

"

Rakushi wrote:

Man, your entire post is just... ranting disguised as whining... Or maybe just plain ignorance? I come from a standpoint of Hardcore. Always played it from the start of Nemesis some years ago, to today.

Let's go one by one and analyze your... whining.. and point out what's wrong with your view and what the game is about, or things you just, plainly missed. It's weird that you did, because you mentioned that you at least have taken into account the Philosophies of GGG, but show a lack thereof.

Trading / Auction house: Big oof. The reason why trading itself isn't being more streamlined is because they want you to use the items you accumilate instead of using them for trade. Is this something that you can disagree with? Sure. Is there some things that would be nicer if you could trade them a bit easier? Sure, but it's not necessary. Besides, an auction house would look identically to the tradeAPI they already provide, so the only thing that the "Auction house" would change would be less human interaction. But it's supposed to be more of a market, where you can haggle too, not a shop per-say.

Death / One shots and your experience: Most stuff that is "On-Death" is telegraphed (Volatile Fireorb, X-Bearers [Magicpacks], Detonate Dead, The ghost that posesses enemies and blows them up = All have clear tell-tale signs. If you die by them so often that you have to complain about it, you should start paying more attention.
Dying by reflect is hilarious. If you die to that, it's on you. Sure, there are some enemies that aren't obvious that they do reflect, but dying is PART of the experience of GGG. It's supposed to, it's supposed to be a grim, dark game, and hard to master.
Off-Screen stuff has been tuned down a lot. I don't remember the last time I've died to something off-screen for a few years now. Would like if you could shed some more light ot this.
Missing death log would be nice. Can agree with you on it, but overall unnecessary.

Very rarely there is fights that are out of your control. You can read a pattern into what the bosses do. You can read into their telegraphed attacks if you pay attention to it. When you feel put into a corner, get out, reset the state of the fight, and go in again.

Difficulty curve in maps(?): You do know that you don't need to run a map a certain way, and can re-roll it. Of course if you are phys based melee char, physical reflect will be unfinishable, as an example, but you don't expect them to finish, do you? Likewise double elemental damage with +2 Projectiles, Turbo and the works can be harder than, enemies can't be taunted, point blank and yada yada mods. Again, this is something you DO have control of, so not sure what you are on about...

If you can't handle dying, then this might be simplly the wrong game to you. Death is an experience everyone went trough. It's part of learning. You died to Atziri's flameblast? Probably means you shouldn't have taken it. Dominus makes a bubble and rains blood around it? And the outside is killing you? Maybe the bubble shields you. There are countless examples like that. You might as well hate the game, if you hate the fact that your character's health pool actually can hit 0.


Sirius lackluster introduction, or your lackluster attention to detail? Zana talks about him, Kirak talks about him, the other elder slayers (Drox, Veritania, Al-Nehzim and Baran) talk about him extensively, in their journals, or via small bits of dialogue when he appears. This is on you, buddy. Don't blame the game for your shortcomings, the game gives plenty of lore of Sirius.

Is the fight a shitshow? Kinda. His last phase is infinitely harder than his tutorial phases. Does that mean he's impossible? If you panic, it might. You can practice him btw. The option to remove all watchstones to make him less tanky and less damaging, is one of them.

Looting could be done better, can agree on that. Other games have done it better, and I'd like less clicking (Hey, look at that, we can agree on stuff)

Uhm, making loot appear back to it's position is as easy as pressing a button twice... literally... Press Z (for me at least) twice to hide all and show all, after filter...

Your QoL ranting

Unveiling every league: Tedious, but not so bad, especially since you can just run a few juns for stuff later into the league.
Finding trials: Yep, can be annoying at times

What is so difficult about leech that you don't understand...?

Convocation: Recalls all minions that are following you to your location, and grants them a temporary life regeneration effect.
-> Skeletons don't follow you. Summon raging spirits don't follow you. Which is hency why they don't get re-called by convocation.

Let me know of your other examples, sensing a trend of your own oversights, makes me believe all of them can be easily explained.

Pricing of MTX / Lootboxes: There are quite a few people involved in GGG that also would like to be paid for their work. MTX are cosmetics, nobody needs them, but if you want them, you can get them. Playing the game is free, enjoying the game is free. Even with stashtabs aquiring you pay less than for AAA games. Lootboxes are cosmetics that are cheaper, but random. YOu can hit big, or hit duplicate. Don#t like them? Don't engage with them, nobody makes you do so.

"There is not enough happening in game evolution". Is short-sighted / or your tendency to of oversights.

---> Skill tree constantly evolving
---> Ascendancies lately evolving and improving
---> Master-mission rework and better crafting bench
---> Cluster jewels
---> Able to put passives onto your amulet
---> Constant endgame upgrades. From ShaperVsElder, to the threat of the world by Elderslayers and hunting them, to the Maven, shaping your own atlas further, customizing it to your wishes with every league mechanic present in one way or another
---> Influenced items that have special stats on them, allowing for further customization
---> Various ways to play (Infinite Delve, Infinite heisting, Mapping, Bossing, Juicing up with Delirium orbs, + all the maven stuff to have you play old trheats like more beyond, invaders, etc), Alva Incursions, so much more...
---> PoE2 introducing a full skill gem socket rework, a new story, new playstyles, new engine.

And you say the game isn't evolving. I'd be tempted to throw a profanity at you for your short-sightedness, but will refrain from it.


You say you care about the game, I appreciate if you do, but with all due respect, not nearly as much as you make yourself believe.

-1

"

Teigo wrote:

Thx @Turtledove to perfectly sum up my first reaction about that post <3

And @Rakushi, apparently I did hit a nerv. I just stated my feelings.

To keep it short but still giving something to further explain:
If its enough for you, in regards of, trading, lore introduction, QoL, Game Evolution etc, than thats awesome! And I do indeed envy you to enjoy the game as it is to such a big degree!
Sadly im not nearly there.
For me, its not enough. Not even close (anymore actually). The amount of time passed and the lack of improvment (and abundance of decline of it with outdated mindsets and actions) just kills the game for me.

If that offends you in any way, im sorry, but thats how I feel.
No hard feelings from my side.

Cheers