Fire Penetration on Firestorm, does that work with ignite too?

My Firestorm has Fire Penetration, Chance to Ignite, and Elemental Proliferation on it. I'm wondering, all that burning damage that is going to be going on, is that all going to be with Fire Penetration, or does that only work on the initial hit of Firestorm?
Burning damage is calculated by a portion of the damage that was dealt that caused the burn in the first place. Either the burn uses the same fire penetration, or it just does the damage outright. I'm not sure how -- but either way, the fire penetration should work.
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Ignite burns for 133% of the damage the attack dealt over 4 seconds. Fire penetration will increase the initial damage threfore the burn damage.

However I'm not sure how DoT's function with resists. I believe that they "ignore" resists.
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Burning damage on firestorm is small because the initial hits are small. Bad setup
That's aside from the point though.
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Fire penetration does not directly help Ignite, but indirectly.

More fire damage, stronger ignites.
So, if I'm already burning and drink a Ruby Flask. The damage I am suffering will not be reduced?
Brutus. Do you even sync?
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AnnanFay wrote:
So, if I'm already burning and drink a Ruby Flask. The damage I am suffering will not be reduced?

It does.
Fire Penetration (the support gem) only applies to things that "hit", not degeneration damage.
Under normal conditions, fire resistance is essentially applied twice for ignite damage, squaring its effectiveness.

  • Example 1: 480 Fire damage vs 0% fire resistance, triggers ignite. Ignite is set to do 480*4/3 = 640 fire damage over 4 seconds, aka 160 damage per second.
  • Example 2: 480 Fire damage vs 75% fire resistance, does 120 damage, triggers ignite. Ignite is set to do 120*4/3 = 160 fire damage over 4 seconds. Due to 75% fire resistance, it deals 40 damage over 4 seconds, aka 10 damage per second.

You'll notice Example 1 is sixteen times Example 2, that's because 75% fire resist means you take a quarter of the damage, and a quarter of a quarter is a sixteenth.

Although Fire Penetration is naturally at its best against high fire resistance, it's not really enough to salvage a bad situation. Let's add a level 20 Fire Pentration (-35% enemy fire resistance).

  • Example 1, take 2: 480 Fire damage vs 0% Fire resistance, resistance reduced to -35%, deals 648 damage, triggers ignite. Ignite is set to do 648*4/3 = 864 fire damage over 4 seconds against 0% resistance, aka 216 damage per second. Adding Fire Penetration gave us 35% more burning damage.
  • Example 2, take 2: 480 Fire damage vs 75% fire resistance, resistance reduced to 40%, does 288 damage, triggers ignite. Ignite is set to do 288*4/3 = 384 fire damage over 4 seconds. Due to 75% fire resistance, it deals 96 damage over 4 seconds, aka 24 damage per second. Fire Penetration gave us 140% more burning damage.

Much better, but still very weak burning damage even with penetration. In general, if it's heavily fire resistant, it's not going to burn well no matter what you do.
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Last edited by ScrotieMcB#2697 on Mar 25, 2013, 2:37:28 AM
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ScrotieMcB wrote:
Under normal conditions, fire resistance is essentially applied twice for ignite damage, squaring its effectiveness.

  • Example 1: 480 Fire damage vs 0% fire resistance, triggers ignite. Ignite is set to do 480*4/3 = 640 fire damage over 4 seconds, aka 160 damage per second.
  • Example 2: 480 Fire damage vs 75% fire resistance, does 120 damage, triggers ignite. Ignite is set to do 120*4/3 = 160 fire damage over 4 seconds. Due to 75% fire resistance, it deals 40 damage over 4 seconds, aka 10 damage per second.

You'll notice Example 1 is sixteen times Example 2, that's because 75% fire resist means you take a quarter of the damage, and a quarter of a quarter is a sixteenth.

Although Fire Penetration is naturally at its best against high fire resistance, it's not really enough to salvage a bad situation. Let's add a level 20 Fire Pentration (-35% enemy fire resistance).

  • Example 1, take 2: 480 Fire damage vs 0% Fire resistance, resistance reduced to -35%, deals 648 damage, triggers ignite. Ignite is set to do 648*4/3 = 864 fire damage over 4 seconds against 0% resistance, aka 216 damage per second. Adding Fire Penetration gave us 35% more burning damage.
  • Example 2, take 2: 480 Fire damage vs 75% fire resistance, resistance reduced to 40%, does 288 damage, triggers ignite. Ignite is set to do 288*4/3 = 384 fire damage over 4 seconds. Due to 75% fire resistance, it deals 96 damage over 4 seconds, aka 24 damage per second. Fire Penetration gave us 140% more burning damage.

Much better, but still very weak burning damage even with penetration. In general, if it's heavily fire resistant, it's not going to burn well no matter what you do.


Nice post, thanks, but are you absolutely sure burning gets hit twice with resists? That seems unfair. Especially since, unless you forgot to mention it, that negative resists don't boost the burn damage twice. So -50% resist = 50% more damage (but not applied again to the burn damage), but +50% resist = 50% less damage + another 50% less on the burn? Ya, unfair.

Also, does any of what you said change if you were to use Flammability instead of Fire Penetration? (I'm aware of the difference between penetration and resist though.)
Last edited by PackersFTW#3100 on Mar 25, 2013, 9:17:09 PM

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