Game needs Eternals back (and here's why) |Petition|

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It also crushes dreams of self-crafting competitive items. It crushes dreams of finding high end items extremely well rolled that can reflect their rarity when you sell them. Those two are of higher value than what you say, because they are a constant nuisance that will affect the way you approach the game on a daily basis.

But crafting in PoE has never really been about creating good items just for yourself, regardless of the cost. Because of the ease of access to gear from other players and the rather low drop rate on crafting orbs necessary to complete the task (back when we had eternals) it means that people, especially in temp leagues just get something a bit subpar and call it a day, why grind forever to roll specific items in a linear fashion only for RNG to be able to royally screw you over if you attempt to deviate from the linear path put forward.

Again I think when discussing both eternals and mirrors people need to think of temp leagues, not perm leagues where they may have introduced new top tier mods and bases, but those mods\bases aren't worth the additional cost really to craft, yet the league still is flooded with many mirrored items, at this point standard is beyond consideration and should NOT be holding back temp leagues at all. Hell people already crafted a new top tier bow if I can recall with the horded eternals that remained after the "removal"

Instead of focusing on what the affects are on perm leagues, can we please focus on what matters, temp leagues. This is coming from someone that played perm league for about a year and then did 50% perm and 50% temp league for another 6 months. I simply feel like at this point its such a let down that crafting has to be done in a specific way and that the game revolves around basically chaos and exalts and nothing really else because of the removal of eternals.

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This is all the same argument(no mirrors = no gg gear), and it is better solved by boosting drop rates. I already told you to keep that in mind before posting. Imagine if they doubled exalted drop rate and quadrupled eternal drop rate. What, i believe the cost for a 6t1 is something like 600-800ex or so i was told once, but could be wrong. With those drop rates the value is closer to 250ex. What is the real benefit of doing that instead? Diversity, individuality, that more people get to craft and dare to craft, instead of void zoned crafting and the same few guys in monopoly. That people have more fun, that shorter leagues are more attractive over perm leagues, that the game doesn't feel insanely unrewarding.

Boosting drop rates, specifically of crafting orbs just means crafting something is that much less special. If everyone has the ability to craft all of their gear (not saying that would be the case) then where does the looting aspect from the ARPG come from, just finding rares inbetween, I mean at this point people rarely self upgrade items and just get something from poe.trade that is exactly or close to what they want in that slot.

You make it seem like only rich people in standard used to craft with eternals, while that might be the single largest use of those orbs, they had multiple purposes in temp leagues as well. Masters used to be better balanced because specific mods costed eternals instead of exalts, crafting rare armors or crit weapons used to allow for people to dump some currency into a chest, instead of just chaos spamming until you hit whatever is reasonable enough, this is even more important now that they added multiple 6 link chest pieces, but now its just chaos spam because anything else is just throwing exalts away without being able to save what progress you made when crafting that item.

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First of all if almost no one is negatively affected by mirrors(assuming they have negative side effects), then only no one would reap the positive effects (early you claim mirrors + eternals = great items in short leages). Clearly you mold your argument to suit your opinion. That said, i don't think mirrors has much of a negative effect on shorter leagues myself.

However it is outright wrong to claim that only those who wish to compete with big dogs over crafting monopoly will pay negatively. God, just go through this thread and see how i myself or many others have brought of up negatives of mirrors, such as that crafting is practically dead, monopoly situations, crushing of dreams, everyone is identical, etc..

Great items is different then perfect items, it enables someone in a temp league to create a weapon or item that they can share with others, I guess the downside to this in previous temp leagues was GGG enabling players to make a substantial amount of money and there have been a few nearly perfect items crafted in temp leagues, but those were leagues that enabled people to make a CRAZY amount of currency.

Crafting is dead because the removal of eternals, why on earth would you blame mirrors for that. People crafted items when they had the ability to save the progress, why on earth would anyone attempt to craft something now when they can exalt on thorns and take something that has the potential of being insane and just make it "ok" in temp leagues people start these projects and just multimod and finish that way because those can be removed and it can be finished later, but I mean come on now mirrors don't prevent people from crafting now, lack of eternals do.

Who cares if people have monopoly on items in STANDARD, this shouldn't even be part of the discussion at hand, ignore standard, just like GGG ignores standard and don't let the rest of the game suffer because of what people in standard have done to themselves.

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MatrixFactor wrote:

In the current meta we are able to hit 5t1 items using the master scouring method.

Which should cost eternals, not this bullshit everything cost exalts stuff....

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Ashen_Shugar_IV wrote:

So someone beats me by crafting the best "X" first....
I actually see that as a blessing and here are a few reasons why:

• I can now acquire "X" for a fraction of the crafting cost assuming the crafter wishes to subsidize their expenses/fund new crafts by offering a mirror service

And what is the percentage of the player base for which that matters? 5%? 2%? Remember that like 40% of players do not even reach maps, according to GGG. It is only beneficial for the very top end of the player base. And usually, in game design, you want to make sure that the top end and the middle/bottom end of the player base do not drift too far apart. Why? Because that generates balancing problems.

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Ashen_Shugar_IV wrote:

[li]Monopoly is a bit of a strong word. If fee's are too high people will not pay, and the market will shift back towards those 80% gggg rares. Yay economy![/li][/list]

No. Why? Because those 80% rares do not exist. I have a bow that is less than 40% of the top-end bow and I had to pay 10 exalt for it (5linked, not 6linked). For about 80 exalt, you get a maybe 50%-of-the-best bow. 80% bows? Do not exist, and if you craft one it is pointless, because its value doesn't reflect its rarity.

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Ashen_Shugar_IV wrote:

[li]Take a look at all the mirror services in Standard. How many of the crafters have multiple items on offer? This suggests to me that proceeds often fund new crafts facilitating point 1 above[/li][/list]

Yes, it makes a small elite ridiculously rich.

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Ashen_Shugar_IV wrote:

Few players (would) mirror every slot

Actually, few players even have a single mirrored item.

BTW, mirrors are way too cheap for their rarity and their actual value, as were Eternals. Why? Because if you own 3 Exalt and get a mirror drop, you can be "rich" compared to what you had before. And gear yourself better than with a single mirrored item (besides the fact that you cannot pay the mirror fee). Also, in temp leagues Mirrors are not exactly worth much for temp league players, which makes them cheap.

I only read through the first 6 or 7 pages, but here's where I am coming from.

Back when Eternals were 4ex each, I had the dream of eventually crafting some stuff for myself. Was going to start with a chest or weapon. These were long term goals and I was honestly motivated by them.

My desire to play the game has greatly diminished ever since their removal. This is not 100% on Eternals as I feel the general game direction has put a bad taste in my mouth, but lacking a long term crafting/gearing goal definitely didn't help.

Perfect (or near perfect) rares are super cool and should still be obtainable. Back then, I was estimating it to cost around 100ex to craft a single, near perfect piece of armor. Weapons would have been noticeably more, but the feeling of owning a self-crafted piece with 6 T1s or 5T1s is unparalleled. I bet I'd play a lot more if this were still possible.

I'd also support removing Mirrors and having more Exalts/Eternals drop.

At the end of the day though, I personally think that end-game crafting is a great feature and I don't give two shits about economy, so I know that GGG and I probably don't see eye to eye. But there's no doubt I'd play more, and if there's enough of us that feel that way, GGG should at least consider our reasoning.

@ggnorethx: I suggest you read my post on page 13 about how to use master crafting to simulate Eternals. End-game crafting is still very real, it's just nerfed a bit from Eternal levels, and involves looking at prefixes and suffixes differently.

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ScrotieMcB wrote:

@ggnorethx: I suggest you read my post on page 13 about how to use master crafting to simulate Eternals. End-game crafting is still very real, it's just nerfed a bit from Eternal levels, and involves looking at prefixes and suffixes differently.

And revolves completely around 1 endgame orb, such diversity, much wow.

Well, on that I can agree. I think the Prefixes/Suffixes Cannot Be Changed mods should be priced in Divines; they're a rarer Orb than Exalts by drop rate, and deserve to be worth more than they are.

I think Multiple Crafted Mods should keep its current price in Exalts, though.

We really don't need, or want, Eternals back, in any case.

signed

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ScrotieMcB wrote:

Well, on that I can agree. I think the Prefixes/Suffixes Cannot Be Changed mods should be priced in Divines; they're a rarer Orb than Exalts by drop rate, and deserve to be worth more than they are.

I think Multiple Crafted Mods should keep its current price in Exalts, though.

We really don't need, or want, Eternals back, in any case.

Those should be more expensive, not less so. The price of a divine, while it might be rarer then an exalt rarely exceeds or even meets the price of one. Not to mention its price is capped by the ability to farm tabulas and vendor them.

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ScrotieMcB wrote:

Well, on that I can agree. I think the Prefixes/Suffixes Cannot Be Changed mods should be priced in Divines; they're a rarer Orb than Exalts by drop rate, and deserve to be worth more than they are.

I think Multiple Crafted Mods should keep its current price in Exalts, though.

We really don't need, or want, Eternals back, in any case.

I'd so love this, personally.

The 'find 4 exalts' gap between rerolling the suffixes on part-crafted items is a bit long for the non-trader.

Divines, while rarer drop-wise than exalts, can be farmed quicker via other methods at the same time as finding the now 2 exalts required and would essentially half the time between rerolls.

Eternals on the other hand, yeah, they don't drop (when they did), they get effectively stolen from lottery winning peons or not at all.

best time i had in this game was when i gathered 4-5 stash tabs full of alts, tons of augments, lots of scours and regals, and started to create my CI gear.....vaal regalia, hubris, titanium shield......then i crafted all those and i was happy with the game.....i didnt finish all of them but i got to like 4-5 T1 on each of those......then they removed eternals......

i agree my char would be to OP for the content, but that is just because there is no actual never ending content for high lvl people

i really really enjoyed gathering all those materials for that crafting.....


people that say eternals are bad are just jealous at people that have time and will to enjoy that part of the game.....there are so many aspects in this game every casual can enjoy that doesn't interfere with more hardcore player base

just because it is in the game, doesn't mean you are entitled to it for almost 0 effort