Determination

Sucks, too high mana reserve/cost, weak effect!

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Elemenz wrote:

Sucks, too high mana reserve/cost, weak effect!

Go away troll. +% More armor is huge

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Autocthon wrote:

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Elemenz wrote:

Sucks, too high mana reserve/cost, weak effect!

Go away troll. +% More armor is huge

...but not more huge than stacking base armor, which why Grace+IR and molten shell+CoDT are way more important that Determination for stacking armor. I find this skill so puzzling; it's only remotely useful if paired with decently stacked armor% nodes AND still needs support from other auras and skulills. I'd much rather see the +more armor % reduced and some substantial +armor introduced.

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C0Y0T3_SLY wrote:

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Autocthon wrote:

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Elemenz wrote:

Sucks, too high mana reserve/cost, weak effect!

Go away troll. +% More armor is huge

...but not more huge than stacking base armor, which why Grace+IR and molten shell+CoDT are way more important that Determination for stacking armor. I find this skill so puzzling; it's only remotely useful if paired with decently stacked armor% nodes AND still needs support from other auras and skulills. I'd much rather see the +more armor % reduced and some substantial +armor introduced.

try using both then, don't forget to use aura boosts so BOTH grace and determination works better (partial double dipping effect). flat armor from purity due to IR times armor nodes THEN times determination... then don't forget flasks and molt shell like you said...

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C0Y0T3_SLY wrote:

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Autocthon wrote:

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Elemenz wrote:

Sucks, too high mana reserve/cost, weak effect!

Go away troll. +% More armor is huge

...but not more huge than stacking base armor, which why Grace+IR and molten shell+CoDT are way more important that Determination for stacking armor. I find this skill so puzzling; it's only remotely useful if paired with decently stacked armor% nodes AND still needs support from other auras and skulills. I'd much rather see the +more armor % reduced and some substantial +armor introduced.

Grace is roughly equivalent to +30% more armour depending on your gear. Once you have real Ar gear grace is much less effective than determination.

Grace+IR is so much better than determination.
Even with shitty gear or full ES gear you get a nice amount of armour.

Molten shell also is much better than determinatin because it adds base armour, doesnt reserve any mana and does dmg.

To be as effective (or maybe even more effective) with determination, you'll need good armour gear and a bunch of 'increased' armour passives.
Of course, really insane is determination + grace (with IR).


-> So imho grace+IR is a lot better for getting into lategame being able to farm lower maps quickly, but when you reach a certain point, determination will be better with your 2k armour chest and 600 armour helmet and especially granite flasks...


Another reason to use determination instead of grace+IR is that you have to travel pretty far getting IR. All these points could be mana and spelldmg/castspeed/crit.

For CI/low life ES builds it could be nice to get some armour from grace+IR, but you'll have to give up a lot of dmg. Vaal Pact isnt that far away from IR, so another reason for using grace+IR with an ES build.


Summary:

You want to go Determination if you:
- are a life based spellcaster who wants to maximize dmg while still boosting armour
- have good highend armour gear and some armour passives
- are using granite flasks a lot

You want to go Grace+IR if you:
- play HC or want to farm map content even with bad gear
- are an ES based char who wants to have some armour too
- play a build wich is mainly between ranger and duellist anyway (mostly dualwield or bow builds)

If you have more than 4k Base armour (after IR) Det>Grace

That's pretty much the entire comparison.

ooopss sorry wrong skill post. Looking for desecrate.


LOL.

I tend to think of this as one of the weaker auras now since the 60% from 40% aura change, though I could be biased and ultimately incorrect. Others seem to believe otherwise. My thoughts of the weakness of the aura stem from:

1) The cost - there are a lot of other good auras that have to be not taken if you take this

2) Armor diminishing returns - This isn't really the reason because I knew of this before the change, but to me, it's a factor in the decision process. The fact is that without both grace and determination, which aren't really options for me, I tend to be skeptical that determination alone will really protect me against huge physical hits

3) Enduring Cry, Immortal Call, and Cast when Damage Taken - Just seem to be superior options and don't require 60% mana reservation * 0.71 (from level 20 reduced mana)

It just boils down to pragmatics for me. Do I really want to spend that much mana for that much armor when those defensive spells are options for me? Maybe this will help provide some insight into the naysayers for the true supporters of this skill.

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Elemenz wrote:

Sucks, too high mana reserve/cost, weak effect!

THIS!

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Elemenz wrote:

Sucks, too high mana reserve/cost, weak effect!

THIS AGAIN!

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Elemenz wrote:

Sucks, too high mana reserve/cost, weak effect!