Donald Trump

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SkyCore wrote:

Ask 10 close friends/family to precisely define their morality. Then ask questions of morality of situations which dont fall within what they stated. I think you will find that 99.99% of people cannot give a complete, consistent, and non contradictory definition. And i guarantee none of them will say the exact same thing provided you ask about several exotic scenarios and fringe cases.

I guess i can see how one can generalize all morality as a 'thing'. And that would be a classification. Is a classification real and true? Eh. I dont think so.

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deathflower wrote:

Real implies it can exist independently without people. Morality is a construct of people's imagination, it is created in people mind. Thus It could be considered a work of fiction.

well, its just not really a valid way to look at the concepts. Its like asking how loud the number 2 is or what the colour green tastes like, it doesnt rly make sense to think of those concepts in that sort of framework.

Where is my snow, Trump? Global Warming doesn't exist, yea? Did I not pray hard enough to the snow gawd's? How sad. NY gets it but NS doesn't...Americans hogging all the snow now... oh well. I'll go back to my igloo's resting spot.

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Snorkle_uk wrote:

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DalaiLama wrote:

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Snorkle_uk wrote:

I literally just used the wording you used, this is almost exactly what you said in the post I quoted from you, nice too see you arguing against it now, thats very christian (no sarcasm sadly).

No, you didn't.

Here is what I had posted:

If you have ever raised children, than you know that a firm but loving guiding hand must be used to help properly shape their future. It isn't out of hate that a parent restricts their child from eating candy all day long. It isn't out of hate that a parent coerces their child to do homework. It isn't out of hate that a parent grounds their child when they do something wrong. The parent's efforts are directed towards HELPING the child become a better person.

Trump's goals are likewise. It isn't out of Hate that he wants to enforce immigration laws. It isn't out of Hate that he wants to strengthen America's economy etc.

this is also what you posted...

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Like the unruly teenager throwing a temper tantrum after being grounded, America's leftists are very unhappy that they may have to live by some rules that are for their own good.

Live by rules - not have their thought or speech controlled. The rules for their own good are not ones telling them how to behave, what they can say etc. They are things that for the most place were already on the books as laws - like illegal immigration - but not enforced. They are things like not using the IRS to prosecute (using audits) political groups and their sponsors because they are have a viewpoint that is anti-leftists. They are things like honest environmental impact studies, rather than delaying things forever in an effort to shut a project down. They include things like arresting protestors and charging them as rioters when they begin destroying things and harming people. They include things like prosecuting mayors and city councils for sanctuary city violations.

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Snorkle_uk wrote:

and you have started talking about immigration laws etc, when actually we were talking about gay rights, but you seem unable to actually focus on that and would rather dodge the subject.

They were to help you see the broader picture, to give some perspective, to help notice the trend.

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Snorkle_uk wrote:

Actually I know what a Christian is

You have an opinion on this, and it is an opinion that does not match that of the billion plus people who are Christian.

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Snorkle_uk wrote:

Its not whatever someone wants it to be, it is a defined thing that exists outside of what an individual wants it to be

It is defined by the billion plus people who are Christian, and by the generations before them for 2,000 years. I realize that you want it to be 100% Old Testament application in literal terms, because that makes it an easy target. It is not that, though, and portraying it that way is called a strawman logical fallacy.

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Snorkle_uk wrote:

If you believe there is an actual God and this God has sent his (its got a gender lol) son (seriously?)

You are the one saying they must be a literal interpretation - and the prayer taught by Jesus starts out: Our Father...
Maybe you haven't heard it before? If so, that would explain a lot.

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Snorkle_uk wrote:

and other representatives to earth to tell human beings how they should live their lives, how can you then turn around and say

Because that is what God - in the form of Jesus, explicitly taught:

"Then the scribes and the Pharisees brought a woman who had been caught in adultery and made her stand in the middle.

They said to him, “Teacher, this woman was caught in the very act of committing adultery. Now in the law, Moses commanded us to stone such women. So what do you say?” They said this to test him, so that they could have some charge to bring against him.

Jesus bent down and began to write on the ground with his finger. But when they continued asking him, he straightened up and said to them, “Let the one among you who is without sin be the first to throw a stone at her.”

Again he bent down and wrote on the ground. And in response, they went away one by one, beginning with the elders. So he was left alone with the woman before him.

Then Jesus straightened up and said to her, “Woman, where are they? Has no one condemned you?” She replied, “No one, sir.” Then Jesus said, “Neither do I condemn you. Go.”

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Snorkle_uk wrote:

"yeah... Ill take these bits of it but push these other bits aside."?

Then Peter approaching asked him, “Lord, if my brother sins against me, how often must I forgive him? As many as seven times?” Jesus answered, “I say to you, not seven times but seventy-seven times.

If you truly wish to find fault with Christians, it should be for when they (we) don't adhere to this forgiveness. It is not an easy path to follow, and being human, we struggle and at times falter.

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Snorkle_uk wrote:

But this was not my point, the point that you people started challenging was that someone posted gay rights were under threat with Trump in power and my assertion that this was ultimately down to Christians and not Trump himself, and as long as you have orthodox Christians having a big say in laws then gay peoples rights will always be in danger.

Again, we come to the central problem - which is a lack of understanding. Had you been attending church, you would not find a message about persecuting people who are gay. That message has not been in vogue for well over 25 years. There is a fringe element that believes persecution is the answer, but I think if you sat down and talked with a large variety of Christians, you would find that they are far more progressive than portrayed by the media.

People are shaped by their life experiences, both good and bad. People are shaped by their culture. A person is a collection of memories, thoughts and beliefs, not a crystal of one single idea.

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Snorkle_uk wrote:

I do personally believe that religion is a plague on the minds of humanity that should be removed, and when pushed I will not hide it

You are just as entitled to your opinion of religion as I am to believe it. You shouldn't have to hide your opinion of it, though you may find a few *might* be critical of you because of it, the same way you or others *might* be critical of them for believing, as the saying goes:

As ye judge, so shall ye be judged.

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Snorkle_uk wrote:

no way a person who believes that is going to have enough credibility with me to change my views

I don't want you to change your views. I do appreciate you being candid. We disagree on a subject and there's nothing wrong with that.

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Snorkle_uk wrote:

well, its just not really a valid way to look at the concepts. Its like asking how loud the number 2 is

I've heard some pretty loud number 2's. The pitfalls of public restrooms.

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Snorkle_uk wrote:

or what the colour green tastes like

Mint? Lime? Guac? Or it could be bitter like bile. There's a reason companies add green food coloring to certain foods, and it makes sense to the people who buy them, else they would have purple pistachio ice cream.

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or what the color green tastes like

I know someone that has synesthesia (supposedly). Sees smells as colors. I always ask what color do they see in a public restroom. Dark brown. Makes sense. That's why I'm skeptical.

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Snorkle_uk wrote:

Actually I know what a Christian is and have every right to tell someone if they are a Christian or not.

(...)

If you believe there is an actual God and this God has sent his (its got a gender lol) son (seriously?) and other representatives to earth to tell human beings how they should live their lives

(...)

In my opinion, my world in my head, religion cannot be justified by its utilitarian value, on any level. It is either true or it isnt within the acceptable realms of proof.

Nope, you have no clue what a Christian is. You've proved that over and over again. But that's ok, I won't hold that against you. Just keep in mind that what you know of Christianity is very, very limited, to the point of being incorrect. But feel free to prove me wrong and describe what it truly means to be a Christian. :-)

In actual thread related news, Trump has appointed Nikki Haley as UN envoy, and Betsy DeVos for Sec. Education. Much to the exasperation of Elizabeth Warren, they're both white males according to CNN/NYT reports.

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innervation wrote:

Christians can't even decide on a definition of Christianity given that they've spent the better part of ~1600 years excommunicating each other, and warring over doctrinal differences. Someone disagrees with you? They're tragically under-informed. Guess they haven't gotten their revelation of truth yet. (that's your cue to say 'no no no it's revealed to everyone, they just refuse to accept it')

Wrapping text in spoiler tags doesn't magically give you justification to be hypocritical about your own claims of "off topic". After all, the Donald Trump thread is in the forum "Off Topic", lol.

As for Christians, the Bible doesn't change. Sure, there are translations and Apocrypha, but the message the is the same regardless of how you word it. What does change is mankind's interpretation of the Bible and the constructs built on top of the Bible. When you get back to the Bible itself, Christianity doesn't have "doctrinal differences".

Pretty OT but do you remember how I jokingly called this forum "Neocuck"? Too real man...

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1319198

Trump realizing he has bigger hands than Obama.



I never got that 'small hands' meme.