Is Reach of the Council TOOO good?

You can make an effective bow character with nothing other than a cheap ele thicket a tabula rasa and some random rares. It will clear faster than a 40 exalt melee builds.

Best "natural" roll is 38-68 added physical.

This bow can have 100-115.

That's bonkers.

"

1453R wrote:

Because we all know that any sort of item, skill, passive tree shift, or any combination of the above which lets a player clear above T6 for less than fifty exalts has to be awful for the game, right?

I know Reach is going to get absolutely ruined post-Prophecy, and frankly I can even understand why. But I really do get fed up with the tired mentality in this forum that everyone who can't farm up a hundred exalts to outfit a 'proper' build inside a week of a new league opening up is a useless scrublord who should uninstall and then drive off a tall cliff, and any item/skill/passive/whatever that could let people, say...make a bow build on less than 33ex...should be Cleansed With Fire.

Really is ridiculous. I get that the PoE forum community in general tends to be the surly, hostile Elite Masters crowd who absolutely hate that anyone who can't devote eighteen hours a day to Path wants to play, but c'mon guys. C'mon. Was totally trying to save up for a Reach myself, but this whole thread has soured me on it. Blagh.

Why would you save up? It is probably easier to just get one yourself. The prophecies show up regularly and the Pale Council fight is not that hard.

"

FarmerTed wrote:

Why would you save up? It is probably easier to just get one yourself. The prophecies show up regularly and the Pale Council fight is not that hard.

Indeed, Council was designed like the basic Rigwald fight, something quite easy to get at least one signature unique from the league. Every correct build can take them down, they don't have healing phase neither one shot moves. Just keep moving and you'll be fine.

"

Vipermagi wrote:

That's not quite it.
You can make a bow build with less than 33 exalts, first of all. Second...

A Harbinger that costs a couple Exalts (the same as Reach does) works just fine for a lot of content; Atziri, uberLab, tier ten-ish Maps, no problem. It won't be the fastest, but that's why it's not worth an arm and a leg. Reach, at that same price point, absolutely and utterly destroys Red maps, steamrolls uberLab, it does whatever you want. Doesn't matter.

Surely you see there's a bit of an issue there? There's no reason to pick that Harbinger up. A Harbinger that compares to the raw power of Reach is so much more expensive than Reach it's hardly actually an option.

To be fair, I was using the price you quoted for that Harbinger you mentioned that you state holds up to Reach’s oomphf.

High-end bow builds tend to cost anywhere between two to five times what any other attacking build does simply because the bows themselves are so much more expensive. Yeah, there’s hinky tricksy things you can do with stuff like Chin Sol and Lioneye’s Glare that lets you pretend you’re playing a bow build that actually holds up in endgame, but the AssReacher-style builds that people are using to farm mirrors are, traditionally, 40ex builds that those pitiful scrubs who have things like jobs instead of PoE Playing Time can pretty much forget even exist. A really solid bow build that works into endgame isn’t quite up to Rainbownuke price levels…but it’s far enough out of reach that the difference is purely academic to guys who’re lucky to see one exalt all league.

Even Reach is kinda viciously expensive for The Rest Of Us…but it’s the sort of viciously expensive we might be able to obtain with a lot of work and no small dose of luck. A ‘good’ Harbinger – not even a great Harbinger, just a good one – is the sort of thing The Little Guy can pretty much just write off.

I haven’t played an attack build in a long, long time now, simply because spell builds are the only things that work on any sort of normal-person-reasonable budget anymore. Sometimes that bothers me more than it does other times, especially when people go on eleven-page rants about how any sort of unique weapon (or unique item of any sort, really) that offers any sort of worthwhile power should be murdered most permanently because ‘everyone knows’ that 30ex Rares are the only things that should get anyone anywhere.

"

Vipermagi wrote:

Lioneye's Glare is a sub-10c item. There's plenty of Rares between 15 Exalted and 10c, because that's one hell of a price range. They're going to be stronger than Lioneye's, but not as good as a really fucking well-rolled Harbinger. That's why their pricepoint lies between a cheapo Unique and a powerful Rare, and that's the other options you should be looking at when you want to upgrade from a Lioneye's. You'd almost say there's a reason items tend to be priced the way they are, huh. It's just that Reach is an insane abberation, being way cheaper than its potential suggests.

Frankly, what would be preferable is for GGG to increase the drawback on Reach. -50% projectile speed would be an acceptable start, and would also serve to discourage (some) players from using Slower Projectiles for another More bonus. The important thing, however, is that unlike what most folks in the thread seem to be advocating, a plan that dials up the projectile speed drawback on Reach would still allow Reach to be a powerful option. It doesn’t need to be destroyed. Yeah, free GMP is a Big Deal and likely warrants more negatives than Reach has – but why does every goddamn unique in the game need to be utterly useless?

Nobody can afford 33ex Harbinger builds, man. Why are they the only things allowed to clear content?

The Tempest with 48%+ attack speed - 1c
Wake of destruction - 1c
Quiver/jewellery with lightning damage on them: like 2c each with 1-2 resists and average life.
Wrath and Herald of Thunder - can by them from the vendor.
4L: LA - GMP - WED - Lightning Pen.
2L: Frost wall - spell echo
Jewel (or passive) with +2 mana on hit: 1c or free.

And now you can do enough dps for all endgame content. Congrats. Maybe spend a bit more to upgrade your Jewelry once you can afford it.

A'ight, can shelve the pricing issues for now. Perhaps that is a 'L2P' issue, but by the same token I don't know what 'managing my currency' even means outside of apparently going to currency trade and turning literally everything I have into half an exalt.

Here's the other question, though - why does Reach need to be destroyed? Ties into the wider question I've never gotten a satisfactory answer for, which is "why do all Uniques need to blow chunks?" The only answer anyone's ever given me is "because GGG said, a long long time ago, that 'GG' rares should always be at least twice as amazeballs as any unique item."

Rares are boring. Everyone always looks for the same combination of mods for any given type of rare, and any rare which doesn't conform to the narrow definition of what is 'Good' for that item is trash. Reach isn't the best example of a build-enabling or build-defining unique (though an argument can definitely be made for 'defining', given the existence of the term 'AssReacher'), but it's one of very, very few unique weapons actually powerful enough to hang a non-spell build on endgame.

Off the top of my head I can think of maybe half a dozen unique weapons you can actually hang an attacking build on that'd be considered 'endgame'. Everything else is "find a bitchin' rare".

Why?