Some incentive to play slow attack pace builds

Hey there,

I was thinking about what to do next league ( a bit burnt out this league already ), and I noticed something ...

It's not the first time, but basically .... the way to go, is basically to stack crazy amount of attack speed to increase the DPS.

Appart from earthquake ( which is a very good thing imho, too bad the skill is still broken compared to the rest of melee skills ), for all attacking builds, stacking attack speed until the character animation is completely unnatural and ridiculous is the way to go .............


So it would be great ( I think ) if we had couple of ways, actual optimized enough ways to have nice damage without needing to go with a lot of attack speed.

For example, a support gem ( mutually exclusive with multi strike ) that gives you a LESS attack speed modifier ( let's say 40% ), for a more damage modifier ( let's say 50 or 60% maybe ).
Those numbers are nothing like tweaked or anything of course.
Thing is .... this would make EQ even more OP than what it actual is :///, so there would need to be a balance around this too.

Or a gem that would increase dmg / maybe AOE at the cost of a short windup maybe ?

Since the armour formula only works in one way ( afaik, mobs have a flat physical reduction %, and not atual armour values, but those would be kinda meaningless given how much dps it's possible to reach now ), there is no point it going slow hitting attacks, since tons attack speed gives more dps at the end ...
Reflect is also better to deal with if you have armour and are on a high attack speed physical build ( easier to mitigate than if you were slow hitting ).


If you have examples where slow hitting builds are better than with high attack speed ( apart from EQ ) that I missed, please go ahead and throw them here, I'll edit this post.
edit : Nice EA burn ele prolif setup could be a slow attack paced build, alright.
There might be some bleed based buils too, puncture isn't exactly fotm it seems but I should definitely be feasible.

I would really like to build an attacking toon that isn't having very unnatural animation and going again with very high attack speed ( and isn't earth quake ).

+1 for suggestion.
I tend to play more slower builds too instead of convulsing fast types. But with those "clear speed", "move or you are 1-shotted" I'm wondering how GGG will pull it...

So everybody else is just fine with the fact that stacking crazy amounts ( or a least a lot ) of attack speed is the way to go in most cases for attack based builds ? :((

the problem with it, is that if GGG would implement gems to support slow hitting skills, who would stop players to use these gems with EQ to go from really really good to OP as fuck skill?

Stacking attacks speed is the way to go with melee, as the attack animation are a problematic thing, as you may get interrupted or stunned during the animation, but before you actually hit.

If you want more slower skills, GGG would have to either make them from scratch or, if we talking about supports, they would have to put massive restriction in places to prevent abuse of these gems.

AS is king, that's how PoE rolls.

You may try ice crash, it's able to support it with full "more" gem setup.
Damage is very high, is AS independent, the only problem is that if it's a crit build you'll have serious problems with reflect.

I'm in favor of slow but devastating strikes.
I've messed with flicker strike trypanon, and.. well it's interesting.
It could be a notable passive node, a support gem or new skill gems.

It would have been easier if there were no increases in attack speed.
Each attack skill will have a fixed attack speed and we scale damage by other means.
Like adding elemental support gems or added damage nodes.
We could also have skills and spells with elaborate and better animations.
Instead of this seizure type attacks.

I think this will be easier on the servers too.
Instead of sending multiple 10 damages and its corresponding crit chance and whatever things that are happening per hit per micro second.
It will just send one bulk 1k damage and crit and whatever per second.

When I first saw those super fast animation on youtube, I lol'ed.
But later realized that there is no avoiding it because well dps.

I hope someday GGG will overhaul this mechanic.
Cause visually, they're a pain to watch.

1. Multistrike is an abomination. More Attack Speed + being rooted in place = all the graphical disadvantages of high attack speed minus all the gameplay advantages of high attack speed. Really should replace Multistrike with something like 90-110% more Melee Damage, 35% less Attack Speed... because that's really what it does anyway, except for Flicker Strike.

2. Developing slower active skills in this game would fall into the melee trap: when some skills have great range, great AoE, and great speed, giving a skill short range, single target, or slow instantly makes it no longer viable. There's no real route to creating incentives without nerfing the shit out of what the best skills can do now.

"

Fruz wrote:

Hey there,

I was thinking about what to do next league ( a bit burnt out this league already ), and I noticed something ...

It's not the first time, but basically .... the way to go, is basically to stack crazy amount of attack speed to increase the DPS.

Appart from earthquake ( which is a very good thing imho, too bad the skill is still broken compared to the rest of melee skills ), for all attacking builds, stacking attack speed until the character animation is completely unnatural and ridiculous is the way to go .............


So it would be great ( I think ) if we had couple of ways, actual optimized enough ways to have nice damage without needing to go with a lot of attack speed.

For example, a support gem ( mutually exclusive with multi strike ) that gives you a LESS attack speed modifier ( let's say 40% ), for a more damage modifier ( let's say 50 or 60% maybe ).
Those numbers are nothing like tweaked or anything of course.
Thing is .... this would make EQ even more OP than what it actual is :///, so there would need to be a balance around this too.

Or a gem that would increase dmg / maybe AOE at the cost of a short windup maybe ?

Since the armour formula only works in one way ( afaik, mobs have a flat physical reduction %, and not atual armour values, but those would be kinda meaningless given how much dps it's possible to reach now ), there is no point it going slow hitting attacks, since tons attack speed gives more dps at the end ...
Reflect is also better to deal with if you have armour and are on a high attack speed physical build ( easier to mitigate than if you were slow hitting ).


If you have examples where slow hitting builds are better than with high attack speed ( apart from EQ ) that I missed, please go ahead and throw them here, I'll edit this post.

I would really like to build an attacking toon that isn't having very unnatural animation and going again with very high attack speed ( and isn't earth quake ).

It wouldn't make Earthquake more OP. It's that way, because of the helm enchant. When your AS hits that sweet spot and every attack results in an aftershock, that's where the magic happens. Before that you could probably outdps it (for single target) with many other skills.

I really like the general idea, but the problem is PoE is a grind game in nature. For example Trypanon for slow attacks works perfectly fine, you can easily reach your 800% crit multi and have a very strong, relatively versatile weapon. I played it this league as an Inquisitor and threw a Prolif on it. Worked like a charm. But when you do hundreds of maps with the same tile sets you yearn for clear speed.
Another problem everyone already mentioned is balance. GGG is simply not able to. It would open another massive can of worms.

Imagine all melee skills with eq attack speed.....that would be boring af... no1 would play anything other than eq.....

And how will slower harder hitting attacks help u with reflect??? when that would clearly 1 shot u instead of chipping away hp.... makes no sense

"

Fruz wrote:

Hey there,

I was thinking about what to do next league ( a bit burnt out this league already ), and I noticed something ...

It's not the first time, but basically .... the way to go, is basically to stack crazy amount of attack speed to increase the DPS.

Appart from earthquake ( which is a very good thing imho, too bad the skill is still broken compared to the rest of melee skills ), for all attacking builds, stacking attack speed until the character animation is completely unnatural and ridiculous is the way to go .............


So it would be great ( I think ) if we had couple of ways, actual optimized enough ways to have nice damage without needing to go with a lot of attack speed.

For example, a support gem ( mutually exclusive with multi strike ) that gives you a LESS attack speed modifier ( let's say 40% ), for a more damage modifier ( let's say 50 or 60% maybe ).
Those numbers are nothing like tweaked or anything of course.
Thing is .... this would make EQ even more OP than what it actual is :///, so there would need to be a balance around this too.

Or a gem that would increase dmg / maybe AOE at the cost of a short windup maybe ?

Since the armour formula only works in one way ( afaik, mobs have a flat physical reduction %, and not atual armour values, but those would be kinda meaningless given how much dps it's possible to reach now ), there is no point it going slow hitting attacks, since tons attack speed gives more dps at the end ...
Reflect is also better to deal with if you have armour and are on a high attack speed physical build ( easier to mitigate than if you were slow hitting ).


If you have examples where slow hitting builds are better than with high attack speed ( apart from EQ ) that I missed, please go ahead and throw them here, I'll edit this post.

I would really like to build an attacking toon that isn't having very unnatural animation and going again with very high attack speed ( and isn't earth quake ).

There is a class, that favours slow attack pace - Slayer!
Sadly, he still offers attack speed bonuses (imo they all should be removed and replaced with other bonuses of same power), and while his leech mechanics is cool, being tied to life and attacks make him inferior in ES caster meta of PoE.
Also, EQ got nerfed, the only skill that favours slow hits. And the nerf was especially severe for slow-hitters.
Also, reflect... the more i play PoE, the more i feel like reflect is a total bullshit, that never makes a real challenge - it's always ignored by players, one way or another (either skipping reflect mods, or using another damage type, or using non-reflectable damage, and so on).