@GGG - When are we going to see the broken-ness that is Zerphi's Last Breath fixed?



Just for reference with what we're looking at here.
Here's the issue (IMO a bug) with the item: Players are scaling 'mana' costs very high, but without actually spending any mana. They do this by using a blood magic gem. Why is this an issue?

Here's the specific abuse case:
1. Equip Scold's Bridle (400% of 'mana' cost dealt as phys damage)
2. Have Mind Over Matter (30% of damage taken from mana before life)
3. Use Zerphi's Flask (800% of 'mana' cost gained as life, scaled by flask effect and flask duration).
4. Spam high cost skill (usually movement) linked with Blood Magic to spend life.

Lets say you were using a skill that cost, say, 200 life, and have 50% flask effect (it can go much higher)
You use the skill, and take 1000 damage (800 from scolds), 240 of which is taken from your mana pool.
You activate Zerphi's.
You spam your skill, say shield charge, at 8 APS while travelling across the map. Each use does 760 damage to your HP net, but you heal for 2400 per use, so you end up gaining 1670 life per use, which equates to 13360 life/s recovered, at instant speed.

You can also use this self damaging aspect to trigger high level CWDT links and cause massive amounts of damage.

People have achieved much higher regen rates, close to and over 100k/s, with skills like a 400 life cost explosive arrow and pathfinder flask effectiveness.

There are two issues with how this is working atm:
1. The healing rate is extremely broken. You char can pretty much only die to a oneshot. (and pretty much makes you unkillable in PvP for the most part, though I suspect no one really cares about this).
2. Life isn't mana. You shouldn't be healing at all if you're not spending mana. Look at how Kitava's Thirst was designed. "Spend at least 100 Mana to Use a Skill: Mana must be spent in order to qualify. Utilizing Blood Magic does not trigger the spells. Spending energy shield via Eldritch Battery does not trigger the spells. Aura reservation cost can activate socketed spells, as limited in usefulness as this is. Using Soul Taker to avoid actually spending mana does not work."

I think the same fix should be made to Zerphi's Last Breath. You should have to spend mana in order to qualify; using Blood Magic should not cause you to heal.

This has been an issue for several patches, and is beginning to become known in the community at large (general tsao's chicken recently did a build with it). Personally, if I were one of the devs, my top bug fixes would be Zerphi's, along with the DW bug/glitch/exploit that's possible right now, and the BV bug where you can cheese your stack size.

-Savage
Theorycrafter/Build Creator for PORTAL guild
@BlightScourge -> guide @ view-thread/1382667 (Retired till Mjolner is fixed)
Lvl 94 Crit Mjolner Marauder
twitch.tv/savagewolves
Last edited by zSavage#0846 on Feb 8, 2017, 3:21:15 AM
Last bumped on Feb 12, 2017, 10:10:25 AM
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Yea and then you run out of mana and die :D This flask is very unreliable and u must play with it very carefuly if you make a mistake it might have lethal outcome. Seriously in a high end content I wouldn't rely on this flask to maintain my life. I think it's fine as it is, if GGG would decide to nerf it they could probably as well as remove it. It is not op at all.

Btw what you are suggesting (item and gem combinations) is very tedious even if it works not interested to use it.
New mute system is terrible - no trade...
Last edited by y3lw0rC#4020 on Feb 8, 2017, 3:56:30 AM
Well, if you build completely around that flask it will become very strong that is true BUT that is true for almost every single good item in the game. This game really has some broken things but I doubt Zerphi's flask is one of the big players in the broken league!
German saying: Schönheit und Funktionalität in Sekundenschnelle zu ruinieren, ist dem wahren Dilettanten keine Herausforderung!
torturo: "Though, I'm really concerned, knowing by practice the capabilities of the balance team."
top2000: "let me bend your rear for a moment exile"
I agree flask is fucken broken and bugged. It work with bloodmagic gem!


"
Márkusz wrote:


on Jul 28, 2016 9:40:30 PM





First take note that my gear is not perfect, I miss Legacy Kaom's and 6L quill rain which heavily affects the heal amount.
There are 4 components to scale for the heal: Mana cost, Attack speed, Flask effect and Maximum life.

Maximum life puts a cap on the heal amount possible, because if you heal more life than you are missing, the amount over your max hp is lost, so your mana cost should be your Maximum life minus your mana cost (you can't attack if your life is below your mana cost), divided by your heal amount from Zerphi.

My stats:
8718 Maximum life
8.85 attacks per second (with Blood Rage and Silver Flask)
700 mana cost
28% Flask effect -> 1024% of Mana cost healed

Current maximum theoretical heal per second: 700 * 8.85 * 10.24 = 63 436

Best possible stats:
On top of my current setup, I could get +500 HP from Legacy Kaom's, +120 from reaching level 100, +50 from getting better helmet and quiver, for a total of +670 max hp. With my current tree I get a 3.48 multiplier on the flat HP from gear, so my maximum life would be 11039.

11000 Maximum life
10 attacks per second (assuming all +10 passives are spent on attack speed, and getting 3 rare jewels with 4 stats)
1074 mana cost (ideal amount, because multiplied by the 10.24 from flask heal it equals to max life. Getting the 6th link on bow and a lvl21 EA will get close to this mana cost)
28% Flask effect -> 1024% of Mana cost healed

Current maximum theoretical heal per second: 1074 * 10 * 10.24 = 109 977

Effective MAX HP with MoM is: 11712 (explained below)




Poe Pvp experience
https://youtu.be/Z6eg3aB_V1g?t=302
Last edited by Head_Less#6633 on Feb 8, 2017, 7:42:27 AM
"
MullaXul wrote:




BACK STORY:
I'm an avid moba player. So I come from a PvP rich background, since moba are the fucken best! I've been pvping in poe about 7minutes now and am already rank 1 on multiple ladders.



OVERVIEW:
+ The (__)D)Lord, god of EA/CWDT/ZERPHI
+ iNsANe! AOE.
+ Superior clear speed.
+ PvP dominance (secondary dmg + AoE shotgun + zerphi sustain).
+ PvE dominance (shaper/uber-lab/uber-atziri/twilight strand capable).
+ Economical build (get started with ~3ex) with huge growth potential.
+ Nerf-proof because GGG doesn't care
+ Insane burst damage, kill most people with the initial fuse. (PWNT)
+ Vomiting spell at melee range (CUZ FUK YO MELEE)
- always managing ur mana because of zerphi's



MECHANICS (the rocket science):
Since we are pathfinder, we have nearly 100% uptime on all flasks. (Balanced and never to be nerfed.)
+ 75%/50% block with only rumi/rearguard.
+ 30 arrows/fuses total with dying sun.
+ 400% increased AOE from dying sun.
+ Ample life gain on attack from zerphi's.
+ EA secondary damage type. (Note: not relied on)
http://pathofexile.gamepedia.com/Damage#Secondary_Damage
+ Scale burn damage to the HEAVENZ with quadruple double triple-dipping on jewels/tree/gear/gems.
+ Adaptable: No swaps required, just hold attack. Match ups are irrelevant, arenas are irrelevant.
+ Using elemental equilibirum and the right CWDT setup to max EA (I don't rely on this)
+ To sustain mana correctly we need some dmg taken gained as mana because we gain mana from the dmg caused by Scold (ideal amount is around 15%, if u pass that u will have a hard time in pvp cuz u will gain to much mana n cancel zerphi's effect.
-You DO NOT want to over do this....because without these mechanics you'd have to actually PvP. I repeat, do not exceed the threshold or you will be PvPing and we don't want to PvP, we want to just PWWWWWWWWWWWWWN FUCKAZ WIT DA SKILLZ.


DEFENSE:
+ 75%/50% block, with a bow....ya with a bow!!! HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA cuz fuck ya bro!
+ zerphi's life gain (mana cost is about 144 so we gain 1152 life for every attack).
+ CWDT+frost bomb+decrepify+amplify damage to turn everyone into CI (in a bad way, i.e. rekt their life regeneration).
+ CWDT+vortex+hurricane+ice nova+holy freeze to chill all none pathfinder build (90% are pathfinder) and also help EE mechanic.
+ CWDT+molten shell+fireball+magmaorb+etherealknife+bladefall+cyclone+lightning arrow+fist of heavens+frozen orb+armageddon to vomit on any melee build with constant aoe overlapped pwnfuckingage!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! da skillz spilling out all over the place daaaaaaaaaawg.


OFFENSE:
+ EA too gud
+ The scaled increased area of effect (AoE) will enhance the overlap and coverage, enabling you to control the pvp battleground. Dom....in...ance!
-For pvp, EA explosion is very good due to the fact that its can't be block or dodge. It's 100% legit and should never be nerfed.


GEMS:
+ EA setup :GMP/INC AOE/EMPOWER/FIRE PEN/LESS DURATION
note: Always use GMP+AoE so you never have to aim. I repeat you DO NOT want to ever have to aim in this game. Just hold down attack and let everything trigger off of you for free, if there happens to be walls around you that's an added bonus of pwnage bc you just fucken exploded the screen woooooooooooooot!
+ CWDT/molten shell link with: fire pen/ele focus/control destruction
+ CWDT/vortex/inc aoe/frost bomb
+ CWDT/ice nova/ele weak
+ blink arrow alone...oh fuck who am I kidding, just use more CWDT. CWDT Flame dash for auto movement!


GOAL: To NEVER EVER win by using anything you did yourself.




Until this point you haven't had to do anything to win. That's all about to change so brace yourself for the ultimate battle.

-With a fierce sweeping motion, remove everything that could possibly hinder your flask hand. This includes Mountain Dews,Doritos...everything, trust me on this one.

-Next with an assortment of bendy straws directly inject any full cans of Mountain Dew game fuel directly into your bloodstream like you're Bane from Batman.

-Equip any certified (look for the certification, you can't afford knock offs here) flasking glove i.e wrist protector.

-Turn on appropriate music for such an epic battle. I like Lamb Chops, song that never ends.


-Assume you've logged in already and began the match. Immediately let flame dash or similar auto movement skill teleport you to your opponent. They will of done the same, leaving you both face to face, flask to flask, bed pan to bed pan and exchanging one of the most retarded gazes you could ever imagine RAAAAAAAAAAAAWR! Quickly ready your flask fingers and with your 1 mouse button continually held (never let go, just hold it) hit (like a master pianist) 12345 12345 12345 12345 12345 infinitely until you either win...or you lose. If you've lost, he/she was clearly the better player or you slipped up somewhere. This is a meticulous process and will take some getting used to, most mortals barely get past the first few steps so if you've even gotten this far don't lose faith.



Poe Pvp experience
https://youtu.be/Z6eg3aB_V1g?t=302
Last edited by Head_Less#6633 on Feb 8, 2017, 7:44:11 AM
There is ton of broken stuff in the game but the main issue with Zerphi (aside the fact that it make any content trivial) is that it putt immense stress on the servers because of the CWDT triggers used to deal damages. It's the same as wormblaster harvest who was nerfed last patch.

An easy fix would be indeed to change how the flask work to force the user to spend mana as it was originally designed. I'm pretty sur the mod is unique to zerphi so a global change wouldn't be that hard I guess.

I'm surprised it took so long for the community to catch up on this exploit (same as how long it took to abuse Frost Wall). As usual the pvp community is always miles ahead everyone else.

Here is one of the build abusing this for reference :
https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/1753462
Last edited by IceDeal#5895 on Feb 8, 2017, 7:51:03 AM
The forbidden word got used 3+ time already in this thread.
Let s see if we summoned the haters.



"
IceDeal wrote:
There is ton of broken stuff in the game but the main issue with Zerphi (aside the fact that it make any content trivial) is that it putt immense stress on the servers because of the CWDT triggers used to deal damages. It's the same as wormblaster harvest who was nerfed last patch.

An easy fix would be indeed to change how the flask work to force the user to spend mana as

Here is one of the build abusing this for reference :
https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/1753462


yea once again you use good exemple.
Kudos
Poe Pvp experience
https://youtu.be/Z6eg3aB_V1g?t=302
Last edited by Head_Less#6633 on Feb 8, 2017, 8:18:11 AM
luls I remember this wasnt even a 1 alc item back when.
Git R Dun!
"
Aim_Deep wrote:
luls I remember this wasnt even a 1 alc item back when.


it went to shit once they merged few league uniques together.

scold+zerphi for exemple.

Flask is bugged, need to work only with mana not blood magic gem. Glad to see more and more people complaining about this cheat code.
Poe Pvp experience
https://youtu.be/Z6eg3aB_V1g?t=302

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