The Trials of Ascendancy serve no purpose and are annoying

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ozzy9832001 wrote:

I actually like this suggestion. Trials are so basic, but they really don't prepare you for what the lab really is.

I think more people would complain less about the labs if they didn't have to do the pointless trials...or the trials were just a single zone comprised of all 6.

Either, or, but I find they add nothing at all to the game.

I totally agree with the fact that people would complain less about labs if they didn't have to do all the trials and a single zone would be unideal, but much better than what we have right now.

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ScrotieMcB wrote:

Dude, the Trials in Normal are tutorials. You might hate tutorials and think traps don't need them, but that doesn't mean they aren't tutorials.

Having to complete a tutorial multiple times, however, is pretty lame. Not really a tutorial the second time.

But as I said why does PoE have a tutorial for content all of a sudden, plus what are they a tutorial of? On the outside yes they seem as though they are tutorials, but they don't exactly teach anything Normal Labs doesn't, they are equally as dangerous in terms of traps. Also they can't be a tutorial if they have to be repeated. Why can't Normal Labs be the tutorial anyway? A trap introduction isn't an effective tutorial for the labs either.

imho the best use, beside the introductory nature of the trials, is that they eventually give some use to areas which are not visited by many players because they don't give passive point rewards. like crypt, maze or crematorium.

i fail to see the trial part on those "trials".

pull the lever next to the door and be done? lol.

I just ripped in HC lvl 58 to a whirling blade trial.
There were two blades blocking the whole path running up and down with a switch at the end of their path (where they turned and RIP), still not sure how I should have bypassed them and activate the switch (teleport movement skill I guess).
Sorta angry now after 4 full days of playing with a char that could stand for minutes in a screen full of monsters and melted every boss so far - dying to this meaningless repeated trial thingy in under 1 sec. Will make a break now.

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vio wrote:

imho the best use, beside the introductory nature of the trials, is that they eventually give some use to areas which are not visited by many players because they don't give passive point rewards. like crypt, maze or crematorium.

^This

The trials are clearly a way to make players visit area's abandoned for over a year if not longer by a big portion of the community.

This is reasonable, if we assume these zones are still designed to kill players.(from a design perspective)

Peace,

-Boem-

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Boem wrote:

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vio wrote:

imho the best use, beside the introductory nature of the trials, is that they eventually give some use to areas which are not visited by many players because they don't give passive point rewards. like crypt, maze or crematorium.

^This

The trials are clearly a way to make players visit area's abandoned for over a year if not longer by a big portion of the community.

This is reasonable, if we assume these zones are still designed to kill players.(from a design perspective)

Peace,

-Boem-

I mean, I consider this a nice side benefit, but strongarming players to visit areas they wouldn't voluntarily visit otherwise wouldn't be anywhere near my "top x reasons" for implementing any form of new content.

Plus, per my suggestion on the previous page, these areas would be visited more than default anyway.

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Boem wrote:

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vio wrote:

imho the best use, beside the introductory nature of the trials, is that they eventually give some use to areas which are not visited by many players because they don't give passive point rewards. like crypt, maze or crematorium.

^This

The trials are clearly a way to make players visit area's abandoned for over a year if not longer by a big portion of the community.

This is reasonable, if we assume these zones are still designed to kill players.(from a design perspective)

Peace,

-Boem-

This is the problem with GGG's general approach to "carrot and stick"

They think that forcing someone to do something they don't like in order to get something they want is a carrot, when really it's a stick.

Those areas are abandoned for a good reason. They're BO-RINGGG and have poor mob density and generally crappy drops. Actually if the mob density were better, it would be less boring, so 2 birds there.

Lately there have been calls to nerf dried lake to make other areas more appealing. NO NO NO!

You make the other areas more appealing by making them BETTER, not by making everyone's favorite 65-75 leveling zone into crap!

The first time I went through them, I appreciated them as a simple tutorial. They aren't very hard, and they show you some of the traps you're going to encounter. Mind you they don't show enough, I was seriously confused the first time I saw a flying blade sentinel and thought I had encountered a glitch.

The problem is that a player only needs to play a tutorial once. Making them play a tutorial 3 times per character is utterly ridiculous. There has got to be a better way of unlocking the Labyrinth. Personally, I would have a different unlock method, then taken all of the Trials and convert them into the first part of the Labyrinth. Play through the "tutorial" area, fight Izaro, then everything fro there onward is RNG.

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Boem wrote:

This is reasonable, if we assume these zones are still designed to kill players.(from a design perspective)

I'm starting to feel like the only sane person who stepped into an asylum. You do realize that no serious game, not even games like Dark Souls, are designed with "defeat the player" as a design philosophy, right? Short of rom-hacks made by sadists, designing for difficulty means designing a challenge that you want the player to overcome. Otherwise you're not a game designer, you're a prick with a superiority complex.

@Aku: I mostly agreed with you earlier. I think "have players see things they wouldn't otherwise see" is a benefit, but when the cost is "by strongarming them," well, that's using stick to get that benefit.

It should go without saying that using stick is a pretty big drawback... one usually bigger than whichever benefit one is trying to achieve.

I disagree with the fact that they are trying to get players to go into zones they normally wouldn't go for a couple of reasons.

3 of the 6 trials are located in compulsory areas that every player is very familiar with, The Lower Prison, Chamber of Sins II and the Crematorium. In addition to these, the Crypt is frequently visited as an optional area for those needing to complete the Hand of the Good Man for re-spec points. The Crypt is an optional area, yes, but it is more frequently visited than other optional areas.

There are only 2 of the 6 trials located in areas that players do not visit regularly and there are other areas such as the Dread Thicket that does not have trials. Therefore, I believe that the choice of where these trials are located is dependant on the design of the traps themselves and how their tileset matches the zone. For example, it makes sense to put the burning ground traps in the Crematorium. Some zones make no sense to have traps inside them, particularly the open ones, so they were more stretched for choice of where to put them than you might realise.

Also, even if it was to put players into these optional areas, it is not a very good attempt at doing it and there is reasons people avoid them. If they are totally optional and do not offer and quest rewards such as the Catacombs or Dread Thicket, people aren't going to visit these areas and I'm not sure why you would expect them to. Also the Hedge Maze is a terrible seed layout (it's a maze duh?) and is too dangerous and not good enough XP, which is the same as the Catacombs.

Also forcing people into these areas is not going to achieve anything positive.

So I'm going to be honest that saying that the trials are good because they make people go to unused areas, is an act of desperation to defend the trials when they serve no purpose. Why does GGG emphasise late game content such as getting people into map progression when they want people to mess around in areas they don't want to be in?

Holds literally zero water in my eyes.