Resolute Technique versus Crit Meta (GGG)

"40% more weapon melee damage"

-facebreakers can t get godlike
-no abuse from already overpowered ranged EA/ranged
-buff melee
-buff RT


Poe Pvp experience
https://youtu.be/Z6eg3aB_V1g?t=302
Last edited by Head_Less#6633 on Nov 23, 2016, 9:55:44 AM
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ihasmario wrote:
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Fruz wrote:
If you have for example +200% crit mult, your damage will be = damage * (1.5+2)


The correct equation, I believe, should be 1.5*(1+n/100) where n is your % increase. So the equation should be 1.5*(1+2), not 1.5+2.

So the total would be a 450% multiplier over your non-crit.

This is how it used to work a while back, but they changed it so the increases just add to your crit multi(the wording reflects this).
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Vesuvius079 wrote:
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ihasmario wrote:
"
Fruz wrote:
If you have for example +200% crit mult, your damage will be = damage * (1.5+2)


The correct equation, I believe, should be 1.5*(1+n/100) where n is your % increase. So the equation should be 1.5*(1+2), not 1.5+2.

So the total would be a 450% multiplier over your non-crit.

This is how it used to work a while back, but they changed it so the increases just add to your crit multi(the wording reflects this).


Had no idea they changed it. That makes sense given the huge numbers now

My mistake
If crit is OP (cannot say if that is true) then making bosses/uniques somewhat resistant to it would fix it in a manner which can be easily adjusted as needed without messing with the whole passive/item system. Just like they already are resistant to curses.
Like the existing map mod. Unfortunately the map mod is too weak. If I have a phys crit build then the "phys damage reduction" hurts more than the "crit dam reduction". For elemental resistance map mods it is even worse. "Players cannot crit" (with packsize bonus) would be more in line with stuff like "players cannot leech/regen".

"
SerenaDrake wrote:
I have another idea to improve RT how about:
<snip>
- Your hits are Lucky when damaging Enemies


Nice idea but there may be issues due to the different damage variances - so it would be very good for lightning damage but not so good for cold damage. Dont know if that is good or bad...


Edit: Could also add a mod to magic/rare monster pool which reduces extra crit damage taken.
No wonder it's lost, it's in the middle of the jungle!
Last edited by Zrevnur#2026 on Nov 23, 2016, 11:51:44 AM
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ihasmario wrote:
Had no idea they changed it. That makes sense given the huge numbers now
My mistake

I just remembered that they did change something like this for 2.2.0 :

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Critical Strike Rework/Balance

All sources of increased Critical Strike Multiplier have been changed to additional Critical Strike Multiplier. This change brings the functionality in line with how most players think it works.
Because of this, all items, passives and some skills/support gems that used to have increased Critical Strike Multiplier are now 33% less effective on players, despite having the same value.


Makes sense, I didn't actually know how it was working before, now I do.
SSF is not and will never be a standard for balance, it is not for people entitled to getting more without trading.
Last edited by Fruz#6137 on Nov 23, 2016, 1:11:34 PM
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sofocle10000 wrote:
A nice way to do it would be 3 new nodes post RT => 20% more damage, because you always hit, 15% reduced stun threshold, because you always hit, 10% chance to get Unholy Might on kill, because you always hit and should be a badass - playing melee + RT...



This is something I can get around to having with just a bit more QoL for RT.
Sometimes you can take the game out of the garage but you can't take the garage out of the game.
- raics, 06.08.2016

Last edited by JohnNamikaze#6516 on Nov 23, 2016, 2:07:25 PM
once again: solving a GLOBAL issue with LOCAL changes solves nothing. whats more it creates yet another issue

hidding too many goodies behind/with RT makes playing attack build a binary choice: go RT or go full crit. currently there are different shades of grey between the two. with this 'solution' you remove all of them

the root cause is easy to spot if one is not a power-junkie: it is the crit giving not only bonkers damage but also lots of otherwise expensive/unobtainable perks AND being rather cheap to build nowadays.

do not nerf, buff instead turned this game into the shallow pond we have now. the only way to fix that is to reverse some steps. and either make crit way harder to scale (like make mid-level invested build ~50% crit chance with not-so-high multi instead of easy 90%+) or cut some of the free perks crit get without any real reason. it is just stupid that if one wants to build shock it is WAAAAY easier to simply go crit instead of 'investing' in meager nodes the tree has to offer.


i know power-junkies will soon jump me but.. i do not care
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sidtherat wrote:


hidding too many goodies behind/with RT makes playing attack build a binary choice: go RT or go full crit. currently there are different shades of grey between the two. with this 'solution' you remove all of them




To be honest, that is mostly what my melee builds fall under. I do have a few that do not fall under either category and they are kinda weird with heavy dependency on their respective ascendancy class.
Sometimes you can take the game out of the garage but you can't take the garage out of the game.
- raics, 06.08.2016

Last edited by JohnNamikaze#6516 on Nov 23, 2016, 3:03:48 PM
once the game offers only binary choices there is no reason to keep the passive tree in the game anymore

we already have too many presets and 'best choices'. creating yet another moves us closer and closer into pre-set classes with pre-set gear and skills

there are builds already that you can guess passives and gear by its mere name. explosive arrow? ED/Contaigion (there are variants but mostly limited to personal choices), BV, 'melee', etc etc

the passive tree is already more of a joke than a real creative canvas when one talks about min-maxing

some skills are SO MUCH stronger than others that passive tree takes second-row role in the whole picture. most bow builds look identical, most dagger builds look identical.

and tying strong bonuses to RT will deepen this issue. this game is already pretty dumbed down compared to its potential by VERY questionable balancing (or simply - lack of it) and will not take much more such blunders

metas are cool. when top build is 110% of the average. but metas with builds 5000% better than average are just dumb. and poe is right now at 4999%
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sidtherat wrote:
once again: solving a GLOBAL issue with LOCAL changes solves nothing. whats more it creates yet another issue

hidding too many goodies behind/with RT makes playing attack build a binary choice: go RT or go full crit. currently there are different shades of grey between the two. with this 'solution' you remove all of them

the root cause is easy to spot if one is not a power-junkie: it is the crit giving not only bonkers damage but also lots of otherwise expensive/unobtainable perks AND being rather cheap to build nowadays.

do not nerf, buff instead turned this game into the shallow pond we have now. the only way to fix that is to reverse some steps. and either make crit way harder to scale (like make mid-level invested build ~50% crit chance with not-so-high multi instead of easy 90%+) or cut some of the free perks crit get without any real reason. it is just stupid that if one wants to build shock it is WAAAAY easier to simply go crit instead of 'investing' in meager nodes the tree has to offer.


i know power-junkies will soon jump me but.. i do not care


Funny, I always thought that you either have to go RT to not give a damn about Accuracy, and Crit Chance + Multi, and have a reliable way of having sufficient damage, or if you do care about Accuracy, it's better to actually invest too in Crit Chance + Multi (and my 2 Accuracy based melee Juggs with 91/90 are based on a Crit Chance <60% with >400% Multi)...

The problem is that Crit seems so overpowered in relation to RT that it's not even funny (and I went bonkers on my RT dual Dory Jugg keeping him at only 5 K HP for "moar" tooltip damage), and the fact that I don't oneshot myself with reflect damage seems a small consolation when instead playing Crit makes you feel actually powerful to tackle the harder content...

Even with changes to Crit, I do feel that RT should offer more versatility as at the moment is the lackluster option, and why my proposed changes would help aleviate a small part of the feeling that going RT is the "bad" option...
PSS: Our almighty TencentGGG overlords are very scrupulous regarding criticizing their abilities to take proper decisions and consider everything "needlessly harsh and condescending"...

Good to know "free speech" doesn't apply in any form or manner on the forums these days...
Last edited by sofocle10000#6408 on Nov 23, 2016, 4:16:18 PM

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