[LHC] 2.6 Ramona's CI Essence Drain

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Xirce wrote:
Hi Ramona,

Wow! Thank you for the fast and detailed answers on all of my questions, really appreciate it. :)

If pierce is important for the cannot die packs, isnt 50% enough then? I not really want to invest all the extra points to push it to 100.
Voidwalker needs phasing to give you full piercing. If you hit a cannot die pack without having killed something shortly before you are in trouble. ;)

Glad to hear that the interaction between Profane Bloom and Essence Drain isnt an issue since i am planning to do a tri-curse setup.

You are right, this is a HC build and a mix of life and ES doesent look too healthy.
But i like to play SC with HC viable builds since i like the extra safety. Do you think i could start with the ES nodes right away, ignore the witch spell damage nodes and the scion life wheel to end up with a life / ES based build before the CI transition?

It would be great if you could do a SC variant for ppl like me who are afraid of the big respec. :)

Hi again Xirce,

I would say 50% can be fine if you're okay with gambling.
The extra points for me are not only damage but also the 100% Pierce quality of life.
If it's a major concern try without it and see how it feels. :)
I would just keep in mind that if you're at a 50% Pierce chance and need to go through 3-4 mobs to hit the cannot die mob it will be a fairly low chance you hit it.

As for the tree, you could honestly just cut the Scion Life wheel and probably still be comfortable, that's cause for most of the respec points needed.
I would just warn you, that is a solid amount of the HP nodes I pick up in my early tree.
I personally expect to spend around 30 points (in Hardcore) to be safe before and after the respec.
Lastly you definitely can pick up the Witch ES nodes first, but that early spell damage carries me a lot for all the life nodes I take after the Corruption nodes.

Hopefully this helps, ultimately it's your decision to tweak my build to your liking.
I'll be updating the guide a bit more today, and doing some solo self found streaming.
If you want to see my characters progression or have any more questions feel free to tune in. :)
Last edited by Ramona on Mar 2, 2017, 7:12:31 PM
Why not Vile Bastion? It seems like such a good defensive option
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xAgility wrote:
Why not Vile Bastion? It seems like such a good defensive option

Hi xAgility,

Vile Bastion is definitely a great defensive option!
I personally would not take it over TriCurse before having a +Curse amulet.
Or over Void Beacon's damage.
I do use Vile Bastion once I have a +Curse amulet.
Last edited by Ramona on Mar 2, 2017, 7:12:42 PM
Hi Ramona,

I want ask you about UberLab.
If you do not buy carry: Min lvl, ES or Life base for start run (minimum requirements ES or Life), and DoT Tooltip that you need for Uberlab.
Or simply some advice on UberLab run (as league starter)

I want ask you about Hybrid:
Witch, Shadow or Scion? any advice on it? How far can go this build, or you don't recommend this option if i want see endgame ;)

THX!
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Hi Ramona,

I want ask you about UberLab.
If you do not buy carry: Min lvl, ES or Life base for start run (minimum requirements ES or Life), and DoT Tooltip that you need for Uberlab.
Or simply some advice on UberLab run (as league starter)

I want ask you about Hybrid:
Witch, Shadow or Scion? any advice on it? How far can go this build, or you don't recommend this option if i want see endgame ;)

THX!

Hi ooDest13oo,

For the UberLab I will need some time to think about what I was running at the time.
I will update you soon on this question.

I would say Trickster (Shadow) is a fine alternative to Occultist.
Comparing between the two Ascendancy options I would personally not prefer the Trickster.
Trickster is a more defensive option, but I prefer the utility and damage options of Occultist.
As well I really enjoy the build in Vaal Discipline that Occultist has built in.

As for Scion I know Essence Drain is one of the few things they can do but I do not think it is better than going either Occultist or Trickster.
Unfortunately she does not receive much love, maybe they will make some changes to help her. :)
Last edited by Ramona on Mar 2, 2017, 7:12:49 PM
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Ramona wrote:

-Essence Drain only does chaos damage which means reflect is not an issue.


what about the likely introduction of "chaos reflect" in next patch? :(
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Giammafix wrote:
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Ramona wrote:

-Essence Drain only does chaos damage which means reflect is not an issue.


what about the likely introduction of "chaos reflect" in next patch? :(

Hi Giammafix,

Do you have a source for this information?
This is the first I've heard of it being a possible change.

If it were added to the game through Essence Drain would be fine.
Reason being the initial hit of Essence Drain which is the Chaos damage, is a minuscule portion of the damage.
Almost all of the damage comes from our Damage over Time that the Essence Drain causes.
This like any other Damage over Time (see ignite), is non-reflect damage which means we do not have any issues.
Also take into account that as CI we are immune to chaos damage, which would nullify any chaos damage reflected to us.
Even if it were possible that we could take this damage, a mediocre amount of ES for this build would be 10k (assuming decent Vaal Regalia).
This is a pretty large amount, and after the initial hit we wouldn't be concerned with any additionl reflect damage.
Now if you were Low Life with Shavronne's Wrappings it may be a different story, but this guide is for CI and I wouldn't worry about it.

tl;dr If they added chaos reflect, the initial hit of Essence Drain does not do enough damage to threaten us.
Last edited by Ramona on Mar 2, 2017, 7:12:56 PM
Hi Ramona,

you convinced me to not start with ES right away and using Spell damage instead since damage seems to be a bit low in the beginning.
But i probably will go for ES next and wont use Nodes like practical Application.

Sorry for my respec anxiety, i probably did too many respecs and wasted way too many orb of regrets already.


When going SSF (self-found), how do you get skill gems like Temporal Chains in a new league? Level another char til Act 3 just to get them?
I didnt check all the needed gems but are there others we cant get as a witch?

What do you think of the coming changes to Vaal Discipline? Without the extra ES it looks quite useless now especially for an Occultist once you have Wicked Ward.
Another thing are the changes to Area skills and passives. Hopefully Contagion wont end as being a small circle.
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Xirce wrote:
Hi Ramona,

you convinced me to not start with ES right away and using Spell damage instead since damage seems to be a bit low in the beginning.
But i probably will go for ES next and wont use Nodes like practical Application.

Sorry for my respec anxiety, i probably did too many respecs and wasted way too many orb of regrets already.


When going SSF (self-found), how do you get skill gems like Temporal Chains in a new league? Level another char til Act 3 just to get them?
I didnt check all the needed gems but are there others we cant get as a witch?

What do you think of the coming changes to Vaal Discipline? Without the extra ES it looks quite useless now especially for an Occultist once you have Wicked Ward.
Another thing are the changes to Area skills and passives. Hopefully Contagion wont end as being a small circle.

Hi again Xirce,

That is totally fine, make whatever changes you think best fits your playstyle. :)
I can definitely undestand the respec anxiety, thankfully for 2.6 on March 3rd we will all be issued a free respec if you normally play in Standard or Hardcore.

For Solo Self Found there are some important gems we currently do not have access to as a Witch, Slower Projectiles, Poison and Temporal chains, are all good examples.
See this link for further information.
https://www.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/5plxw0/development_manifesto_solo_selffound_support_in/dcs6enl/
Unfortunately we do not know the details but it sounds like there will be access to more skill gems to support Solo Self Found.

I personally may end up dropping Vaal Discipline for a separate gem entirely.
I will likely add a Blood Rage in my weapon swap to force Wicked Ward to proc before scary encounters, rather than using Vaal Discipline in my main links.

For Contagion, my understanding is that my build should not be much affected.
As my current AoE radius is not as large as some other builds opt for, I fall more within the builds that will break even.
If there are any differences it will likely be a small amount, whether that is positive or negative I cannot say.
This AoE change was mostly to soft cap the amount of AoE radius that some builds were investing very heavily into.
Which is not something I tried for with this build, at most I just won't get as much out of a potential Dying Sun flask upgrade in the future.

Hopefully this helps!
If you have any additional questions and might be around, I will be streaming in a few hours and welcome anything else you want to ask! :)
Last edited by Ramona on Mar 2, 2017, 7:13:04 PM
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5) Double Dipping
-Double dipping refers to when gaining one source of damage, affects your damage in more than one way.
-With Essence Drain this refers to the initial projectiles damage, and then the resulting chaos damage over time.
-Modifiers to Damage/Spell Damage/Chaos Damage/Projectile Damage scale your initial hit, which scales your DoT damage, while also separately scaling your DoT damage.
-I would suggest viewing my professional drawing to better understand
http://i.imgur.com/4JOkgeU.png
-As you can see these four modifiers are more desirable, Damage over Time modifiers while good, do not double dip.


I want to point out that this does not classify as double dipping. Double dipping occurs when secondary damage is based on the primary damage source (poison is 8% of the initial hit, ignite is 20% of the initial hit). So when primary damage is increased by modifiers, secondary damage is also increased and then increased again by the same modifiers.

In the case of ED, the secondary DoT is not based off the initial hit. It has a set amount of damage per level as the gem level increases and it is only modified once. The "Modifiers to Spell Damage apply to this skill's Damage Over Time" just allows spell damage to scale the DoT when spell damage normally can't scale DoTs as in the case of something like fire trap.

ED only double dips when wielding the consuming dark to poison because poison is based off the primary hit and double dips. Decay also does not double dip.

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