PoE is now not good F2P

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Shagsbeard wrote:

It's stretching the boundaries because it's like no game yet built on this price model. You're somewhat right. You want to spend money on the game. Perhaps you can't. Up to you to deal with that.

Free to play doesn't imply that you're not going to want to pay for anything.

Good free-to-play means not spending money because the game doesn't hinder you at all.

The argument is the "quality" of free to play.

Let's face it, there is no such thing as a complete FREE to play game, because how would it be funded. Therefore, there has to be a business model.

In this game, that model is based around:

(1) Cosmetics
(2) Storage

Every game has it's hook - most tablet games use TIME as their currency. You buy premium currency to accelerate your "actions per day" or to get (a chance at) that legendary you would otherwise have to farm forever for.

Theoretically you could play this game at the same level as everyone else without spending a cent. I am not saying it wouldn't be painful, good God would it be painful, but you can do it. All of the tabs are Quality of Life - they DO NOT AFFECT GAMEPLAY.

Most other F2P games I have seen have purchases that ACTIVELY AFFECT GAMEPLAY.

Therefore, I deem your argument moo. The cow's don't care, so your argument is moo.

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Slaanesh69 wrote:

The argument is the "quality" of free to play.

Let's face it, there is no such thing as a complete FREE to play game, because how would it be funded. Therefore, there has to be a business model.

In this game, that model is based around:

(1) Cosmetics
(2) Storage

Every game has it's hook - most tablet games use TIME as their currency. You buy premium currency to accelerate your "actions per day" or to get (a chance at) that legendary you would otherwise have to farm forever for.

Theoretically you could play this game at the same level as everyone else without spending a cent. I am not saying it wouldn't be painful, good God would it be painful, but you can do it. All of the tabs are Quality of Life - they DO NOT AFFECT GAMEPLAY.

Most other F2P games I have seen have purchases that ACTIVELY AFFECT GAMEPLAY.

Therefore, I deem your argument moo. The cow's don't care, so your argument is moo.

A premium tab is required to use GGG's trade site. That affects gameplay because you're gated from a feature GGG designed.

Even then, quality of life does affect game play because you're not given the same choices as money users. I would have to worry about stash management way more so my choices for trading, collecting, or saving for other characters would change. Similarly, if I wanted to craft at all I would need to dedicate a tab or 2 for currency. As well, since I don't have access to most of the trading, I won't be able to keep up with league or standard inflation as I don't have a reasonable way to make money unless I luck into it.

Quality of life does affect game play because the quality of your experience matters.

I cannot discount your Trade comment - that is true. And GGG has gone out of their way to indicate game is designed around Trade. Can you still trade without the premium tab with a workaround? That is weak, I know.

I did actually contradict my own argument, and therefore QoL does affect "quality" of free to play. I still feel like the fact that this base game is playable to the very end with no modifications, and no time restrictions, FREE makes it unique. I suppose that is the crux of my comments.

Someone else commented that the sheer volume of shit that has been added over the years certainly makes it more complicated than it needs to be for entry level players.

I didn't read all of the replies, so excuse me if someone else already posted this but...

A) You're permitted to run two instances of the client simultaneously on your machine.

B) You can create as many accounts as you want.

C) You can trade from one account to the other and vice versa.

D) You can invite yourself to your own guild to utilize the universal guild stash to trade without having to have both characters online.

E) Profit?

Thank me later, F2P crowd...

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Sketchbag11111 wrote:

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Slaanesh69 wrote:

The argument is the "quality" of free to play.

Let's face it, there is no such thing as a complete FREE to play game, because how would it be funded. Therefore, there has to be a business model.

In this game, that model is based around:

(1) Cosmetics
(2) Storage

Every game has it's hook - most tablet games use TIME as their currency. You buy premium currency to accelerate your "actions per day" or to get (a chance at) that legendary you would otherwise have to farm forever for.

Theoretically you could play this game at the same level as everyone else without spending a cent. I am not saying it wouldn't be painful, good God would it be painful, but you can do it. All of the tabs are Quality of Life - they DO NOT AFFECT GAMEPLAY.

Most other F2P games I have seen have purchases that ACTIVELY AFFECT GAMEPLAY.

Therefore, I deem your argument moo. The cow's don't care, so your argument is moo.

A premium tab is required to use GGG's trade site. That affects gameplay because you're gated from a feature GGG designed.

Even then, quality of life does affect game play because you're not given the same choices as money users. I would have to worry about stash management way more so my choices for trading, collecting, or saving for other characters would change. Similarly, if I wanted to craft at all I would need to dedicate a tab or 2 for currency. As well, since I don't have access to most of the trading, I won't be able to keep up with league or standard inflation as I don't have a reasonable way to make money unless I luck into it.

Quality of life does affect game play because the quality of your experience matters.

Before Premium Tabs were a thought, people used Aquisition or Procurement (Still available for FREE btw) to list things on PoE trade and other sites.

Sooooooo what about Premium Tabs is mandatory again for trade?

Yeah every league adds something to fk up stash space.

Begs the question... So what? What if it doesn't meet your definition of what a "quality F2P game" should meet? So what? Are they losing a customer? Nope. Is their game worse off? Nope. Are they behaving unethically? Nope.

They have a game that you can play for free. You can't become what you want to in the game without some investment, but you can play through the game for free for as long as you want. If that's not "quality" then that's on you.

Granted that GGG still creates a quality game, I wouldn't mind investing in something I find playing for hours for free.

I think it will be to their disadvantage if they want you to buy tabs for no reason at all. But people clamour for map tabs for so long and now we got it. It's a huge QoL advantage to have, but to have one is still left in the hands of the player. No one is forcing you to buy it, I haven't, but after a month it goes on the sale bin rotation for those who are patient and tight on the money. The league goes on for three months so it's not a big deal (for me) to have it now. I don't play competitively nor race, so I can spend money accordingly and not because it is the newest thing to have. The same goes for new players, don't spend yet if you can't see yourself playing for long. It will stay F2P until you understand why you have to buy things, for convenience alone or because you found a game you want to support?

Will it ever stop coming? that will be a big NO. New things have to be created to swallow more tab space. But every move GGG makes should be a reasonable one, it is always a gamble. Again you have all the freedom to spend or not at all. No one is being forced. Frankly speaking, with the way they deliver every league? I cannot see that coming, yet.

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Char1983 wrote:

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lagwin1980 wrote:

Bullshit argument, stash tabs have been in place for a very long time, if it wasn't an issue before it shouldn't be an issue now

Casually ignores the fact that about 100 maps, 100 currencies of various types, 150+ divination card sets and lots of new base types have been introduced since then along with the fact that the new War for the Atlas mechanics require a larger map pool to defend GGG.

Well done.

Doesn't stop any free player from having multiple mule accounts.

Store your stuff you want to 'store' on other accounts and only keep the stuff you want to trade on your main account so you can receive whispers.

Original post is entitled and whiny.